Reply by markg — 2020-11-02 06:54:48 GMT

Too much water can result in loose stools, as can other things. As long as the rosy is digesting and not regurgitating, then I would not worry about parasites. Treat the mites and keep the cage dry. Under tank heat, a thermostat and a substrate of aspen or paper works well. If you have a screen top then you can have a water dish in there all the time. But if using a tub, only have water in there when the snake has not fed recently.

Reply by markg — 2020-11-02 06:45:51 GMT

No harlequin. Probably Harquahala, and there is indeed an albino Harquahala rosy strain.

Reply by Osira — 2017-03-23 16:53:47 GMT

Thank you! What a beast of a male you had!

Reply by racrouc — 2017-03-21 02:05:41 GMT

I caught a male coastal rosy in 1975 that was 32 inches. He was 36 inches when he died 29 years and 3 month later. The picture looks to be a male probing can verify sex.

Reply by Osira — 2017-03-17 05:25:05 GMT

In the above post "test" There's a link to my Flickr with boa pics. I hope you guys can find them ok. I'm kinda newish with boas, well keeping them and definitely sexing them. Haha But this boa clearly has spurs. And is a coastal locality. It's also at least 32-33 inches in length and seems girthy to me. It may be because I'm used to seeing Desert boas which I know tend to be smaller, but it seems large for a male to me. And I've hard there are females with spurs among certain localities. What are your thoughts on this?

Reply by markg — 2017-02-03 20:11:21 GMT

Great, I am glad for you. Rosies always come around, it just takes time for some of them.

Reply by nella1987sb — 2017-02-02 01:36:44 GMT

Thanks so much to everyone who weighed in. All neos are now feeding and doing great, and I'm excited to start sending them out to new homes.

Just for fun, a pic of Dad.

Reply by markg — 2016-12-16 19:43:34 GMT

Yeah, baby rosies can be a pain, they are not like colubrids which just either eat or don't eat. Rosies have to be coaxed sometimes.

If feeding thawed pinks, warm them up. Rosies do not like thawed food cold.

Many rosy babies will not take thawed period. I have found with warming and trying time and time again, many will give in and eat, but it can be frustrating. Babies can go a long time without food, so they can afford to be picky at first.

Usually baby rosies will eat live prey immediately. If a baby rosy does not eat, perhaps it is that it is Winter and they instinctively refuse food. I cool them down to 65 deg when that happens. In Feb I warm them, and they usually eat willingly soon after, and often thawed food at that.

In my experience, it seems baby rosies like fuzzies rather than pinks. You would be surprised how a tiny rosy can eat a fuzzy no problem.

I have a few adult rosies that were real pains as babies, and now they will eat your hands. So be patient.

Reply by nella1987sb — 2016-12-12 17:54:37 GMT

Thanks for the info! Any tips on getting them feeding? I have two that didn't feed on the first try. despite braining.

Reply by markg — 2016-12-12 08:34:32 GMT

Rosies do not do well if kept in elevated humidity for too long, like for weeks on end.

As long as you avoid that scenario, the babies will do fine.

The type of caging used, the size of the water bowl relative to the cage, where you live - it all factors in.

I find that my rosies will often drink a little when I first put water in their cage. Mine seem to avoid water after it has been standing for more than a day. For that reason, I made it a practice to just leave it in for a day or two, then remove it for the next 5-6 days. That formula has worked well for the rosies here, and it makes it easy for me, so I stick with that routine.

Reply by nella1987sb — 2016-12-05 16:30:42 GMT

Thank you so much for your response.

Reply by racrouc — 2016-12-05 14:52:45 GMT

I have kept rosy boas since 1975 and always keep a small bowl with water. I've had adult wild caught live over 29 years and wild caught deserts live over 28 years.

Take care

Reply by markg — 2016-08-16 06:08:13 GMT

When did you try to breed them? How long did you leave them together? Are they related?

Is the male a definite male? Usually, female rosies that are mature will be a bit (sometimes quite a bit) larger than males of the same type. Not always but usually. May depend on locality for that.

