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Christine do you have a latest picky of Creepy for me, thanks Max

Creepy died on Wednesday May 28th at the age of nine months old. His owner, who's name I'll omit but it's not me, made a huge error. A fatal error for the monitor. He asked me not to tell anyone including the Crocs breeders (D&J) that Creepy had died and how but since he and I are no longer on speaking terms I thought I would share in my pent up grief. I cried about this for a couple of days because this monitor was like my own.
I'm sorry that I've kept it hidden. It was a great loss to me even though Creepy wasn't mine. Thanks for asking about Creepy, he/she will forever be in my heart.
Christine :>~

Christine,
Was his error something that we all could learn from, so maybe some good may come from this?

Just wondering.

Best Regards,
Michelle

Creepy was bought as a gift and was handled everyday by him and I got the pleasure to handle him and be apart of his life often also.
On Sunday the 5/25 Creepy up and blew a gasket and started acting really mean. So mean you couldn't go near him w/out a tail whip, hissing, lunging, and biting. This was very out of character for Creepy, but in monitors it happens. Rather than letting the monitor be and have it's space he kept handling him and in turn he got the brunt of Creepy's aggression. By Tuesday he had had enough of this behavior so he went out and bought some vinager. This is a treatment that is used by some keepers as a light training device to teach a monitor not to bite. I use it myself. Well at any rate he let Creepy bit him and of course the monitor bit and hung on. In turn he started to pour the vinager down his throat. He basically drowned his monitor in vinager. He let his anger get the best of him and he took it out on his monitor. Being the inexpierenced keeper that he was he and having never used the vinager trick, and being very angry, I guess he didn't realize how much he was giving him. He poured about a quarter of the bottle down his throat. The vinager clogged his stomach and his lungs up and he suffocated.
I have to make this plea to all now. PLEASE, I BEG, Do Not use this treatment unless you know what your doing!!!!! This has been the most heart breaking expierence for me and a lot of tears were shed. He will be forever in my heart.
Christine :>~

I’m so sorry Christine that you were in anyway associated to that MURDERER. Inexperience has nothing to do with it. I have nothing else to ad! Max

Sorry to hear that Christine.

Best of luck with the sav breeding.

--Robert

If it is true, that has to be one of the stupidest and cruelest things that I have ever heard of. If that guy really let that Salvadori bite him, he is stupid enough to be willing to take a scar for it. Owning 3 of Herpafuana's Salvadori, I can say without a doubt that they absoultely should not and and will not become a reliable handleable monitor. For the simple fact of their body size and teeth. Salvadori are a monitor that need lots of space to do their thing, and are very unpredictable at any age, especially when young. I was bitten by the first one I got when it was only 3 months old. I have scars on my hand from one even that young. When I went to pick up my 2 new ones, I was a little late for the USFW inspection. The inspector had opened the crate to examine one of them and show freight workers. She was bitten in the hand and arm 6 times by a 5 month Salvadori. By the time I got there she was crying and her arm was pouring blood and they were trying to just get it to stop bleeding. I went back up and had the same inspector. She was anxious to show me her arms and the nasty scars she had from both the top and bottom jaw, which she will have for life. They are just to dangerous to risk them being reliable. As for the vinegar thing, I have deffinatly never heard of someone doing that. That is extremely stupid and cruel to do to any monitor. To let it bite your hand, then pour a substance like vinegar on it is animal cruelty at it's finest. And to do that to such a rare animal as a captive bred Salvadori makes it even worse if possible. I just pray that he doesn't get another one. His expectations are never going to be met by a Salvdori. I really wish that D&J would take the words "dog tame" off of their description. That is very misleading and except in a one in a million exceptional individual, there is no way in hell they will become. I hope the outcome of this horrible situation will change peoples views of hatchling Salvadori and what to expect. I am very sorry for the monitor as it probably died a horrible death, but am glad he at least got one last bite on that dumb ass. His actions are inexcuseable. -Jeff

No this was not a joke this really happened. And he was not bare handed when he let Creepy bite he had on two layers of thick welding gloves.
No bad press or words should be said against D&J for this!!!! They are businessmen just like every other breeder and seller out there. No herp breeder I know pre-qualifies a person before they buy a monitor. I never agreed with him getting the monitor because they are a "expierenced keepers only" monitor and yes they are expesive and he had very little monitor expierence and NO Salvadorii expierence either. Fingers only need to be pointed at one person, in one direction.
I'm not trying to justify any of this nor condone his actions!!! This is a bad expierance that should learned from, plain and simple.
Christine :>~

Hey Christine, have you seen the Salvadori that Reptile Outlet has? Its pretty nice looking. They said hes a royal butt head. I think they want like 8 or 900.

Latter,
Michelle

Yeah I saw it. It's a sexed female that was part of a pair. The male was still at the owners house. They said that he was bringing in the pair and they were going to try and sell them as a pair. But he only brought the female. The male is supposed to be brought in this weekend I think.
They told me she was ornery but not really mean. They have been telling people that she is really mean to keep people from wanting to handle her. which is a really great idea in my opinion but they have already let certain people hold her. I could get more into that but not here on the forum.
Christine :>~

owns the large female you had pictures of on your back?

No. The large one was owned by a caring person that built that monitor a room sized cage and takes great care of it. The seven footer that was on my back is about 3 - 4 yrs old.
Creepy died at nine months.
Christine :>~

that he does not own the bigger one. For some reason I thought he owned both. That big one sure looked like a nice female to me is he going to breed them?

It's good to see people that have some nice big ones instead of babies. I wonder what happened to all the people who bought babies I only seem to see a few pics here and there. But most are of young ones and not big ones. I have 2 a c/b 2001 female and a c/b 1998 male.

I'm not sure if the big one is a female. He's never had it sexed. But that monitor made me fall in love. It's owner told me that the Croc has never acted that way twoard anyone. That is why the pictures were taken. He told me that no one would believe that someone was able to hold it and love on it like that. But I broke some major rules that day. All in all that was the best monitor expierence that I've ever had. It was amazing!!! It made my heart flutter and skip beats.

The pics you posted on pet hobbyist are those of a new baby of yours? Did you get a new Croc or is that offspring off your current pair?
Thanks
Christine :>~

Those pictures are of my female when I got her. Someone had asked for pictures of babies. So I loaded them up and posted them above in reply to his questions. She is much bigger now but still a bit small to be in with my male. Thats the problem when not getting groups of them and raising them up at the same time. But she will catch up shortly and be able to be in with him. They have met and get along fine but I wouldn't trust them together for to long he is just huge. Both are tolerant of me and a joy to work with.

I need to get some recent pictures of them and post them up so everyone can see them. It is not often I see LTC. big crocs pictures posted on here. I am sure everyone would enjoy seeing my big 8-9 foot male.

Thanks for all the info. Good luck in her growing to be a she-monster!!!

I cant wait to see pics of the big boy.
Christine :>~

She is 2 years old and 5-6 foot so I am sure she will have no problems getting that big. She is now starting to slow on length and fill out alot more. It always amazes me how fast reptiles can grow.