Well that was snarky.



While I am not going to assume whether Jon's intention of posting was to be snarky/unpleasant, he was correct on both accounts.



You clearly misspoke when you thought that combining an Eastern with a Western would be an intergrade instead of a hybrid. They are clearly two completely different species, the Easterns are classified as Heterodon Platirhinos while the Westerns are classified as Heterdon Nasicus. The first name "Heterdon" is the genus while the second names, Platirhinos and Nasicus" are the species. When a third name after the species name is present, that is considered a subspecies such as Heterdon Nasicus Gloydi. An intergrade would basically be considered if you were to mix, for example, a Heterdon Nasicus with a Heterdon Nasicus Gloydi. Some people are purist enough to even demand that an intergrade only be coined if the two species/subspecies coexist within a specific range of each other where it might be considered that the two might actually breed together in nature.



You also cannot fault Jon for referring you to the Hybrid forum where it is a more appropriate place to ask such a question. Yes, you are asking about hognose specifically and this is the hognose forum, but if you took the time to actually search this forum, you will see that this exact same question has been asked before:



Eastern X Western

Considering a Hognose

Southern x Western



This was also an interesting post regarding Kennerlyi:

It would not be an intergrade.



It's funny that you seem a little defensive though about posting this after saying this "first off I'm not trying to tick anyone off". So, obviously you know that there's a chance of getting less than receptive replies. If you felt Jon's response was "snarky", then why even respond when you knew there was a chance of getting such a response?



Anyways, I also find it interesting that you recently asked this in the hybrid forum: "Perhaps more interesting does anyone know if the Madagascar giant hognose might be able to hybridize with one of the north american cousins?". Your interests in breeding/creating hybrids is obvious since 5 out of 10 posts here on KS have been on the Hybrid forum and apparently not just within the interests of hognose but other species as well. The one thing that, after seeing your posts about interests in creating other hybrid species, is that you claim that you are "fully prepared to keep every snake that is hatched". Well, if your interests extend to several species, that sure sounds like a lot of snakes that are going to be kept as pets.



While I do not know you, I do find it a little bit hard to believe that you would go through all of this trouble of breeding and keeping every single species you hybridize. I'm not saying there is anything wrong should you want to sell such animals, but hybrids do tend to cast a shadow of a doubt on certain species that are also known to be used for hybridization and the creation of new "morphs". Heck, I've seen a lot of people on other forums not comprehending that the simple "cornsnake" they have is actually a hybrid two different rat snakes. The problem is that far too many "newbies" nowadays buy a snake, get hooked, then within a year have purchased 20-30 more with the intent on breeding them all. Not only does this flood the market, but most of these people I have found do not do enough extensive research on the animals they have let alone really know the lineage of what they themselves have purchased which is how hybrids can and do sometimes get mixed in with pure lines. Do we really need this in our hobby?



Anyways, that's my $2 worth (after all, what is 2 cents worth these days anyways?).




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Troy Rexroth

Rextiles

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