Timing is important. I have always housed them together during Spring for best results. After the male breeds the female, he will often coil up on the cool side of the cage the next morning. That is when I know they have bred. Otherwise I would not always know - they are not always quick to breed when first introduced.

Also, for success, the female needs lots of food prior to breeding. Once gravid, she needs a nice toasty 88-90 deg F belly heat source constantly available.

Reply by Ameron — 2015-11-11 17:43:37 GMT

My boa is now using her rock pile more often. Comprised of 7 rocks, it is almost a foot high, and occupies about 25% of her vivarium at the right corner. It has a cave-like cavity where she can hide in low light.

She still very much loves to move around often, and is surprisingly active - for both a boa and a female. (My males usually tended to be much more active than females, across species.)

I'm really glad that I do not use an under-tank heater. They tend to encourage the snake to stay in that spot only, usually concealed. Overhead basking mimics natural sunlight and encourages my snake to be seen much more often.

My design strategy works - and I get my reward. She's out & about right now. Happy Herper! (;

Reply by markg — 2015-11-09 18:08:43 GMT

Not all snakes are rosies obviously. Some snakes are very mobile in nature, as their body shapes show, and do cover distance in the wild way more than snakes that live in a network of tunnels and crevices. Those mobile species need room. I agree with you there for sure. Keepers need to be knowledgeable of the species and be fair in their offerings of enclosures.

In nature, snakes do a good deal of avoiding nature - the part of nature they do not want. Inclement weather is handled by retreating somewhere. Dry conditions are met by staying under things that reduce evaporation from the snake. You get the picture. They are selective about what part of nature they use.

Regarding your rosy ignoring the rock pile. I have tried that too years ago. It was not used much at all. I had a CHE above the rocks. That particular rosy usually stayed under a piece of newspaper I put in there next to the rocks. Then I moved the rocks out and put in some more newspaper to cover a wider area under the heat and extending out. I rarely saw the snake - she stayed under the paper. Her feeding response became even more pronounced. My thought is that although the rocks look more natural, it was the newspaper/heat/substrate combo that better matched what the snake was looking for. Humans may be drawn to ambiance, but I think snakes are drawn to functional conditions. They are happy to use anything that gives them what they want, whether it be plastic, paper, whatever. They have no concept of "looks". If you can make functional and look good, awesome.

Reply by Ameron — 2015-11-07 16:14:05 GMT

I understand, and acknowledge, what you state. I also know that a child has a different mental capacity than that of an animal - particularly that of a reptile. However, keep in mind that NO serious, long-term studies of reptile intelligence have been done. Proper intelligence testing must also be done with a Reptilian format & expected end result - not the same processes used for mammals. I know of one Gray Parrot with a larger vocabulary than that of many "Human" teenagers.

I disagree, however, with many Keepers about snake attitudes. I feel strongly, based on my experience, that reptiles LOVE naturalistic setups - whether or not plants are fake. They like being concealed, true, but only part of the time. They also like variety (all life forms seem to have this in common, even starfishes) and enjoy new things and exploration.

My adult female, which I suspect was wild-caught & poached, has two hide spots. One is a rock pile - just like she'd have in nature. She spends LITTLE time in either. Day & night, I usually see her on the branches, either basking or climbing around. (In the wild, their home range is at least 3-5 acres, one of the smallest ranges known for a snake. Rat snake home ranges can exceed 17 acres.)

I think that housing setup, accessories & space matter very much - with any captive. I also think that the common practice of a housing setup with only a hide box and water dish, with no branches, is a recipe for an unhealthy & bored reptile. In that scenario, it's only activity, it's only "fun", is to eat a frozen-thawed rodent every week or two. (That same existence for any Human would likely result in insanity, death - or a breakout.)

What I'd like to convey to other Herpers is this: How would I want to be treated as a captive? What considerations & accessories, along with outside exercise, would I want??

Reply by markg — 2015-11-06 20:21:57 GMT

Well, a rosyboa does not have quite the mental capacity of a child, but I get what you are saying. Look at the rosy body shape - they are not meant for distance travel. They are meant for friction on the ground but smooth sailing through tunnels and crevices. They are built for the ability to grab prey while in a resting position, or even in a tunnel. That is the body shape.

