Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I am currently taking a field vert. course and my group (mainly because of me) is getting to make a trap to catch herps. Well our design has to be your basic net and bucket type deal. We plan to put a rubbermaid in the ground with a little above ground and on the top of one side cut a hole. Then have the nets stretch about 25 feet or so out from that whole at an angle so the animals follow the net and fall in. Does anyone out there have any other ideas or pictures of stuff like this? I would love to see some other ideas before I make my final decision.
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It sounds as though your teacher should think of better ways to educate his students. Perhaps, safer ideas would be bird watching or dip-netting ponds, something that does not have the potential to inadvertently destroying loads wildlife. Bedsides some states having laws against such acts, trapping should be let to the professionals. If not planned correctly, there is a great potential that all animals, but your intended query will be trapped and possibly killed. Additionally, if hunters got lazy and decide to leave trips in the environment rather taking the trouble of cleaning it up, thousands of animals could be killed over time. I really suggest that you convince your teacher to reconsider his project. At least have him investigate your local laws before conducting such acts. Feel welcome to print this out and take it to show him if needed to help convince him that more wrong could be achieved than good.

Ok look first off there will be no harm done because the traps will be checked every day. The animals will not be killed because it is perfectly safe in the rubbermaid container. I also know what I am doing when handling reptiles considering I have snakes and understand how to handle any in the wild. I don't know what your problem is but it is a great idea to catch and release. It helps you understand the animals and for people that do not see them on a regular basis it helps them identify with the animal. I really do not understand where you are coming from. My class is full of biology majors who want nothing more than to help save the earth.
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1.1 Motley het butter corns
0.1 Snow corn
0.1 Okeetee corn
1.0 Anery mutt corn
0.1 Stripe Ghost corn
0.1 Amelanistic corn het carmel
2.1 Colombian Redtails
1.0 Hypo Colombian redtail
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa

Well, it sounds like you are an elementary school student, because I know of no Bio major that needs to ask the question “How to make a herp trap?” If you have to ask, you probably should not even consider doing it. Additionally, you need to conduct research regarding, not only the herps that will be caught, but what to do with the rodents and other animals that will inadvertently be harmed by your project.

I agree, those types of traps are not only illegal but do often kill more animals than they catch alive. Which is why they are illegal) The forest service uses some similar (without netting) and they report often catching animals that they were not intending to catch and some are found dead due to exposure. By the way they are not safe in a rubbermade container. Also it seems that you guys would find more valuable info by jut field herping- finding them in their natural environments. And your teacher doesnt sound so herp savy or he would know that there are better ways to study herps.

Ok first I know how to make a trap if you would have read the original post you would see that I was asking for other peoples ideas to see if there was any different ways to tweek my original design. Second, this type of trap is used all the time in large field studies. Colleges and Universities use them all the time to find out the types of animals living in a certain environment. The animal is not harmed because it falls into the rubbermaid which is not so deep as to harm it. Then the next day we come out take a picture and release it. Wow that sounds so horrible. I think I might also burn a tree while I am out doing that just to make myself feel better. I do not fully understand yalls problem with this idea. Scientific trapping happens all the time and animals are not hurt. I have 2 funnel traps that I built and those dont seem to harm the animals either. The trap I talked about making has been used over and over again. The animal runs into the barrier and travels along it then finally when it reaches the whole of my collection box it falls in and sits till we check it. By checking it everyday we assure that the animal does not over heat or get to cold and that the animal does not dry out or get thirsty. I all originally asked for was some help with an idea that I had. Trust me I plan on studying herpetology when I get my masters, I know a thing or two about reptiles. I am not just some kid that thought it would be cool to trap some snakes. So before you start attacking someone do some research because you will see I am not the first person to do this kind of catch and release research.
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1.1 Motley het butter corns
0.1 Snow corn
0.1 Okeetee corn
1.0 Anery mutt corn
0.1 Stripe Ghost corn
0.1 Amelanistic corn het carmel
2.1 Colombian Redtails
1.0 Hypo Colombian redtail
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa

You guys really need to take a step off. Drift fences have been used by field researchers for years. Yes they are illegal in some states. But, not for biology classes.
I have used them myself in field studies for the Univ. of AZ, New Mexico State, USGF, and the list goes on.
If the tubs are checked every day there is no problem with loss of animals at all. When not in use we simply put the lids on. This stopped animals from being trapped when no one was available to check them.

Not to mention that you guys tore into him without asking any questions to quantify his need or statements. HMMM that sounds awful trollish.

Like: What do you plan to do with the animals?
Why is your class interested in trapping animals instead of wild observation?
What specific class is it?
What is the specific purpose and catch of the traps?
WHY?

Simple questions about the subject.

And I just know you guys are gonna do the same to me. Condemn without proof or any information.

