Having kept a 5th amendment number of box turtles for many years I can see that you do not know a lot about box turtles. Comparing the reproductive rates of a turtle that takes at LEAST 5-7 years to reach sexual maturity (and that figure is being really generous to be quite honest.) and comparing it to a snake that takes what a year or two to reach reproductive age(not 100% sure native colubrids bore me to be honest with you.) is ridiculous to begin with. This is like comparing Parsons chameleons to Panther chameleons reproductively. Secondly where do you get that multi clutching thing from I have gotten countless clutches of box turtle eggs and have yet to have ANY of my females EVER double clutch much less triple clutch. This is not unique to myself either. There is a huge underground network of people here in florida who breed their box turtles and of the several I know I have never heard of multi clutching and I know one guy personally who could write a freakin book on box turtles he knows so much about them, Knowing full well the reproductive strategy of box turtles I can remember a time several years ago seeing a friend of mine unpack a shipment of adult box turtles for his store(they came from texas btw.) It really horrified me knowing that in spite of your ridiculous arguments those kind of numbers are not sustainable . Do I think total bans collecting are the answer NO absolutely not but to allow comercial collection of box turles is just ludicrous. The other extreme is just as bad here in Fl. people are allowed two box turtles per person per household (any of the T. carolina ssp.-T. ornata are not covered.) and breeding is strongly discouraged(prohibited basically) this eliminates a potential source of box turtles for people in the form of babies which is where actual predation should be taking place not with adults which of course leads to the ridiculousness of the 4" rule. You are right box turtles are killed on roads and by predation,( here in fl. the number one killer is bulldozers) but to use those as an excuse for taking an unreasonable number of animals out of a population is just plain stupid.

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