Humans are built for distance coverage. Two legs is for energy-conserving locomotion for covering general distance. Not the fastest in a straight line - 4-legs with a high center of mass is much faster. So, a human and a snake, especially a heavy-bodies snake, are by no means in the same realm of needing the same kind/amount of exercise.

If a keeper really wants to stimulate the mind of a rosy, my advice would be a cage with tunnels, perhaps like PVC with elbows and all. Or hides that are somewhat low in height and dark and connected. But a cage with some aspen, a few hides that have lots of room in them height-wise, some branches, etc - that does little for a rosyboa. They want to "feel" the hide on all sides. They want a small opening to stick their head out but otherwise remain concealed in a lie-and-wait predatory mode, or they want to crawl in a hole and find a rodent nest. They want cover. They want to be inside stuff, not on branches. You can take them out and let them crawl for exercise. In the cage, they want to be mostly concealed. They are really happy that way.

Reply by Ameron — 2015-11-06 13:59:43 GMT

Your child is sitting at the TV, bored. He or she has been lethargic all day. You suddenly disturb them and make them go outside for some exercise. They resist at first, as a knee-jerk reaction. A few moments later, however, they are dashing around, laughing & playing.

When you say that it's time to go back inside, they resist. They want to play longer - now that you have aroused them and encouraged them to do so. (Positive behavior must often be encouraged.)

Same thing with my snakes. I see this time & again. When I encourage activity, they respond favorably. When put back into their habitat, they are active for at least 30-60 minutes, as they wind down. It's a dramatic change from their behavior just moments earlier when they had nothing to do and no incentive to explore.

Is the lethargic kid at the TV set as happy as the one who was roused and encouraged to be active? I don't think so. I'd love to see this theory tested in clinical tests.

Reply by markg — 2015-11-02 18:34:44 GMT

I appreciate the dialogue, Ameron. You were right - I try to spread info that I think is beneficial for the animals. Me coming across as a know-it-all is an unfortunate side-effect. No hard feelings I hope!

I guess the best approach is to look at things from the perspective of the animal. Rosies live in habitats where they conserve water by preventing evaporation and usually avoiding conditions of high evaporation rate. Coupled with the ability to warm up without drying out too quickly. All good stuff for them. As long as we provide them with the ability to do that, then they are good.

So if my cages are different than yours, all fine if the snakes can do what they need to do. Good discussion.

I still disagree with your active snake = more happy. Agree to disagree

Reply by Ameron — 2015-10-31 15:11:55 GMT

If a Martian or other race suddenly usurped power and somehow enslaved Humanity as pets, how would I want to be kept & treated? With one hide box and a water dish - our equivalent of a tiny closet with a wash basin? On paper towels? With minimal accessories? At the very least, I'd want to be kept in a small gymnasium, with many accessories and much space to exercise. I'd absolutely need a variety of diet, clean (not tap) water and exercise to be happy. (If I also had the option of interacting with a more intelligent, more powerful Being, expanding my sphere of understanding and increasing my home range - I'd jump at the chance, and would establish a mutually beneficial relationship right away!)

RIGHT NOW, my boa is climbing all over her biome. She has been active for hours. She refused food yesterday, so she's not hungry. She has both a warm & cool area, and a rock pile with a concealed cave cavity. She does NOT stay still. She is NOT waiting for her next meal (like a Veg Head on a couch, watching television). She is actively exploring her home, and enjoying it, because my basic design allows & encourages her to.

In conclusion, I was mostly challenging the myth that having water in the enclosure would cause a knee-jerk regurgitation. So far, my soak pool has had no effect. The benefit is that it provides a place for my snake to purge itself of all mites or ticks, if ever infested. (Mites & ticks breath air, via their exoskeleton "skin". A 30-minute soak in water drowns them and completely disinfects the soaking snake itself.)

I look forward to your future pots & replies, and I appreciate your time & engagement.

