Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Thanks to everyone for their helpful and supportive replies to my earlier post.
I learned a lot from the replies and by searching the archive for similar posts.
I took her to the Vet a couple days after my original post (almost 2 weeks ago).
My regular Herp Vet wouldn't see her because she is a wild snake.
I couldn't get past the receptionist on the phone.
After some pleading and a sad story, I convinced my dog's Vet to see the snake.
He doesn't normally treat herps, but was willing to help.
The vet gave her Silvadene cream and a series of 5 antibiotic injections (2 left to go)
Her burns and cuts have started to heal and it looks like she is getting ready to shed.
Her eyes and much of her lesser burned skin turned a milky blue 2 days ago.
Today her eyes started to turn clear again.
I hope she will start to shed in the next few days.
I am still soaking her each day. I see her drink her bath water each time when she starts to soak.
I add a few drops of Reptile Vitamins to her bath every other day.
I hope the baths will keep her hydrated and help with the coming shed.
After the bath she gets wiped down with diluted Chlorhexidine and then smeared with the Silvadene cream
I offered her a fuzzy last week, but she was not very interested.
I will try again after she sheds.

How does shedding work with injured or burned snakes? I imagine this will be a difficult shed for her?

The tip of her tail is beginning to heel, but it looks like bone is exposed at the end, will the bone slough off if it doesn't heel over?

How long is it safe for a snake to go without eating after they come out of brumation?

There are some pictures below, she was in blue so the color is a little off.
The white spot on her side is the large puncture, with a lot of Silvadene cream on it.

Thanks again,
Tom

Wish I could give an answer on the shedding but cant. I will say I think either it sheds regularly or skin stays on the wounds. As for the exposed bone I cannot say.

About the vet, you should try and get her to a qualified herp vet. A regular dog vet might administer a potentially fatal dosage as he or she has little experience working with reptiles. Look in the phone book and call up close-by vets and ask if they work with reptiles. This snake is wounded and needs treatment; if you cannot find a close herp vet other than the one you see regularly, be persistent and try to get the vet to see her.

By the way, where in New Jersey do you live? I might be able to recommend you to a vet, or possibly might even be able to take it off your hands altogether if you wish.

As of this typing, I dont remember if you mentioned your racer's setup. If she seems to be acting like a regular snake(that is, how they normally act during their active months), I'd try feeding her. Live mice would do the trick. If not, try insects or lizards. Yes I said insects, there r a good amount of reports of racers taking insects. You can then go to scenting from their. Good luck with Smokey.

It sounds like the dog vet is doing his job; I would have recommended the same course of action (actually, I think I did in your first post)....sometimes, you just have to put your faith on those who are qualified (and sometimes a dog vet is all we have to work with). I'm fairly confident that they utilized one of the many excellent herp vet manuals to determine dosage.

I would recommend that you go kind of easy on the soaking; too much can actually do more harm than good. Too much water can have a detrimental effect on the natural substances that the snake secretes when going through a shed cycle in addition to the healing process itself. Instead of the soaking, and an occasional soak is okay, I would recommend just misting the enclosure with warm water every other day (to allow it to dry naturally) and provide a warm/humid retreat in the form of a plastic storage container with a hole cut in the lid and the container filled with slightly dampened spaghnum moss.

You might be surprised that the snake has a complete shed w/out any incidence. The bone at the tip will most likely become necrotic and fall off; just keep applying silvadene to the area until that happens to prevent infection....I wouldn't worry too much about that particular area. Make sure that this snake has a warm, dry basking area and for racers, I recommend a quality heat lamp that provides light and heat which is important for racers; this will also greatly aid in the healing process. As far as feeding goes, you may find that the snake has no willingness to feed during the medication process; the antibiotics tend to put them in a bit of a funk until the infection is over. Once treatment is over, I would recommend offering a SMALL live mouse, a native frog of the area, or even a large minnow in a shallow dish of water; something that will move and catch the attention of the hungry snake. These are opportunistic predators that overpower any small prey they can subdue.

Keep us posted.

Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center
Lake Forest, IL

>>Wish I could give an answer on the shedding but cant. I will say I think either it sheds regularly or skin stays on the wounds. As for the exposed bone I cannot say.
>>
>>About the vet, you should try and get her to a qualified herp vet. A regular dog vet might administer a potentially fatal dosage as he or she has little experience working with reptiles. Look in the phone book and call up close-by vets and ask if they work with reptiles. This snake is wounded and needs treatment; if you cannot find a close herp vet other than the one you see regularly, be persistent and try to get the vet to see her.
>>
>>By the way, where in New Jersey do you live? I might be able to recommend you to a vet, or possibly might even be able to take it off your hands altogether if you wish.
>>
>>As of this typing, I dont remember if you mentioned your racer's setup. If she seems to be acting like a regular snake(that is, how they normally act during their active months), I'd try feeding her. Live mice would do the trick. If not, try insects or lizards. Yes I said insects, there r a good amount of reports of racers taking insects. You can then go to scenting from their. Good luck with Smokey.
-----
Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
Lake Forest, IL

i don't like the fact the first vet mentioned refused to see a wild caught animal-why?...i agree with the above post-perhaps lay off the soaks-it is amazing what a wild animal's body can do to overcome such adversity and heal itself right up,all on it's own-it's own natural secretions have no substitute...ditto on the temperature gradient-very important,esp. a dry warm basking area,i would think of at least 84-87 degrees on the warm side;but also a cooler side as well,of no higher than 77-79....i strongly disagere with the live mouse of any size suggestion...like said above,this guy may totally not feel like eating at the moment...ill/injured snake inquisitve/progressively less timid rodent=really bad combo...need i say more?i have had friends keep wild caught racers that,to our surprise,proceeded to eat thawed,or better yet in your case,freshly killed rodents-remember to stay small for now while his skin heals....if that does'nt work,for christ's sake watch that live rodent closely for the entire time he's in the snake's enclosure-if it's not taken within a few minutes,take it out....but i stil say feeding live mice to this snake is a very bad and unnecessary thing at this point,and i am surprised others don't agree on this point with me....hey good luck,continue to keep us posted!

I should have clarified my point. First, I am NOT an advocate of feeding live except in extreme circumstances and ONLY under very close supervision...even then, its a last ditch option. With a wild caught animal, whose health has been compromised, it is sometimes a necessary evil to get it kick started on a live prey item (especially sight cued racers). I should have been more clear in saying that if a live mouse is offered, that it should be a fuzzy sized mouse; nothing larger that could pose a potential threat to the animal. The mouse should be closely supervised as you suggested and if not aggressively taken w/in a very short time period (10 minutes tops) then it should be removed. I personally recommend first trying to simulate a live mouse with a f/t prey item via long hemostats but its a technique that many do improperly. Any problems with that?

>>i don't like the fact the first vet mentioned refused to see a wild caught animal-why?...i agree with the above post-perhaps lay off the soaks-it is amazing what a wild animal's body can do to overcome such adversity and heal itself right up,all on it's own-it's own natural secretions have no substitute...ditto on the temperature gradient-very important,esp. a dry warm basking area,i would think of at least 84-87 degrees on the warm side;but also a cooler side as well,of no higher than 77-79....i strongly disagere with the live mouse of any size suggestion...like said above,this guy may totally not feel like eating at the moment...ill/injured snake inquisitve/progressively less timid rodent=really bad combo...need i say more?i have had friends keep wild caught racers that,to our surprise,proceeded to eat thawed,or better yet in your case,freshly killed rodents-remember to stay small for now while his skin heals....if that does'nt work,for christ's sake watch that live rodent closely for the entire time he's in the snake's enclosure-if it's not taken within a few minutes,take it out....but i stil say feeding live mice to this snake is a very bad and unnecessary thing at this point,and i am surprised others don't agree on this point with me....hey good luck,continue to keep us posted!
-----
Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
Lake Forest, IL

>>I should have clarified my point. First, I am NOT an advocate of feeding live except in extreme circumstances and ONLY under very close supervision...even then, its a last ditch option. With a wild caught animal, whose health has been compromised, it is sometimes a necessary evil to get it kick started on a live prey item (especially sight cued racers). I should have been more clear in saying that if a live mouse is offered, that it should be a fuzzy sized mouse; nothing larger that could pose a potential threat to the animal. The mouse should be closely supervised as you suggested and if not aggressively taken w/in a very short time period (10 minutes tops) then it should be removed. I personally recommend first trying to simulate a live mouse with a f/t prey item via long hemostats but its a technique that many do improperly. Any problems with that?
>>
>>>>i don't like the fact the first vet mentioned refused to see a wild caught animal-why?...i agree with the above post-perhaps lay off the soaks-it is amazing what a wild animal's body can do to overcome such adversity and heal itself right up,all on it's own-it's own natural secretions have no substitute...ditto on the temperature gradient-very important,esp. a dry warm basking area,i would think of at least 84-87 degrees on the warm side;but also a cooler side as well,of no higher than 77-79....i strongly disagere with the live mouse of any size suggestion...like said above,this guy may totally not feel like eating at the moment...ill/injured snake inquisitve/progressively less timid rodent=really bad combo...need i say more?i have had friends keep wild caught racers that,to our surprise,proceeded to eat thawed,or better yet in your case,freshly killed rodents-remember to stay small for now while his skin heals....if that does'nt work,for christ's sake watch that live rodent closely for the entire time he's in the snake's enclosure-if it's not taken within a few minutes,take it out....but i stil say feeding live mice to this snake is a very bad and unnecessary thing at this point,and i am surprised others don't agree on this point with me....hey good luck,continue to keep us posted!
>>-----
>>Rob Carmichael, Curator
>>The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
>>Lake Forest, IL
-----
Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
Lake Forest, IL

hey mister!i don't want no trouble!lol...

offering it a rodent that has yet to be weaned(eyes not fully open yet) should greatly reduce the risk of injury to the snake...that way you get the live movement that arouses the feeding response,nd w/out gettign your snake gnawed on,etc...so go with a few fat mouse fuzzies,one or two small 'hoppers',or a rat pup/pinky...later