David Furphy
AKN Venom & Exotics

I am glad someone here backed me up on this. I mean it is just a simple catch and release project for my field vert class. We will take pictures and let them go and certain animals are worth a certain amount of points and you have to make your point value by the end of the year. And those guys that attacked me just seemed to think i was going to go out and burn a rainforest or something. My class does field work, we go out and turn up logs and stuff, it just traps will also help in seeing animals that you would not normally see when walking through the woods with 15 people.
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1.1 Motley het butter corns
0.1 Snow corn
0.1 Okeetee corn
1.0 Anery mutt corn
0.1 Stripe Ghost corn
0.1 Amelanistic corn het carmel
2.1 Colombian Redtails
1.0 Hypo Colombian redtail
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa

No Problem At All. I have had my problems in this field too. The herpetological field is tough enough without being attacked when you ask a simple question. The others also didn't think that if someone was looking for illegal herp collection, it is very doubtful that they would ask here.
Plus if you do a search on drift traps, bucket traps, or drift fences, there are LOTS of references without coming here. So there really was no need for them to attack you as THIS is not the only place for information, simply a good source (depending on who you listen to). I am by far not the most informed on this site, so please keep asking as there are others here who support education without trolling.

David Furphy
AKN Venom & Exotics

Hi all,

I conduct biological surveys here in Australia.

I use pitfall traps with drift fences as well as funnel Traps with drift fences mainly for herps....occasionally I get lizards and snakes in elliott and Cage traps, but for Herps the pits are the way to go.

I just recently wrote a s.o.p for the use of a number of wildlife trapping techs (only people holding Research permits, that have Animal Ethics Approval can Trap in Australia, so it is highly (rightly so) regulated), while I will not forward a copy of the sop...I can direct you to a site (http://www.animalethics.org.au/reader/wildlife-research/arrp-wildlife-surveys.htm)that gives you what you need to know.

I would suggest, that you make the rim of the bucket flush with the ground.

You need to CHECK THEM TWICE DAILY....not once, usually 6AM and 6 PM.

I place my buckets at 10 metre intervals, therefore one hundred metre fence for 10 buckets/funnels.

Make sure there is drainage holes, if you start having problems with ants (very common) you need to move your traps.

Trap deaths are not uncommon, usually things like place baits (for small mammals to consume once caught, closing of traps in inclement weather, putting shelter (styrofoam cups are good)in the base etc helps) You will also get deaths from predators and prey falling in the same buckets.

This should Help,
Scott Eipper

tsusnakeguy,
With respect to the use of drift fence / pit fall traps (drift fence / funnel traps), you might start out by looking up papers authored by Dr. Henry Fitch. If you are handy with computer searches (which I am not), I suspect you might be able to dredge up a considerable number of references on the subject as these methods have been widely used in the fields of entomology, mammalogy, herpetology, and perhaps other disciplines.

The use of drift fence / pit fall traps have their positive and negative points and are not effective with some species be they small mammals or herps. I believe it is Dr. Fisher at San Diego St. U. that began using various diameter PVC pipe in the bottom of his pit fall traps to avoid a certain amount of loss due to more than one species falling into traps.

It is my opinion that you would be better served using artificial cover objects which are far more effective for a broader array of species (small mammals, herps, invertebrates) and avoid some of the problems inherent with pit fall traps.

Richard F. Hoyer

I agree with you completely. Another idea is to limit the area of search. Block off a small area of habitat with a small mesh fence (I have done this for scorpion counts with areas of 40' on each side). The area should NOT be blocked off for any longer than used for the study, it is to help keep present animals in the given area. We used it over an 8hr period from 4pm to 12am. Fairly effective overall, but, the fence made for great viewing of diurnal lizards and insects.
Cover is also a very effective tool. Old trash heaps are favorite haunts of herps as well as herpers. I have taken sheets of plywood out to copy the south eastern tin fields. Very effective and it can be left for long periods (provided the landowner approves and it is not abandoned, pack in/pack out).
Nice to see someone else Mr. Hoyer who is supportive instead of negative.

David

Well first off I would like to say although I am not an expert on pit trapping, I am an ecology/evolution/herpetology university student as well, and I support you on your idea to do some field sampling. It's ridiculous that you got flamed when looking for help - from people who obviously have never done much field sampling themselves, no less! I have never done any pit trapping myself but I have talked to fellow researchers/students who have. One of the biggest concerns is predation inside the trap - you just gotta check often enough, or put in PVC pipes like the other guy said, because this seems to be a big problem. Also, watch the temperatures inside the traps!

I believe the trap itself is fairly simple in structure, no? At least the idea is simple. Make sure that you place your trap in an area where people won't see it and mess with it! It would also be cool to put traps in different habitats and compare the species compositions between habitats.

Other than that, good luck, and I hope you guys have a successful project!
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- Andy
ToothAndScale.com - herp and underwater photography

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