Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I was wanting to know where I could get a jungle corn, and what makes a jungle corn..

I love the way these corns look, but I haven't bought one cause every one that i have seen had an uneducated seller that couldn't answer my questions. Also, what would be a fair price for one? Any help would be Greatly Appreciated..

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A.J.
0.1.0- Fiancee- Emily (LOL!)
1.0.0- Amel Motley Corn- Valentine (R.I.P 5/20/05)
0.1.0- Snow Corn- Artica
1.0.0- Normal Corn- Ember
1.0.0- Ball Python- G.T.
1.0.0- Bearded Dragon- Stang
2.0.0- Chihuahua- Nightro, Parker
1.2.0- Cats- Mollie, Sammie, Clowie
0.0.12- Fish- All Unnamed

A jungle corn is a hybrid of a king snake and a corn snake. I have two myself. They run about $30-50 in my area. Your best bet to get info whould be in the hybrid forum. Asking questions about hybrids in a "pure" forum sometimes gets bad responses or causes trouble.
Good Luck

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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

thanks I will re-post in there thanks
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A.J.
0.1.0- Fiancee- Emily (LOL!)
1.0.0- Amel Motley Corn- Valentine (R.I.P 5/20/05)
0.1.0- Snow Corn- Artica
1.0.0- Normal Corn- Ember
1.0.0- Ball Python- G.T.
1.0.0- Bearded Dragon- Stang
2.0.0- Chihuahua- Nightro, Parker
1.2.0- Cats- Mollie, Sammie, Clowie
0.0.12- Fish- All Unnamed

why didn't you just buy a pair of eastern milks, that is what those look similar to.

Also, I have wondered if hybrids with king in them are more cannibalistic than other snakes. Finally, if king snakes eat other snakes, kings included, why don't they try to eat themselves? Last one is purely just a joke, others aren't

she has a picture of a full blood corn hatchling that turned itself into a bracelet haha it ate itself.
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0.1.0 normal corn het hypo,anery
1.0.0 snow corn het hypo,anery,amel
1.0.0 amel corn unknown hets(4ft 8inch long)
1.0 sinacorn
0.0.1 snapping turtles
0.0.1 3 lined mud turtle
1.1 kenyan sand boas
0.1 mbk
0.1 albino nelsons

that'd be something that I'd like to see... not in my own animals, but a pic of. I would think you wouldn't want to breed that snake, it might have mental problems! LOL
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

Sad, but true, and a pure corn, too.

will try it as a link, or cut and paste this...

http://www.corn-utopia.com/Corn%20Utopia%20on%20the%20Web/Photo%20&%20Image%20Stockpile%20-%20CornUtopia/WEB%20-%20cannibal%20corn
Photo of auto-cannibal corn.

maybe somebody else can post it from the cut and paste from my site???

kathy i stole your pic a put it in my gallery in order to post it.

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0.1.0 normal corn het hypo,anery
1.0.0 snow corn het hypo,anery,amel
1.0.0 amel corn unknown hets(4ft 8inch long)
1.0 sinacorn
0.0.1 snapping turtles
0.0.1 3 lined mud turtle
1.1 kenyan sand boas
0.1 mbk
0.1 albino nelsons

n/p

Rare hoop snake that just got carried away. Hooping is not for KIDDIE snakes, Even kid snakes don't listen to their elders.

tom
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Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
-----
tom

www.herpzilla.com

So you found it dead? It choked on itself? Now that is kinda a freaky thought. I wonder if it was found in time, if it'd have done it again. Maybe it thought something was attacking him, so he wanted to get them first. Thanks for the pic!
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

We had a king snake that did this all the time. It was halarious to watch him stalk his own tale. As much as he did it, he never did this, but , he was never able to constrict himself. but he tried. We got called 2-3 times a day, HEY your snake is eating himself. Maybe being an adult he had the need to constrict first? I think many of us have seen baby kings or corns eat a live pinky with out constricting it?

tom
-----
Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
-----
tom

www.herpzilla.com

L.t.triangulum babies do not eat like baby jungles.........

both actually get 4 foot plus but baby easterns are a pain at times.........

jungles are cool.......albino jungles are really sweet....bright intense colors......

good luck.
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..........................
........
....
you think????

I have been told that the hybrids have the cannabalistic side of kings, but on a much milder scale. I have not even tried to introduce my two. Next year they will be breeding size and will let you know. My two kings tollerate each other, but put a corn with one and its dinner time! lol. All my snakes are housed seperately, but I wanted to see what my female thought of a male corn. He wanted nothing to do with her and she wanted to eat him. You can tell that the male king knows he could be food, as he keeps his head away from her mouth during mating.
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

>>A jungle corn is a hybrid of a king snake and a corn snake. I have two myself. They run about $30-50 in my area. Your best bet to get info whould be in the hybrid forum. Asking questions about hybrids in a "pure" forum sometimes gets bad responses or causes trouble.
>>Good Luck
>>
>>
>>
I like that bottom pic.
Nice
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

_____

THANK YOU.
From you, that is a very nice complement.
I am not a photographer and use a cheap camera, so my close up pics are blurry. I need a camera that can do close ups!
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

I once said hybrids would be the future but that involved all the herp laws. That was 2 years ago when I first got back into herps.

