Hi Tess,

Thanks for your informative and helpful reply. I have been using this observational strategy and have been challenged to find the patterns related to the relapses. Initially I assumed it was due to worms/protozoans because when I changed their water I could smell that familiar parasite smell, (you can even smell this at their coacal area if you get close enough, I learned this from acclimating some wild caught Russian tortoises years ago). Treated with Safeguard and metronidazole and this cleared. The ones that developed the swollen eyes and smelled "wormy" are doing well for the most part, only one of this group has relapsed. Currently, the three affected ones are coming around since I created a humidity hide box, have increased temperature in one part of enclosure, and started a round of Baytril, per my vet. The problem is that for some, the problem recurrs, even in same habitat with essentially the same soaking and burrowing behavior. I have read about the sand problem so one of my enclosures is sand free- sphagnum mixed with cypress bark mulch in a waterland tub. I don't keep snakes or anyother reptiles so mites are out. I have 5.0 Zoomed bulbs 7 inches above substrate, new humidity hide, incandescent bulb over basking area (which they all love), shallow soaking tray (changed daily) I have trained them all to take foods from forceps so I can assure that each gets a proper ration and vitamin supplementation is consistent (dusted superworm 1x per week). They eat mealworms, superworms, earthworms, dandelion greens, occasional chicken necks, an occasional treat of canned cat food and I am going to add frozen mixed vegetables this week per another post. The humidity hide box is new and I am hoping this does the job. So far, everyone appears to be on the mend. I I could figure out how to attach a picture I'd give you a look at the set up and problem.

Thanks so much.

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