Reptile & Amphibian Forums

i seem to notice a greater than expected number of pit bull owners on the snake forum interesting to think theres a link, those who are attracted to the very-much-controversial breed, are also attracted to the controversial species- snakes

how many other pit bull fans in the house?!?!

I have 8 triple registered staffordshire terriers, and I adore them. I breed them, and although they do have a bad rep, they are very loyal, smart, and have a high pain tolerance, so they arnt as likely to bite a kid for pulling on their tails. PITBULLS ROCK!!!! Ill get some pictures for you guys
Will Wohlers

please tell me you get show titles on them and health test before you breed

hey yep i've had pit bull terriers for so many years i think it was my uncles that had them 1st,so for as long as i can remember we have had one two maybe a few,Know i really like the ELI stain of APBT's,here's a picture of one favote ones her name is Maharet..Hope you have a good day
Greg VanZweden

http://www.geocities.com/vanzwedensreptiles/

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Forever Trust in what we are,and nothing else Matters

I am a huge AmStaff fan. But for me the standard pit bull terrier (backyard/line bred) is not always a good dog. I like the true pits that AKC recognizes. The original Bully breeds. The American Stanfordshire Bull Terrrier and the Stanfordshire Bull terrier, and the Bull Terrier.

But this is just my opinion. No bad dogs just bad owners of course!

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Christine
Tails With Scales Reptiles
Happiness is biting my snake back!

not to bash the breeds you like, but a small correction. the pit bull IS the original dog.... they existed long before the AKC registered them, and had to change the name to something wussy and so picked american staffordshire. the amstaff is NOT the original and the pit bull the offshoot, its the other way around

Im partial to staffy bulls myself (who are a seperate breed entirely and possibly even older than the pit bull)

Sorry but I beg to differ with you. lol The AmStaff was an origanl breed that started by mixing Staffies, Mastiffs, and the common Bull Terrier brought over from England, Ireland, Scotland and was mixed even with the American Bull Dog. As far as full establiment of the breed and recognition the first part of the breeding started in 1890 but was not "perfected" until 1942. The AmStaff was recognized as a "breed" in 1939 in America and the Staffie in 1989.
lol
Yah know, lol Each persons opinion is going to be different and it's not about what dog is better, worst, first or last. It's all about what each person loves!!!! Kinda like snakes. lol One persons love and devotion is Retics anothers is Ball Pythons.

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Christine
Tails With Scales Reptiles
Happiness is biting my snake back!

Well first off let's just all agree Pit Bulls/ AmStaffs are the greatest breed of dog there is. Now let's get some facts, the American Pit Bull Terrier was the founding breed for this line of pit fighting dogs. It was the UKC to first recognize the APBT (american pit bull terrior) as a legitimate breed in 1898. The second registry to recognize the breed was the ADBA (american dog breeders association) which is made exclusively for Pit bulls. It wasn't until 1936 that the AKC allowed them into their stud book as Amercan staffordshire terriers as they didn't want any dog associated with the AKC to be linked with fighting. As far as the ancestory links to the APBT there are nothing more than speculations as to what was bred to create it. What we do know is that the breed was brought to amercan attention from Irish and scottish immigrants in the early 1800's. These dogs were very game and were used for generations in europe as bull baiters and in dog fighting and were usually on the larger side of what we consider the breed standard now-a-days. These dogs were extremely trustworthy around humans as they were only bred to be animal aggresive and any dog that showed human aggresion were quickly put down. This trait alone is what made them great family pets (the dog from The little rascals was a grand champion in the fighting ring). It wasn't until the USA banned dog fighting that people began to breed them without knowledge of their pedigree creating dogs that were not as trustworthy around humans and now we have the problem of "gutter" bred dogs attacking people. Any true lover of the breed recognizes how important it is to breed only true game bred dogs with direct links in thier pedigree to fighting lines. I do not condone fighting these wonderful dogs only because it is illegal and the people that run these fighting rings have forgotten that it is a sport of the fittest dog not a fight to the death ( in the original layout of a tournament, dogs very very rarely were maimed or killed). My dog's pedigree is very line bred and can be traced to some of the best Old Family Reds ever produced before and after fighting became illegal and that is the only type of Pit bull I will ever share my life with.

Josh Hutto
JKReptiles

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2.3 het pied (RDR, alan bosch x 2, BHB x 2)
0.1 High Contrast Albino (Gulf Coast)
1.1 het albino (ben siegel, Gulf Coast)
1.2 het citrus ghost(Gulf Coast line)
1.0 citrus ghost (Gulf Coast line)
0.1 graz pastel female
1.6 05 normal bp's
0.6 04 normal bp's
2.5 adult normal bp's (some need breeding to see if norm)
4 various corns
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa (alan bosch)
1.0 american pit bull terrior
1.1 taco dogs (ankle biters)
1.0 grey cat
1.1 bearded dragons

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrior as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

Again to me history, and dates don't really mean anything. As you said it's all speculation. What is most important is each persons love and devotion to the breed(s) and keeping it pure and clean.
I do have a Q though.
What is your definition of "Line Bred"?
As I was taught, line breeding was taking dogs and breeding grandfather to granddaughter and such. Basically a form of inbreeding.
I have never bred Pits because they are a very over bred and unwanted in CA. It's sad really, because they are such great dogs.

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Christine
Tails With Scales Reptiles
Happiness is biting my snake back!

"Line Bred" is a form of inbreeding. With that said it is very very careful inbreeding. In a pedigree too much line breeding is not a good thing, neither is close relation line breeding. What I mean there is father/daughter is way too close and more than 2 grandsire/grandaughter breedings is too many. I've gone through my dog's pedigree and looked how many times the same names show up. The most common dog in his pedigree is Wood's and Wilder's Red Inferno along with Wilder's Red Apache, both of whom are on there 5 times (only twice each being bred to one of their kinship). Quality bloodlines in any pure-bred breed animal shows linebreeding, it's just how careful the breeders are to not overdue it.
Josh Hutto
JKReptiles
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2.3 het pied (RDR, alan bosch x 2, BHB x 2)
0.1 High Contrast Albino (Gulf Coast)
1.1 het albino (ben siegel, Gulf Coast)
1.2 het citrus ghost(Gulf Coast line)
1.0 citrus ghost (Gulf Coast line)
0.1 graz pastel female
1.6 05 normal bp's
0.6 04 normal bp's
2.5 adult normal bp's (some need breeding to see if norm)
4 various corns
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa (alan bosch)
1.0 american pit bull terrior
1.1 taco dogs (ankle biters)
1.0 grey cat
1.1 bearded dragons

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrior as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

i have been eyeballing tatonka for my next dog. looking for an obed and weightpull dog. what do you think of them? where did you get your guys? what lines are they, i mean?

Tatonka Kennel's produces some outstanding Sorrells. Probably some of the best in the country. With that said I'm not a huge fan of Sorrells though. They are smaller than I like and produce a fair amount of tri-colored Pit's which is another thing I dont like personally. However if you wish to compete in ADBA activities their bloodlines will be perfect for you (If a dog is over 65-70 lbs or more than 19" they are faulted in the ADBA). If you are planning on UKC competition, the breed standard is alot more flexible (they take into consideration of height, weight, length when determining whether a dog is out of proportion). In general I've seen a few dog's from their bloodlines and all have been very nice animals (other than being small for my taste) and I would recommend them. Now to my dog, "Chief" is sired by Red Ranger's "Rush", grandsired by Helm's "Red Ranger Rocky" and great grandsired by Ballard's "Red Ranger". He is completely Old Family Red top and bottom with Wood's, Wilder, and Gutierez making a strong showing in his pedigree. "Chief" is a larger Pit Bull with a conditioned weight of around 85 lbs (he's close to 95 now, i'm too lazy to work him out every day, lol). If you have anymore questions just email me, don't want this thread to get booted.
Josh Hutto
JKReptiles
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2.3 het pied (RDR, alan bosch x 2, BHB x 2)
0.1 High Contrast Albino (Gulf Coast)
1.1 het albino (ben siegel, Gulf Coast)
1.2 het citrus ghost(Gulf Coast line)
1.0 citrus ghost (Gulf Coast line)
0.1 graz pastel female
1.6 05 normal bp's
0.6 04 normal bp's
2.5 adult normal bp's (some need breeding to see if norm)
4 various corns
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa (alan bosch)
1.0 american pit bull terrior
1.1 taco dogs (ankle biters)
1.0 grey cat
1.1 bearded dragons