I have to admit I was much more open minded to hybrids. I seem to be changing. But I am so confused. (ok, a great straight line, go for it lol)

The people I thought would really frown on hybrids have them.?!?!?

OK, I mean some of the people not ALL.

I hope all admit what ever side you are on, this practice could and probably will have an impact on our wild live.
I think if I put numbers to it, 2 years ago, I was 90% for 10% against, I'm now 30% for 70% against.

Just my 3 cents. complex subject. with a high impact.

tom
-----
Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
-----
tom

www.herpzilla.com

>>
>>I hope all admit what ever side you are on, this practice could and probably will have an impact on our wild live.
>>I think if I put numbers to it, 2 years ago, I was 90% for 10% against, I'm now 30% for 70% against.
>>

How can breeding hybrids in captivity have an impact on wild life?
At least I would assume you meant wild life.
People breed hybrids, people breed pure stock.
The number of pure snakes bred every year seriously out numbers the number of hybrids bred every year.
Notice these are all bred in captivity. Nothing to do with wild life.
Some people say, "oh no, what if some of these were released into the wild?"
Well, for the ones that would survive, which wouldn't be a large number to begin with, you would then have to figure how many would breed successfully.
Even less.
So when these hybids breed in the wild it would have to be one species or the other which makes up the hybrid, right.
So, the offspring would then only be 25% whatever and 75% pure.
As these offspring spread out, some die, some survive and a few may breed successfully. As they spread out the chances they would happen to breed with one of their own siblings would be slim so you would expect them to breed with another pure specimen.
This now drops them down to only 12.5% whatever and 87.5% pure.
At this rate within 5 or 6 generations, the few that might survive and reproduce would be producing offspring that would be over 97% pure.
I just don't see the numbers supporting any impact what-so-ever to wild populations.
Someone would have to dump 100's to 1000's in a controlled environment to result in a devistating impact.
MY opinion anyway...for whatever that is worth
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

_____

Oh in short the way tegus, burns, knight anoles ect ect do.

Corns and kings are excape artists we all know that. I agree hobbiest would have a tiny impact over all. But if they become very popular wholesalers in florida will have them, and that could have a larger impact for sure. IMO.

Heck if I do not find my female bloodred, I may be guilty of establishing Ohio's first red/black rat snake morphs, or red fox snakes. I jest,I think?,, but I do think hybrids could have an impact in some areas. To what degree? Hard to tell.

tom
-----
Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
-----
tom

www.herpzilla.com

>>Oh in short the way tegus, burns, knight anoles ect ect do.
>>

those are not hybrids
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

_____

Er yup, but they got loose. And have an impact. One might presume if hybrids not native to any given area are releaved by what ever method, and HAVE an ability to breed with local animals will impact that area.

The use of tegus ect was just to show that crap happens and stuff gets loose. Thats all. that was used since there was a question about captive animals even getting into the wildlife.
-----
Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
-----
tom

www.herpzilla.com

the Dept of Fish, Game has been using this argument for years to keep ferrets illegal in Cali. The main difference is, ferrets are sold already fixed and if per chance a non fixed female gets out, the chances of her finding another escapee that is male and also unaltered are close to nul, before she dies (female ferrets die if they go into heat and don't breed)
My point is, you can argue that these animals could have an impact, but I do not think the chances are very high. I could understand introducing something that does not exist at all in the area, say like the mongoose to hawaii. But to introduce a snake to an area that already has snakes.....nature usually finds a balance. I am not saying man has not screwwed up a lot of things, but must of us agree that it is on a small scale.
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

I think an animal that exist can be more harmful. Pigs in Australia run havoc, but do not brred with anything.

I think the RES in Ohio is an example. Now an introduced sp, it is not allowed to be sold in Ohio. So I see cooters for sale at shows. As Hank Jill would say, "man I'll tell you what" I've seen some cooters I highly question as full cooters. I think a male RES will try to mate with anything close.

And any animal that can breed with animals in a new region can be harmful, not just hybrids.

I guess we just have different views. But PA's colubrids law proposal seems to see a danger. And I AM NOT backing that law. But us herp people have to be better at keeping our pets. And be involved with people that do not understand the effects of releasing herps, and walking monitors down the street (ok I was guilty of that as a kid lol). We have to work as a whole.

