>>Ok, Chris. Thanks. Now I just need to figure out how it would be legal for me to have two. Considering the fact that some breeders have babies to sell or give away, either there's a way to accumulate two, or folks are breeding these illegally. Maybe CA is just unable to enforce their laws in other states.



How is it legal for anyone to breed Cal Kings outside CA without a CA breeder's permit ($295)? If you want an interesting read, the CA captive propagation regs are here (in PDF form).



I think it's a matter of CA Fish & Game regs not being enforceable outside the state. That'd be like Texas saying someone in Ohio can't keep earless lizards.



I've been going round and round with this issue for the past year, as I have some San Diego banded geckos (Coleonyx variegatus abbotti) which were given to me. I'd like to breed them, but all I have are males. I'm looking to get females given to me, because I think I personally can't "take" them under the auspices of a CA sportfishing license due to the ridiculous bag limit (2; though for certain lizard species up to 25 are permitted).



The geckos aren't rare; however, the subspecies is listed by CA as a "species of special concern" which from a collecting standpoint apparently means nothing (I think they're listed because the species is endemic to CA). On the other hand, if they were listed as "threatened" or "endangered" by the state, and someone in another state turned up with some, I suppose that would be punishable under the Lacey Act perhaps, since unless the person could prove his were captive-bred from existing stock from before the designation as threatened/endangered, the only way he could've gotten them was by illegally taking them from the wild in CA.



I went back and forth with a guy on rec.pets.herp about this a year ago. I challenged the regs as being stupid (based on the 2-gecko bag/possession limit, since they're plentiful) and he got all bent out of shape about it. After a lengthy discussion, he admitted he had helped write those regs back in the 1970s. I had wondered why he was so defensive!



There's also discussion related to anecdotal evidence being used by state Fish and Game Commissions to restrict collecting of herps without scientific basis over on the "other site's" Law and Politics forum.




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Chris McMartin

www.mcmartinville.com

I'm Not a Herpetologist, but I Play One on the Internet

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