Don in Vancouver, WA
Network Engineer, 55 (Explorer, Discoverer, Herpetologist, Naturalist, Writer)

1.0 Lampropeltis getula splendida
1.0 Terrapene carolina carolina
1.0 Terrapene carolina triangus
0.1 Lichurana trivirgata trivirgata

Reply by Ameron — 2015-10-31 15:11:28 GMT

Whenever I have gotten a new snake from a pet store or other source, they typically come from a 20-gallon setup with one hide box and water dish. (No hard surfaces to rub against to aid in shedding.) When placed into my naturalistic vivarium setups, with rocks, branches, soak pool and space, they seem DELIGHTED! They explore for hours, usually for about 3-5, the record is over 8 hours.

I change my vivarium setup often, moving some rocks or branches - or doing an entirely new setup that I enjoy even more. When I make any changes, my snakes notice right away. They go to that spot and sniff for as long as 30 minutes. They are keenly aware of additions, removals or changes to their setup, and they like variety. (Just like we do.)

* In general, reptiles & other animals are much more intelligent than most people think. Elephants communicate via low-frequency sounds in a structured language. In ideal conditions, they can communicate for up to 150 miles. Kingsnakes have been seen luring birds out in the open, exposing themselves to temporary attack, to learn in which trees the parent birds nest. They then immediately seek that tree to attack the nest, saving themselves much time away from ital-and-error stalking. Horned lizards have been found sleeping under the sand with their arms around each other. Rattlesnakes have complex social relationships; at favored den & basking sites they have separate areas for each sex or age group. I've seen a juvenile Russian Ratsnake learn an escape route down a large shrub with many branches within seconds. He then duplicated that exact route when placed back in that shrub later. *

Enclosure size & setup? That is a VERY individual decision. I'm not any better than any other Herper because I use a naturalistic setup. Rather, what I try to convey to other Keepers (Breeders have other needs & considerations, I understand) is that I defer back to the Golden Rule: Do unto other as you would have them do unto you.

Reply by Ameron — 2015-10-31 15:10:16 GMT

I've seen you post often in the past, and I sense that you aim to help spread useful knowledge on this forum. I'm grateful for your reply.

One of my lifetime dilemmas is that I'm often misperceived. My thought processes sometimes differ from those of other persons, or, I may be looking at the scenario from a broader or deeper perspective. I'm much more experienced & savvy than I seem to be. (I"ve personally explored much of western North America, and I've studied & researched both the natural & social worlds around me for decades.)

I'm very aware of Rosy Boa general habits, and of their subterranean tendencies. I was mainly pointing out two things:

1. Water in my setup did not result in regurgitation after feeding- as I expected.
2. My ground-dwelling boa loves to climb - like my former Nelson's Milksnake, and many other snakes.

However, before you & I proceed with this discussion any further, it's important to acknowledge a profound truth about this topic:

* Little is known about Rosy Boa behavior in the wild - especially regarding locale-specific behavior. *
(I have only found one documented field study, with minimal information.)

Rosy Boas are highly adaptable animals, thus I would expect different behavior, and maybe even prey preference differences, from location to location. Much prime habitat lacks climbing material, but other habitat does not. As I did recent research online about scarring & sexing, I noticed many photos showing boas climbing on rocks, or up slopes. It's natural to assume that they also climb on low shrubs & trees, in search of bird nestlings or lizards, especially as juveniles. (Ironwood, Cat claw & Mesquite are all common in their home range.)

(CONTINUED)

Reply by markg — 2015-10-30 23:51:01 GMT

4. In the wild rosies can live in some areas where standing water is rather rare. Rosies adapt by conserving moisture. They avoid drying conditions. For example, warming up under rocks or in burrows is less drying than warming up in the open air. Crawling at night is less drying than during the middle of the day.

If the cage is prone to drying, like with the use of overhead lights and a screen top, then constant water in the cage may not be an issue for even a rosyboa. For a more closed cage, the use of a water bowl should be limited or the water bowl small.

One thing is certain - it is far better for a keeper to err on the side of providing water less often than it is to end up with too much humidity for too long and have the snake regurgitate. Not drinking for a week is nothing for a rosy - no problem. Regurgitating on the other hand is traumatic and leads to real issues, like a reduction of good bacteria in the gut leading to further regurges. Given the two scenarios, it is far better to offer water less often. I have been keeping rosies a long time. Regurgitation is preventable, and it is the last thing you want to happen especially when it is caused by the fallacy that snakes need water 24/7.

This was a good post by you, as it is a seed for discussion. One last comment:
Keeping one rosy is one thing. It is when a keeper breeds them and attempts to have the results be nice fat healthy babies that attention to detail is important. One learns alot that way. I can tell you from experience that the best results for me have occurred in setups different than setups one often sees on youtube with all of the decorations. A cage where a rosy hides much of the time is IMO better. A snake on the move all of the time is either hungry or wants to breed or is trying to find better conditions. When you have a cage where the snake is active only when hungry or looking for a mate but is otherwise hiding - that is when you know the cage is more effective.

Reply by markg — 2015-12-07 17:30:50 GMT

Glad it worked out!

Reply by janome — 2015-11-09 00:58:43 GMT

Thanks for the help. I got a night heat light that is helping. The other items are not in budget. I'm also feeding smaller food item. No regurging!

Reply by markg — 2015-10-26 03:30:26 GMT

Here is a very simple yet effective neonate to small rosy setup. For a larger rosy, use a larger box. I use Cambro polycarbonate food pans from Smart & Final.

Soft pine shavings, some newspaper for a hide, and some heat tape. Very minimal yet provides all they need in terms of being able to thermoregulate while hidden.

I only have the water bowl in there for about 1 day per week.

Reply by markg — 2015-10-26 03:13:15 GMT

The reason is the heat source: lights are generally not effective heaters for rosy boas. The air may be warm, but the ground where much of the snake's mass is in contact with may be conducting heat away from the snake. It is like being in a warm room but lying on a cold floor (and being cold-blooded at that). Rosies need warm objects - e.g. the ground, a warm crevice, etc.

You have 2 choices:
1) Use an undertank heat pad with a thermostat. I use soft pine shavings for bedding. The crevices between the chips hold heat very well, and the rosy will nestle in the shavings better than aspen or anything else.

or
2) Use a ceramic heat emitter (CHE). Put enough bedding in the tank so that the heat emitter surface is about 6-7 inches from the bedding. Of course use a temp controller with probe on the bedding below the heater and set for 85. CHE's are way more effective than lights. They direct heat down, and the wavelength of the energy is more like that of a heat pad.

Rosies will regurgitate far sooner than kings and corns and such. Rosies do not need high temps persay - 85 deg hotspot is fine for regular maintenance, but they need that heat available on their bodies, not in the air.

Heating the snake rather than the air will fix the problem.

Reply by RobertPreston — 2019-10-29 14:55:32 GMT

I'm having a similar problem, just not as long term as you. I bought a baby in August. It hadn't even had its first shed when I bought it. A few days after I got it home, it shed. I figured it'd be ready to eat then. I've tried pinkies and mealworms but it just won't eat. It hasn't shed again. I've also tried pieces of pinkies but no luck there, either. Warm end is 85-87, cools down to room temperature (mid-70s) on the other end. I found a few mites on her a month ago so I took her off the aspen shavings and put her on newspaper. I'm about to go back to aspen. She doesn't seem to be otherwise in ill health but she just won't eat. I'm used to ball pythons going on long fasts. I also had some large Burmese that wouldn't eat from October to February. But a snake this size having never eaten in its life concerns me. Any tricks anyone has used? BTW, I have a nice colony of Mediterranean house geckos that live in and around my house. Will they eat baby geckos or pinkies scented with the geckos?

Reply by markg — 2015-10-19 17:25:32 GMT

You received this boa in April, and it was really tiny? With rosies being born in Aug or Sep, one would think a baby would be a bit more sizeable by April. I am just going on your words when you said it was tiny.

I have babies that were born this Aug. They are big enough for fuzzies easily. I have Ariz, Baja, Sonora and California locales. Just giving you an idea of size.