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrior as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

which is why i love the tricolors lol. and why i got into ball pythons too. the rrns are nice, and red ranger has some really nice dogs, but nothing steals my heart like tanpoint lol. yah im shallow like that i guess

do you have a website? if you like pits i recommend you join pit bull forum (you can google it) they are really great over there and you can learn a lot

American Pit Bull Terrier-- Anything else is just a dog

uhhh what? what breed history have you been reading? ask akc themselves. the amstaff is the apbt under a different name. the american bulldog is another breed entirely and the histories have nothing to do with each other.......... i have no idea what books or websites you have been reading but that is totally false.....

dates and facts are not subjective opinion. ask any oldtimer, heck ask tom garner. the "pit bulldog" came first, then the ukc and adba made it "american pit bull terrier" and then last, the akc finally caved, but made them call it something else, because they absolutely did not want "pit" in the name. the "pit bull" has been around a couple hundred years longer than the akc amstaff LOL how does that even make sense that the amstaff came first???

again, i have no idea what you have read but please go pick up some more books because whatever you read has got their facts wrong

Oh good Lord does it really matter that much???
I have been in the dog show world for 12 years. I may not know exactly 100% the time line of each breed or even the the Bully breeds but I do know this; The acceptance American Stanfordshire Bull Terrier by AKC and naming the dog as such had nothing to do with "not wanting pit in the name". It had everything to do with the fact that physically the breeds are different. AKC has stated that.
But again does time lines of when breeds were founded really matter that much?

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Christine
Tails With Scales Reptiles
Happiness is biting my snake back!

no it doesnt matter which one you like, but if you are going to go around telling people about pit bulls please for goodness sake at least have your facts and history correct

"I like the true pits that AKC recognizes. The original Bully breeds. The American Stanfordshire Bull Terrrier and the Stanfordshire Bull terrier, and the Bull Terrier. "

the "original" bull breed was the bull and terrier, ie the pit bull. the pit bull or pit bulldog or bull and terrier was THE original breed. over time, they offshooted to create a multitude of breeds, and so the APBT, Amstaff, Ambull, Staffy bull, bull terrier, and a few others, are all brothers and sisters, so to speak, as they ALL originated from the OOOOLLLDDDD bull and terrier "type" (was not a breed, not yet)

and
"Sorry but I beg to differ with you. lol The AmStaff was an origanl breed that started by mixing Staffies, Mastiffs, and the common Bull Terrier brought over from England, Ireland, Scotland and was mixed even with the American Bull Dog. As far as full establiment of the breed and recognition the first part of the breeding started in 1890 but was not "perfected" until 1942. The AmStaff was recognized as a "breed" in 1939 in America and the Staffie in 1989."
Now i have no idea on the dates of this stuff, I would have to actually go look them up, but the amstaff was NOT created by mixing ANYTHING. the amstaff is the AKC ONLY "version" of the pit bull. you can have a dog that is amstaff and pit at the same time. its just a matter of what you call them in different registries. sort of like its a "stroller" in america, and a "pram" in england. same darn thing just different names. they carry babies.

so again. please do not walk around talking about this breed you love without the full facts. it really does more harm than good.

I still see pit bull owners/breeders/fans telling me, in all dead seriousness, that pit bulls brains keep expanding after their skulls are done growing and that is why they snap and kill. or that their jaws really do lock. they will sit and argue with me about it. and these are people that love pit bulls!!!! *shakes her head in dismay*

the only difference between the two are that the AKC states AM Staffs cannot have a red nose. Any APBT that does not have a red nose can be accepted into the AKC stud book which is how it's possible to be registered into the ADBA, UKC and AKC. If you don't think that's why they changed the name to American Staffordshire Terrier just read the history of the breed on the AKC web page, it states it right there. So just make sure you read everything before you start to make claims that aren't true. The differences between the 2 are sooooo slight, there has been many ADBA registered APBT's win in AKC shows.
Josh Hutto
JKReptiles
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2.3 het pied (RDR, alan bosch x 2, BHB x 2)
0.1 High Contrast Albino (Gulf Coast)
1.1 het albino (ben siegel, Gulf Coast)
1.2 het citrus ghost(Gulf Coast line)
1.0 citrus ghost (Gulf Coast line)
0.1 graz pastel female
1.6 05 normal bp's
0.6 04 normal bp's
2.5 adult normal bp's (some need breeding to see if norm)
4 various corns
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa (alan bosch)
1.0 american pit bull terrior
1.1 taco dogs (ankle biters)
1.0 grey cat
1.1 bearded dragons

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrior as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

another small correction (good god im nitpicky lol), unless they made the change in the past week I havent heard about it yet, the AKC stud books are CLOSED. meaning ONLY amstaffs with two akc amstaff parents can be registered with the AKC..... you CAN, however, take an akc amstaff and register him or her with the UKC and ADBA as an American Pit Bull Terrier. just not the other way around (a UKC APBT cannot be registered as an AKC amstaff unless both his parents were AKC amstaffs/UKC pit bulls)

Time lines have nothing to do with loving the breed. I love, own, and breed pythons but that does mean I know when each species was dicover and named or tell people that when they buy them.
I love the breed for their wonderful hearts, loyalty, and abilities.
That's I love the dog for the dog.
About the lock jaw crap, it is symply that, crap. A myth!!! The brain swelling is something I have never heard of but it's funny that people say/believe that.
Anyways, I love the breed and my being wrong on the time line, these threads, or anything else is going to change that. They are an excellent breed and have received an extremely bad rap because of bad people.

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Christine
Tails With Scales Reptiles
Happiness is biting my snake back!

going to change that.
lmao
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Christine
Tails With Scales Reptiles
Happiness is biting my snake back!

did you even read what i posted? no, you dont have to be able to rattle amazing facts off the top of your head, and no i dont care about years and timeline, because i dont know it either, but please do NOT go around spouting off facts that are blatantly untrue. it spreads misinformation about the breed (someone could actually believe you, and think amstaffs are pit bull/ bull terrier/ mastiff mixes, and then go tell his buddy "hey did you know.........." and it dooms any credibility you might have had with other people "in" the breed.

again. please read more than one book or website before you form your own history of a breed ><

this is absurd ill bet anything its gonna get deleted now.

AKC doesnt recognize pitbulls,only amstaffs and staffs however UKC has some great showdogs (pitbulls)but i agree the backyard standard with the arched back and tiny rearends dont impress me,way to much in florida here and fighting them is out of hand...

I don't have a pitt bull, but I do have a British Bulldog named "Nigel" he is the guardian of the reptile room in our house!!

Leyla x

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1.0 husband
1.3 kids
0.1 african sulcata tortoise
1.0 Argentine Black & white tegu
1.0 green iguana
1.0 egyptian Uromastyx
2.3 canine buddies
0.1 Ball Python

i have a 7 month old pit bull who is as loyal and as smart as any dog i have ever had, and I have had labradors, cocker spaniels, beagles, many varieties. I dont let him too close to
my reptiles though. He is quite curious and I wouldnt want to risk him getting too close to Oscar-my green burmese.

lol. would he become lunch?

mine is awesome with my snakes, i like to drape them on his head and take pics, and he just stands there and "suffers" through it, with this "ima pee in your bed later!" expression *laugh*

pit bulls are such characters!!

These are my neighbors dogs but I love them as if they were my own. They are brother and sister and thier names are Sugar (female) and Spice (male)


They would rather lick someone to death than ever bite, and some times they dont relize that they are as big as they are they come over to greet you and knock you down on acident spice weighs in at about 180lbs and sugar about half that.
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2.1.0 ball python (aragorn, frodo, arwen)
2.0.0 columbian boa (wiggles and squiggles)
1.0.0 rat snake (alabastered)
0.1.0 corn snake (baby)
3.3.0 cats (rockie, bs, brownie, lerrado, kole, camie)
1.3.0 kids (dilyen, dakota, chyanne, sierra)
Brian n Chrissy
"snakes are kind of like potato chips, you cant have just one"

beautiful dogs, and those names are too cute! but if they are 180 lbs they are definitely not pit bulls. did you mean to say they are american bulldogs? the pit bull ranges 20-80 lbs and anything over 80 lbs is a REALLY FREAKING HUGE pit bull lol

My biggest male is a blue from diablo kennels and he is weighing in at 115lbs. Anything over 80 isnt huge, obviously you know nothing about pitbulls. And what kind of person would risk their snake by draping over their dogs head?
Will Wohlers

Post moved from the ball python forum
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PHWyvern