Reptile & Amphibian Forums

if i don't get the veiled cham's for some reason. there are two othe species of cham's at another pet store. these are big juvi to adult's.one is a meller,giant{i think with horn} the other is not as big, he is a giant oustelet.witch of the two would be the best bet?their already adults or close to so i don't worry about the young mortality rate ive read about.but are they extreamly hard to manage?i have all day to take care and to provide for them.i have brought back sick leo's before i think i am in the novice catagory but no expert.what's my best bet as a first time owner of chams the young veilds or the two bigger ones if i cant get the veilds?

I'll start this off and then leave plenty of space for more input from others. I have no experience with veilds, but you would rather go with a oustaleti before a melleri, for serveral reasons becaue of cham type, its environmental needs, cb or wc, and your experience.

Another problem is that your helping perpetuate the wc problem when several of us are trying to get breeding programs for this species established so we can displace some of the imports and provide cb animals in the trade. Melleri are less able to adjust to the abduction and confinement of being wc. Also bad for you, because you may lose the animal and be discouraged.

Both are excellent species to work with but if they are wild caught adults, you are going to have trouble with providing conditions that they can adjust well to, getting a suppliment regime for your gutloaded feeders and adjusting them to being handled. Oustaleti is the better choice.

I would recommend you get a juvie panther. There are plenty of resources out there, esp the web. The problems that could arise with raising from a juvie stage are more developmentally based, usually due to diet and suppliments, but there should be less problems with an animal's psycology. If they grow with you they are more likely to be more easly handled, less stressed to confinement, parasites, etc...

Michael

I agree with insecttrap. The Melleri and Oustalets are almost guaranteed WC (and I wouldn't believe them if they told you otherwise). You should be more worried about an adult WC staying healthy (reguardless of species) than a juvenile CBB veiled or panther.
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Tyler Stewart
Las Vegas NV
www.BLUEBEASTREPTILE.com

Forgot to mention, in case you missed the recent "micromanaging" thread, it's probably a bad thing that you have all day to watch and care for them LOL...
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Tyler Stewart
Las Vegas NV
www.BLUEBEASTREPTILE.com

yes it is a bad thing i have all day to watch'em but i am a heart patiant.ever since i got out of the army i have made herpatology my hobbie,my bad heart is getting better though.no reason to give up on what i love to do,its no reason to stop living.so while i am at home all day ill have ample time to keep studing reptiles and and learning how to take care of em

...as I am sure you know. I have a friend who has no pets, a dog when she was growing up, but none now. I have always found it hard to understand - oh well, that's just me. I hope your health continues to improve! Enjoy your cham
lele
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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna. She's now hanging from her big jungle gym in the sky
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.1 Mad. Hissers and she is on the loose!
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha
?.? Pinktoe Tarantula - no name yet

Actually, unless that pet shop has had the melleri and the Oustaleti for months, they have been tested and treated multiple times for various parasites, and they have had perfect care, I would pass. Both species are almost always wc and packed full of parasite blooms due to stress. They can also be suffering from the dehydration during their capture and shipping, and the resulting kidney failure can take months to show up...just about when their new keeper thinks they are over the hump. I hate to say it (and your shop may have had good intentions), but both these species have that "wow" factor, are relatively cheap for dealers and less experienced shops to buy, so they don't get great treatment. Some melleri can be very tempermental and from what I've read Oustaleti can be stressy and shy. I have kept melleri but not Oustaleti, sorry. You are lucky that you have time to invest in them, but both will need a LOT of space, probably a lot of vet care too meaning big bucks. There is more specific care info on melleri now that the Yahoo!Groups melleri forum has their great website going (The Melleri Discovery), but I still don't know if either species would be a good idea. You might want to check the Chameleons Ezine and Adcham for info on Oustaleti. Go to

http://www.chameleonnews.com
http://www.adcham.com

thanx for all the advice.i will go for the veiled chameleons.from what i have heard here and read on line. cb veiled's just seem to be the better choice so hopefully in a few days ill make the trade. just one last question.ive read up on some plants to use in youre cham set up.i got habiscus,and ginger.has any one had any problems with these before?what other non-toxic plants do u guy's recomend?besides trees,my set up is only 3ft tall untill i can afford a bigger set up.

I have used pothos for many years with veileds. Some of the females eat almost all the leaves off the plants with no ill affects to the chameleon. Poor plant needs a rest from the chameleon every once in a while to recover! (Males seem to chomp on the leaves less often.)

Good luck with your veiled(s)!

Thats a great choice for a first cham! I've had very rewarding experiences with veileds. Be sure to post some pictures of your new guy/girl when you get him/her!

Here is a picture of my current veiled, Lucutis. He is 7 months old now. I just LOVE this guy!

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1.1.0 Leopard Geckos (Booger & Gimp)
1.0.0 Veiled Chameleon (Lucutis)

Wow, it's really quite amazing how gorgeous these critters are, so many different colors and patterns, awesome !

He is one Good looking guy !
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PHEve / Eve

Contact PHEve

There are several houseplants often used for chams. The Hibiscus is OK, non toxic, but will need good bright focused light to do best. Also look at the sturdier Ficus species (Ficus alli is a good one, less fussy than F. benjamina the "weeping fig" you find in home improvement stores and nurseries (often offered as "tropical foliage houseplants), Hawaiian Schefflera (sometimes called the umbrella plant) and pothos.