Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just had a few questions about probing. I have a very good idea of how to do it. But have been reluctant to try because I am scared of hurting them and I have a few questions. I know that you probe going towards the tail. How isn't there a scale overlaping the vent? How do you get around it? Am I likely to hurt them if I am gentle? Would you recomend I give it a try?
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0.1 Snow Corn "Hope"
1.0 Ball Python "Wilson" (Castaway)
1. Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Chunk" (Goonies)
.1 Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Peaches"
0.0.1 Mexican Black Kingsnake "Onyx"

demonstrate, then study this info sheet and diagram:

http://www.cornutopia.com/Corn%20Utopia%20on%20the%20Web/Sexing%20Snakes%20With%20Probes.htm

and then you can call me if you like so I can talk you through it. Be sure to have a small enough probe and a helper to hold the snake when you call. My number is listed on my website (prefer not to post it here, but anyone who really wants it can find it on my site).

Kathy,
that is some really good info! I think it is awesome that you are willing to talk to people directly and help them out.
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

2.3.0 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.2.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.1.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog

Kathy you've had to probe 1000x more snakes than I. less than 3 or more than 9. But don;t you love those tweeners, those snakes that probe in the odd range. We had 1 corn probed by 3 people. All with same results. My idea if the bottoming feels soft of kind of bounces, its a female, if a real definate stop a male. Just on then tough tweeners. Do you agree?

>>demonstrate, then study this info sheet and diagram:
>>
>>http://www.cornutopia.com/Corn Utopia on the Web/Sexing Snakes With Probes.htm
>>
>>and then you can call me if you like so I can talk you through it. Be sure to have a small enough probe and a helper to hold the snake when you call. My number is listed on my website (prefer not to post it here, but anyone who really wants it can find it on my site).
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Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
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tom

www.herpzilla.com

the depth. The male organ is rather elastic and has quite a bouncy feel to it. But the female has only "meat" there, so there is a definite stop at the end. I get a few babies each year that are not 100% sure with popping, so I probe them. If still not sure, I either sell it as a pet (unsexed), or try again in a couple of months if I still have it. But after practicing many thousands of times popping and probing corns, there are not too many that seem indeterminate anymore. However, I ALWAYS recheck when I ship, or when I move to a bigger cage. A very small number of the babies that seemed definite seem to magically change sex later somehow. Probing and popping are not 100% accurate, although they have a very high degree of accuracy.

I have talked several people through the process via telephone(after they studied the info sheet) and they had no problem. I prefer to demo it at a show though, whenever possible. In person is better.

Thanks, most of my sales do not really need sexing. More for my knowledge. I guess most of my betweeners are males then, they seem to "bounce". As for popping, I can not pop a snake if it was knowingly willing, and I have good tactile skills. I think I'm just to light? But I don't do it a lot though.

Thanks Kathy.
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Computers don't make errors. What they do, they do on purpose. (Dale Gribble)

AOL IM Mettzilla
I forgot my password for herpzilla, and gave a bad email,, major OOPS

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
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tom

www.herpzilla.com

start too close to the cloaca. You have to start quite a way back towards the tail and roll your thumb forward. It is best to start with a known male for practice - then you will know when you have succeeded. Start with very light pressure and then add a little more pressure each time until it pops (if you know it is a male and you are starting far enough towards the tail). I do not pop corns bigger than 18" - takes too much pressure to pop them at larger sizes. When I demo it in person, and show people just how far back to start, they usually do fine. Again, much easier to show in person.

I have been asking Bill to make a couple of 30 second videos of popping and probing to put on my website, but he hasn't gotten around to it yet. (He has a fairly new digital camera that will do short videos, but he hasn't really used that feature yet).

Kathy,
I have baby corns on the way (hopefully) and need to be ablr to sex them, when I sell. There are are few questions that I wanted to ask, though.
what kind of damage can you do to a snake by popping incorrectly? Will they heal from anything done or is it permanent? Will you know when you have hurt/damaged them?
You said you do not pop anything over 18", is there an age that you prefer to stay under, as well? Say if a snake was under length, but older.
I was told not to pop anything a year or over as their muscles are too strong, and as you said, it takes too much pressure.

Any help would be great!!
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

2.3.0 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.2.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.1.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog

I would think that too much pressure could damage the hemipenes of the male. The female doesn't have anything "important" in that area, so I would think the only damage you could do to her is to use so much pressure that you damaged the tail or soft tissue. I am not a vet, so this is only judging from my own experience.

I have popped literally thousands (actually, I guess 10s of thousands!) of babies (and probed almost as many - babies and adults). To the best of my knowledge, I have never injured one. Of course, if the male organ was injured permanently, you might not know until his failure to breed. But I never had a customer complain to me about a male not breeding. And in all of these years, I can only remember 2 males and maybe 3 females that never produced for me, whether because of injury, infertility, or whatever reason. So I don't think injury would be a big problem if you are being very careful. Maybe somebody who is young and exuberant might be a little over zealous with the procedure, but with care, I don't think injury is likely, although certainly possible.

I should add that when probing kingsnakes, it is not unusual for a small drop or two of blood to be noticed during the probing. I have NEVER seen this with a corn. But when I had kings many years ago, I saw it fairly often, and never noticed any injury or problems resulting from it.

Thanks for the info!
I think I might not be going far enough back on the tail. I will buy a set of probes and try that. I think it might be a little easier until I get the hang of popping.

Thanks again
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**********Misty**********
I haven't lost my mind.... it's backed up on disk somewhere.

2.3.0 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.2.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.1.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog

>>I just had a few questions about probing. I have a very good idea of how to do it. But have been reluctant to try because I am scared of hurting them and I have a few questions. I know that you probe going towards the tail. How isn't there a scale overlaping the vent? How do you get around it? Am I likely to hurt them if I am gentle? Would you recomend I give it a try?
>>-----

You can't do any better then direct help from Kathy.
One thing I will add.
Yes, you have to be carefull but they are not quite as fragile as you would think.
I think you can/will catch on quickly.
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

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