Before you throw in the towel, here are some suggestions:

>Warm end: 83-84 deg (babies do not need warmer)
>Cool end: Less than 80 (down to 65)
>Substrate: Soft pine shavings like 1/2 inch deep to burrow. No, pine is not bad. Aspen is fine to use too.
>Hide: Just some newspaper or similar paper over the substrate.
>Water: Once a week at most for 24 hrs. That is it. More often if the ambient humidity is low, otherwise do not keep water more than 24 hrs.

Too much local humidity for more than a few days is not good for rosies. Babies are more sensitive.

>Food: Rosy babies prefer fuzzies over pinkies, or rat pinks over mouse pinks. They can handle the size typically.

What kind of rosy??? - I had a litter of trivirgata from Baja some years ago, and those things would not feed for anything. I finally cooled them from Oct-Feb. They started eating in Feb with gusto. So that is something else you can try.

Lastly, I don't know Backwater, but I have heard some stuff. Rosies are sensitive snakes (but when kept correctly - e.g. no high humidity, no super cold temps) - they are very strong and robust captives). If the snake was not kept correctly from the beginning, well, you can get this. Or maybe you got a weak one, but then why would they ship a snake that was not in good condition (unless they really do not care..)?

Reply by Ameron — 2015-10-28 00:59:08 GMT

See my late reply above. Mine is likely a female.

I really appreciate your feedback. You defend your assertions with logic, reason & specific examples. So refreshing!

Always learning on the long Herp Road...

Reply by Ameron — 2015-10-28 00:56:24 GMT

I'm convinced that mine is a female.

I also know now to disregard tail comparisons, so useful with Kingsnakes & Ratsnakes. Rosy, Rubber & Sand Boas are just different that way - no comparison.

Mine has very broad, dark stripes. Upper, light stripes are tan, lower body is beige. Belly has dark bars & speckles.

Research from the Internet, and the book, Rosy Boas, Patterns In Time, shows that she most resembles snakes from mid Baja, from San Ignacio on the west to Mulege on the east. (Dark stripes get slimmer by the time you reach Cabo San Lucas.)

She also has considerable scarring on her right side, for over 10 inches, and the extent of the damage suggests other than a single rodent attack. She may be wild-caught.

I'm STILL trying to get decent photos of her scars. If I succeed, I'll post them later.

Reply by AncientDNA — 2015-09-23 16:59:23 GMT

You may have done some research, but none of your examples are from Rosy-specific sites.
IMO, the most accurate way to sex a rosy is a visual inspection of the presence or absence of spurs.
1. No spurs = female
2. Well defined, pointed & curved spurs = male
3. 1 spur, small and/or bulbous spurs = probable female

Probing is problematic with rosies. I have personally seen well-intentioned pet store employees mislabel sex based on incorrect probing.
I've seen a number of posts on the subject on the rosy forums and on Facebook and the majority of experienced rosy-keepers will agree.
I've had nearly 1,000 rosies born since I started breeding them and I can't recall ever being wrong unless the spurs fell into the 3rd category above.
Link

-----
Thanks,
-JC
www.rosyboas.to

Reply by markg — 2015-09-16 17:19:15 GMT

BTW, 34 inches for a Mexican rosy? They are often smaller, especially males. What color is the snake, tan with relatively straight black stripes?

Reply by markg — 2015-09-15 00:33:38 GMT

Post a pic if you can. I say spurs equals male. Also, pet shop employees often do not know.

Reply by markg — 2015-09-15 00:29:07 GMT

With rosies it is not about tail length.

As a guideline, males have spurs, females do not. Yes there have been exceptions, but the exceptions are not common, hence they are exceptions. I have never seen a female with spurs large enough for me to call them spurs. I have heard they exist however.

Female rosies tend to be larger than males. Of course, when you do not have another similar locality animal, the comparison is probably not useful for you.

Like one of the posters said, put 2 rosies together in Spring, you will know what you have.

Reply by markg — 2015-09-15 00:13:56 GMT

I love Whitewaters, normal and albino. Some of mine would bite just like that, holding on.

Reply by GitaBooks — 2015-08-30 00:05:37 GMT

She is beautiful!

The bite looks pretty painful though.

Reply by markg — 2015-03-23 15:58:48 GMT

The most obvious color change happens when a rosy is in shed. Aside from that, I have seen slight differences based on temperature and hydration (hydrated rosies look a tad lighter).

Reply by markg — 2015-02-16 09:39:57 GMT

If I remember correctly, the axanthic Limburg does not produce the really white snows. It is the axanthic Morongo that does a better job of eliminating color. I hope someone can offer additional or more accurate info on the white snow subject, and correct me if I am wrong.

The Limburgs (hets, albinos and axanthics) get nice and big. They feed without trouble and are more tolerant of husbandry mistakes. They originated from a locality that has a bit higher average humidity than the Morongos or Borregos, so they are less sensitive to humidity problems. That is their draw, apart from being beautiful.

I used to breed rosies way back, but nothing like snows. After much trial, I found that they do very well with limited ventilation as long as I did not keep water in the cage more than a day or two at a time. When ambient humidity was moderate, I just did not offer water. When ambient humidity was low, I offered water. Worked very well. I also kept heat on all Winter, though the rest of the cage got into the 50s F.

Some people use screen tops for more ventilation to remedy too much humidity. Make sure you offer a tight hide if doing so. I am not a fan of screen tops for snakes. Too drying. IMO, much simpler to just take out the water bowl. Rosies in the wild do not have burrows with water bowls. They conserve water by avoiding dessicating conditions.

I find rosies to be similar to hognose snakes in temperature preferences. Even they way they feed reminds me of hognose, well except for the constriction. I find that rosies really seemed to like the use of plain packing paper crumpled up. I use packing paper in rolls from Home Depot - it is really just unprinted newspaper. Rosies like to hide under it, with the weight of it on them. You can use aspen too with the paper, or just aspen, or just paper. See what works for yours. My rosies seemed less stressed with paper. In fact, I had to be careful. When in feed mode, they would erupt from under the paper. I got nailed a few times. Rosies have strong jaws believe it or not.

Pic is Whitewater rosy habitat. Beautiful.

Reply by electricbluescat — 2015-10-31 06:15:11 GMT

nice!

Reply by Miloradovich — 2015-01-15 15:21:48 GMT

Wow! Congratulations on a long project come to fruition. Beautiful boa, love the lavender coloration.

Reply by markg — 2014-10-06 18:27:13 GMT

Congrats to you! I appreciate you folks who continue to work with these fantastic snakes.

On a purely aesthetic view, I still think albino rosies are stunning snakes, all of them. And this is coming from me who to this day still loves the look of the butt-ugliest rosies nature has to offer. (Yeah, I like the darkest coastals, they are big, friendly, tolerant, never in a hurry, ugly, but they are beautiful.)

Reply by Mntkingdave — 2014-08-14 00:36:35 GMT

I have been breeding rosies very successfully for 25 years, and I have never dusted food items with supplements. I have always believed for nocturnal reptiles it is critical to feed rodents that have been given a high quality diet, such as Teklad lab pellets. That being said, I don't think dusting would hurt in very small quantities.

Reply by mustacheman5 — 2014-07-18 23:20:04 GMT

Ok. Thank you.

Reply by markg — 2014-07-18 23:07:57 GMT

No, not necessary. I do not think it hurts at all. I used it (with D3) with no issues on rosies. Snakes like rosies are fossorial most of the time, or else usually move at night. I doubt they get much direct sunlight. No, I don't doubt, I know they don't. So sunlight is not used for D3, kind of like our hair does not generate D3 (scales are alot like fingernails or hair) which means D3 is likely not needed in a supplement. Does it hurt to have it? I don't think so. Light dusting won't hurt anything.

I think mine does not have phosphorous. I can't remember that argument, which is better for what. Time for me to google that.

Reply by mustacheman5 — 2014-07-18 19:10:36 GMT

Ok. Thank you. Is vitamin d3 calcium necessary? I have an indoor snake.

Reply by markg — 2014-07-18 18:59:49 GMT

With calcium? Or with vitamins plus calcium? I would not do vitamins at every feeding. Calcium is OK at every feeding.

I used to dust with all snakes species years ago, then I quit. Then I started again. IMO it seems to make a difference in vigor when the diet is thawed mice vs fresh mice.

I do vitamins about once every 3 feedings, and I do a light dust of calcium each feeding. Most probably falls off, but some gets in.

Calcium-supplemented female rosies always produced well for me back in the day. I don't think it is the only difference, but it is part of the overall equation.

Too many vitamins all the time is not good. Better to go sparingly on vits. With sinaloan milks, vits produced nice color. Probably beta-carotene. Just a little goes far.

Reply by markg — 2013-11-28 00:51:34 GMT

Locality. From at least one (if not more) wild caught hypo-ish individuals.

Same happened with Borrego rosies. I have also seen very hypo-ish light-colored rosies from Verbenia Rd that bred true. Have no idea if anyone still breeds the Verbenias.

Reply by markg — 2014-03-03 18:10:13 GMT

Thank you. Nice pics - who is that?

Reply by bluerosy — 2014-01-16 05:54:51 GMT

First off all good job on giving sound advice here mark.

Actually we used to keep rosys in smaller tank than 20gallon with screen lids.But 20's won't hurt for larger female. a lot of us had the best success with the screen top and basic glass gallon type aquaria with watr offere sparingly with the exception of gravid female and neonates.

. All the oldies kept them this in tanks w/ screen lids. I kept kept a collection of over a hundred of rosys for over 30 years like this. Then so did Gary Keelser and today Jerry Hartly still does. Ventilation is important and rosys just don't do well with high humidity and rack systems. They also do better with bottom heat instead of heated rooms or back heat.

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"So I will end with, your now aware of the problem, what YOU do is entirely up to you. Now if you make THIS mistake, its not because you are ignorant."

Frank Retes

Reply by markg — 2013-08-30 23:52:31 GMT

That is awesome. I would love to see the cage.

I always found rosies to be a bit different in needs in comparison to kingsnakes, cornsnakes, pituophis. The thing about rosies is that you can see success or failure pretty quickly. The ability to produce healthy, fat young, or not, is a good indicator. Unhealthy or unhappy rosies typically do not produce well at all.

Reply by tectovaranus — 2013-08-30 18:20:56 GMT

Thanks for the responses.
The habitat shots are great thank you.
I've been keeping and breeding reptiles for over 20 years, mostly varanids and I own a naturalistic fabrication company that designs and builds zoo exhibits all over the country.
I respectfully disagree with your husbandry protocols and my experiences have been quite the opposite of yours.
I'll be providing a fairly small exhibit size equivalent to a 4x2x4tall. Deep natural substrate (dirt sand mix) and will provide a large thermal and humidity gradient.I'll probably get a female to go with the male and let them go year round. Hopefully they will burrow and I'll only see them when they cruise.
Thanks again.

Reply by markg — 2013-08-30 18:10:40 GMT

I urge you to experiment, as you may just find out something. Here is what I found out.

I tried a few different caging strategies out. Im my experience, keep cages somewhat small. A 20 gal long is sufficient for an adult. My rosies fed and bred well when the cage was nothing more than a glass tank with screen top (or plastic cage with ample ventilation), some substrate (aspen or sani chips), a heat pad or ceramic emitter, and some newspaper or packing paper thrown over the top of the substrate. That's it. I tried rock hides, large cages, decorations, racks, etc, and came back to the very simple setups with more ventilation than for a typical kingsnake or cornsnake setup.

Reply by markg — 2013-08-30 18:01:01 GMT

Cool

Reply by markg — 2013-08-30 17:57:43 GMT

Low desert going up into the foothills.

Reply by tectovaranus — 2013-08-27 17:15:13 GMT

cool, I just came over to this forum to see if anyone had any rosy habitat pics from So Cal to share and see this!
Do you have any other habitat shots from this area?
I was just given a rosy (supposedly) from this area and will be building a naturalistic exhibit for him in the next few months, so any habitat shots anyone has would be appreciated.
I have lots of habitat shots from where I've found rosys in the Mojave but none from So. Cal.
Also what are the current rosy books you guys recommend here? I have all the old T.F.H style stuff (Walls) but obviously it's dated.
Thanks!