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I'm moving my two big corns (both over 34" in length) into new tanks this week. Is pine a suitable substrate, or might it cause problems for them? I know aspen is most desirable but it costs like 3 times as much as pine.
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>>I'm moving my two big corns (both over 34" in length) into new tanks this week. Is pine a suitable substrate, or might it cause problems for them? I know aspen is most desirable but it costs like 3 times as much as pine.
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Pine is not really a good idea. The aromatic substrates could possibly cause respiratory problems. Especially if they get damp.

I personally use aspen.
Easy to spot clean
Looks decent enough in a natural setting.
Adds another hide to your viv. Snakes like to buroow though it and it tends to hold it's shape. (the tunnels)
Isn't dusty.
Inexpensive.
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

_____

Pine and most conifers have lots of vapors. Cedar is used to kill insects. Aromatic cedar anyways.

as for 3 times?? We sell our small bags of pine for $3.49 same size aspen $4.99. I believe 10"x24" fish bags, something like that. Aspen can be had in bails at a few corp store. I think you can find it for less that 3 times pine.

good luck tom
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ontogeny recapitulate phylogeny

Charlie Mike

I am your worst nightmare! I have a three-line phone and plenty of time to kill!
(Dale Gribble)

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
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tom

www.herpzilla.com

I agree, aspen is much better. If you buy the compressed bags, it looks as though your not getting much in the bag but it expands when opened. As Draybar said, they love to burrow and the tunnels hold their shape.

John

Pine, like cedar contains toxic oils that can be irritating and lethal to snakes. Kiln dried pine shavings isn't too bad but not all pine shavings are kiln dried. Basically if it smells like pine to you, don't use it.

The cost of aspen various from place to place and bag size. I have seen it sell 2-3 times as much as an equivilant size/volumn bag of pine shavings. I can get the large bags of pine for about $7, an equal size/volumn bag of aspen is about $14-$21 depending where I go. (these are Canadian prices). If you use alot, maybe talk to any large feed/seed stores or even your local petstores or walmarts and maybe they will bulk sell it to you for cheaper.

Cypress mulch can be used as a substrate for snakes. It isn't as good as aspen, as it tends to be bigger chunks and corn snakes can't burrow into it as easily as aspen shavings but could be a useful alternative. Feed outside the cage or put something down ontop of the wood shavings to prevent accidental ingestion of the substrate.

The cheapest substrate to use is plain old white papertowel (or brown papertowel, for a slightly different look) or unprinted newsprint.
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PHLdyPayne

I've also heard any aromatic, oily woods/barks are bad.

I use Cypress Mulch for my milk snake. You can get a huge bag in the Garden Center at Home Depot or Lowes and it lasts forever. Very inexpensive, too. Why buy those small, expensive bags at the pet store?

Get a mister, so you can keep it damp. I pick out the large pieces, but you probably don't have to...

Or, you can use newspaper and add a humid hide. That's the setup for our corn. I took a disposable tupperware and melted a hole in the side with a butane lighter. I taped around the hole and sides to keep it dark. Put a wad of spaghnum moss from Petsmart or wherever and soak it well. Put on the lid, and place it on the warm end of the viv. They love it. Just keep the moss damp and change out the moss every couple of weeks. You can also flip the moss to help it last longer (resist decay). My snakes spend days in there, esp around shed.

Walt

Walt

I agree I like cypress too. I regrind my own. Resell a little locally. It can come with wood mites, which can not live on snakes, but may annoy them until they die out.

As for store bought, the one that is red and uniformed chunks it nice. I've tried to come up with a way to make it. I just do not have the same material they start with, so I can't. They use large pieces of fir bark. It looks great, but is pricey.

I use aspen for my hognose, I'm out of my regound cypress, so I'm using aspen for other stuff. IF and when Ohio weather breaks lol, I'll regrind some bags. That $800 chipper is really paying off making $2 bags of mulch! lol I'll break even in 2067

>>I've also heard any aromatic, oily woods/barks are bad.
>>
>>I use Cypress Mulch for my milk snake. You can get a huge bag in the Garden Center at Home Depot or Lowes and it lasts forever. Very inexpensive, too. Why buy those small, expensive bags at the pet store?
>>
>>Get a mister, so you can keep it damp. I pick out the large pieces, but you probably don't have to...
>>
>>Or, you can use newspaper and add a humid hide. That's the setup for our corn. I took a disposable tupperware and melted a hole in the side with a butane lighter. I taped around the hole and sides to keep it dark. Put a wad of spaghnum moss from Petsmart or wherever and soak it well. Put on the lid, and place it on the warm end of the viv. They love it. Just keep the moss damp and change out the moss every couple of weeks. You can also flip the moss to help it last longer (resist decay). My snakes spend days in there, esp around shed.
>>
>>Walt
>>
>>Walt
-----
ontogeny recapitulate phylogeny

Charlie Mike

I am your worst nightmare! I have a three-line phone and plenty of time to kill!
(Dale Gribble)

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
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tom

www.herpzilla.com

I know many breeders who have used pine for decades with no ill effects. Not all aromatic woods are harmful. Where there have been problems it is usually with liver disease not RI. Cedar is the bad one.

personally I like aspen and cypress better, but they are both expensive and cypress is not very enviro friendly.

cheers