Yes, I agree. I think it will be very interesting to see what the Patternless Boas produce. I am very anxious/excited to see the offspring from them! Are you/Brendan planning on breeding the same parents to each other again (the F3 Harlequin x “normal) or maybe one of the Patternless back to the dam? I think once a Patternless breeding is done, that will hopefully reveal a lot more.

I understand that genetics is not always black and white and does not always fit into predisposed categories. However, of the hundreds of different morphs we have in reptiles (I don’t mean only Boas, but all reptiles) a large majority of those genetic mutations fit within the main three categories – simple recessive, co-dominant, and dominant. So I believe it is natural that we look to these forms of genetic inheritance first. However, while those methods of genetic inheritance usually come to mind first, they should definitely not be the only possibilities considered.

Zenzinia brings up a very good point about alleles. I know in Corn Snakes, the Motley and the Stripe morphs are a prime example of this. In Corn Snakes, the gene responsible for the Motley pattern and the Stripe pattern are the same gene. One allele of the gene produces Motley Corn Snakes while the other allele produces Striped Corn Snakes. When you combine the two, you can get get both in the clutch (i.e. some babies that are Motleys and some babies that are Striped all in the same clutch) as well as an intermediary form – Cubed. The Cubes appear to be an in between pattern. The circular pattern of the Motleys is elongated by the Stripe and you end up with square-ish/rectangular looking patterns.

What does this mean? I don’t’ know. I guess it just means that anything is possible. Maybe the Patternless and the Harlequin are the same gene but on different alleles?? I know that this is just the tip of the iceberg as far as genetics is concerned. I certainly do not consider myself a genetics expert to the least. All I’m trying to do is understand how the simplest genetics work and are inherited in these animals that we love. I try to learn as much as I possibly can (and remember it too!) and enjoy these types of open discussions!

As for the Blue Eyed "Leucistic" Ball Pythons, there are several “morphs” that will produce Blue Eyed "Lucys" including (and perhaps not limited to) Mojaves, Platinums/Lessers, Butters, and Phantoms. However, they have bred the different morphs not only to themselves (i.e. Mojave x Mojave) but to other morphs (i.e. Mojave x Lesser). Most of the time the results are – Blue Eyed "Lucys" with varying degrees of white. Does this mean that Mojaves, Lessers, Butters, and Phantoms are all the same gene but in varying degrees? Is a Mojave a darker looking Lesser and the Phantom a still darker looking Mojave? If this is true, why does a Phantom x Phantom produce a purplish Ball Python with ivory yellow/beige colored markings? What is going on here????

As for the Jungles, I do not believe there are any F5s. I was just using that as an example. I know that an F5 Jungle may not necessarily be equivalent (as far as genetics is concerned) to an F5 Harlequin – but would an F5 Jungle bred to a normal produce anything different than an F2 Jungle bred to a normal? Honestly, I don’t think so. I mean, they might produce nicer looking Jungles, but I don’t believe that they would produce anything “crazy”. Of course, I would be thrilled to be proved wrong on this! I believe Pete Kahl just produced the first Super Jungles in the U.S. from a breeding between a Salmon Jungle and a Jungle (please correct me if I’m wrong). We should hopefully see litters of all Jungles and more Super Jungles in the near future! I can’t wait!

The issue of “possible” Jungles is a tricky subject. I believe, when a litter of Jungle Boas is born, you can go through the litter and pick out which are Jungles and which are not. Most of the time, the difference is incredibly obvious. However, there may be one or two babies that make you doubt the obvious. Perhaps one that does not have the Jungle coloration but has the wide, cookie-cutter shaped saddles. I can see why some breeders are offering individuals at a reduced price as “possible” Jungle boas. I have not had this problem with any of my regular Jungles YET. However, I do have this problem with my Hypo Jungles. Throwing in another gene, especially the Hypo/Salmon gene certainly does not help the situation since the Hypo/Salmon gene has already been shown to alter the pattern in boas. I have 3.3 Hypos from my Hypo Jungle litter that I am “unsure” about. The females – not a problem, I’ll keep every last one of them, raise them up, and prove them out (or not). The males on the other hand…I’m not quite sure what to do with them. I will probably keep them another couple of months before I make my decision. If I feel that one or two of those guys has a good chance of carrying the Jungle gene, I might offer them at a discounted price as “possible” Hypo Jungles.

It is ALWAYS “pleasant when things fit nicely into the convenience of theory”. It is always VERY interesting when they do not………………………………….

Thanks,

Celia

Yikes…that was WAY too long LOL…
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Celia Chien

www.BoaConstrictorMorphs.com

Celia Chien Photography


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