These is surely one of the most complex and has so many views, that are congruent in places and conflict in others. This forum is not a good place to discuss it. Although if I thought there was a group get together to talk about this, and it had some input to gov't decisions, or any regs, I would do what evr I could to be there, maybe just to listen,, but I doubt that lol.

tom
-----
Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
-----
tom

www.herpzilla.com

I think as long as we keep the subject on corn snakes or corn snake crosses (hybrids) this forum is an excellent place to discuss it.
Every post brings up valid points. Especially this one I am responding to.
There are many instances and species that would blow holes in my theories or opinions but as of yet I haven't seen proof, concerning corn snake or corn snake crosses, that discredit my opinions either.
Of course, that could change with the next post.
One point I want to add in the middle of all this...I do not see any naturally occurring intergrades as hybridization.
Either way, this is a great topic and if we can't discuss it here we never will.
It's not like we will be forming a committee to meet in a central location to discuss the ramifications of hybrid corns on the environment, now are we...lol
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

_____

>>Er yup, but they got loose. And have an impact. One might presume if hybrids not native to any given area are releaved by what ever method, and HAVE an ability to breed with local animals will impact that area.
>>
>>The use of tegus ect was just to show that crap happens and stuff gets loose. Thats all. that was used since there was a question about captive animals even getting into the wildlife.
>>-----
>>

but you are still talking about invasive species taking hold in areas they wouldn't normally have been.
Our main topic here is corn snakes, of course.
Take animals that are hybridized with corn snakes and let them go. If they do breed chances are, as mentioned before, it will be with one or the other parent species. Thus diluting the mix.
With invasive species they will only breed with their own species. Therefor they will seek out their own species. They will be drawn towards their own kind, reproducing and increasing in number.
With the hybrids it is just as feasible for them to take either species and not be as selective.
I guess with these species it would be a release of pheromones that would attract a mate?
If so, then the release of species A or species B pheromones would be as likely to attract a hybrid as AB pheromones.
It would also be more likely that A or B species would be more prevelant then AB hybrids.
To me it just goes to numbers and I don't see the numbers supporting damage.
Especially in the normal scenerios where a hybrid may get loose here or there. There wouldn't even be another hybrid to breed with.
They would only have the oportunity to breed with A or B.
This goes back to what I said earlier, unless a very very large number were released into a controlled area.

of course this is just my opinion and may be complete bull %$#@
......oh well
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

_____

I agree but disagree. If a snake gets out and breeds in the wild they have the SLIM possability of creating an isolated pocket of hybrids. Make a note that I said "isolated pocket" because unlike some organizations seem to think 1 snake will not ruin the world. let's put it into something tangable... Like the pythons in the everglades or the chameleons in florida. They escaped and bred. Now take like .05% of those and that is what you could expect to find if your snake escaped in the exact right conditions.
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0.1 Snow Corn "Hope"
1.0 Ball Python "Wilson" (Castaway)
1. Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Chunk" (Goonies)
.1 Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Peaches"
0.0.1 Mexican Black Kingsnake "Onyx"

>>I agree but disagree. If a snake gets out and breeds in the wild they have the SLIM possability of creating an isolated pocket of hybrids. Make a note that I said "isolated pocket" because unlike some organizations seem to think 1 snake will not ruin the world. let's put it into something tangable... Like the pythons in the everglades or the chameleons in florida. They escaped and bred. Now take like .05% of those and that is what you could expect to find if your snake escaped in the exact right conditions.
>>-----

Right.....Even when I am writing my posts, I think of scenerios like the ones mentioned that show the dangers and possibilities, but in all of these, so far, I still see no signs of hybrids taking over.
Yes, there are chances. I never once discounted that. There are chances and as things progress the possibilities may grow.
For now, I just don't see the numbers of hybrid corns getting into the wild to create problems.
Maybe I am naive.
Let's take a scenerio that could look at the other side, and it will be interesting to see if anything comes of it.
There is a breeder in Florida that breeds creamsicles and various other corn/emoryi mixes.
This still borders on intergadation to me but with the new taxonomy they are listed as different species so that would qualify as hybrids...anyway I digress..
His place was hit by one of the huricanes and many of his snakes were lost in the damage. Probably a significant number of "hybrids".
This could cause a scenerio where there is enough of a saturation to make an impact. I would really love to see what wild specimens may come out of that area in the next few years.
Maybe this could be the proof to show there are more immediate dangers then I see.

In all of this remember, I strongly beleive people should always represent their animals for what they are and although it was done in the past, I don't think people should ever release unwanted offspring into the wild.
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

_____

Finally my idea was seen. Thank you. I might add, someone said if "1" hybrid excaped. Why only 1? If there was some new hybrid that was very very popular, places may be holding 100's maybe thousands. And if a handling mishap, a hurricane, a thief, bad husbandry, bad wifery (anyone catch that?), my point more than 1 COULD get loose. And in the right circumstance many. It would only take 1 big mishap. I still like hybrids, maybe in a few years someone will come up with some high speed way to track your own animals? personalize GPD tracking wizmos. Maybe collars with tags like dogs? ~

tom
-----
Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
-----
tom

www.herpzilla.com

trying to keep a collor on a snake would be worse than trying to keep a collar on a ferret!
There is microchiping snakes. I think it is for ID when found, not tracking, but i am sure it will get there. I think it could be available now to those who wanted to spend the $$$
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

2.3.0 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.2.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.1.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog