Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I came home from vacation to find my BP with clear bubbles coming from his mouth. I know this is not healthy, but cannot get him into a vet until at least tomorrow, but more than likely tuesday. Is it something i should worry about immediately? I have him on aspen bedding, and all his temps and humidity are always monitored closely. He's an '05 pastel....any suggestions would be appreciated, thanks in advance.

Jason

RI (respiratory infection). you can do things on your own to help this but my advice is get him to a vet. for now check your temps. warm air hold moisture better than cool air. is your BP in a tank with a screen lid? if so you may want to cover 2/3rds of it with pastic wrap or someting. hows the humidity?

Good luck
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Thanks,
Dave

1.0 Leucistic rat
0.2 Norm Ball Python
1.0 Pastel Ball Python
0.1 Norm BCI
1.0 hypo X hog (sunset cross)
1.1 Anery 66% het stripped snow BCI

Humidity and temps are all good right now, the only thing i can think to do right now is change out the aspen bedding i have in there. Its barely a week old, but i think that im going to go back to paper towel for a while. Thanks for the advice dave.

Jason

First - Are you sure that it is mucus not that he just drank and you caught him with a mouth full of water?

Second - is he exibiting any other signs of an RI - popping, clicking, weezing, yawning, etc.?

Third - if it is an RI and has progressed to the point that he is blowing bubbles then meds prescribed by a vet (and proper temps) are the only thing that will help him get better - get him there as soon as possible. In the meantime - bump the heat and humidity.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

6.42.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi)
0.1.0 Bredls Python (Smurfette)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.0 frogs rescued from pool skimmer
0.0.1 Lizard of unknown origin

I'm pretty sure i heard him weezing, and it was when he was yawning that i noticed the mucus in his mouth. I'm also pretty sure that the only reason there were bubbles is because i was holding him trying to get a closer look at his mouth. I will bump the heat and humidity. I live in a small town and the earliest i can get him to a Vet is Tuesday. Could he die before then? He was fine 6 days ago before i left on vacation and i left him in the care of my roommate. Apparently he didnt understand how serious i was about humidity and heat control. I feel terrible for letting him get sick, because i always take good care of all my animals. Thanks for the advice.

Jason

I have a lemon pastel that got a little run down from breeding and I went on a trip for 2 weeks and when I got back he had oozy bubbles all over the cage and was wheezing and blowing bubbles continuisley. He had proper humidity and temp, so I took him to Mikes at constrictors unlimited and he gave me 9 dosages of an anti-biotic. After the first 4 doses nothing happened. Then on the 5th dose he just stopped weezing and blowing bubbles so I called mike and he told me to keep giving him dosages until they were all gone and now he is breeding again and doing perfectly fine after the last dose. So i would use an anti-biotic and that should help but it is a 50-50 chance but it is better then a 10-90 chance of living. Oh and by the way I gave him the treatment every 3 days.I hope this helps. Call Mike Wilbanks to find out what anti it was.
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BPs are B-E-A-UTIFUL!!!!!

I have found that Baytril works the best when it is injected. That's probably what M. Wilbanks gave the other person, But don't try to get some and do it with out the advise from a experienced keeper or vet. because there is a weight to dose ratio. Sounds like all the advise you have gotten here will put you on the right track. But clean the tank really good with soapy water, elevate the heat a little and put him on newspaper or papertowels until this is cleared up because the mucus will act like a glue when it dries and the aspen will get stuck to his face making it difficult to breath. Good luck, Erick

I have 20 years experience treating patients (humans) in the hospital with respiratory infections as a respiratory therapist. I don't have nearly the experience with ball pythons, but I do have a couple hundred in my personal collection and I have treated several with respiratory infections. The following are my observations and experience.
1. Prevention is the best cure. Keep temps where they should be, and remember that the lower racks will be considerably cooler than the upper racks (especially on a concrete floor in the basement).
2. Time is of the essence. If you catch RI's early, most will resolve by increasing the temps to approx 92 degrees. The snakes immune system works MUCH better at warmer temps. Catching it early means catching it before the animal is blowing bubbles. One of the first signs is continual stargazing. The other thing here is that I prefer to heat the entire cage to around 90 degrees because many snakes still try to seek the cool end if you only raise the hot spot.
3. If the infection has progressed beyond the "early" stages and is blowing bubbles, breathing with it's mouth open, coughing, mucous at the corners of it's mouth etc. you should begin appropriate antibiotic treatment immediately. A delay of a day can mean the difference between life or death for your snake. NEVER delay treatment of a snake with an advanced RI.
4. Culturing - Culturing can never hurt as long as treatment is not delayed waiting to get one. A culture must normally be obtained prior to beginning antibiotic therapy to be useful. If one can be obtained immediately and appropriate treatment begun then a culture can identify specific causitive organisms and the most effective antibiotic. My personal bias would be to never delay treatment more than a few hours in order to get a culture.
5. Antibiotics - there are several antibiotics which are used to treat RI in reptiles (Baytil, Amikin, Fortaz, Tylan, Cipro, etc). They all work, but have individual differences in specificity and side effects. I am not going to discuss individual drugs, doses and specific side effects for particular drugs as I will leave that to your vet. In my experience in the vast majority of cases, early and administration of the CORRECT dose is more important than the specific drug. A large number of animals die due to delay of treatment, and/or to incorrect dose and resulting side effects. These drugs are ALL toxic to varying degrees. They are especially hard on the kidneys and high and/or prolonged doses can permanently damage the kidneys and cause them to shut down which will ultimately result in the death of your snake.
6. Hydration & Humidity - Finally, I am convinced that the convential wisdom of reducing humidity is exactly the WRONG thing to do. Additionally, I think maintaining proper hydration is critical to successfully treating RI's and preventing kidney damage from the medication. I have seen many in this forum recommend decreasing humidity to "dry out the secretions". This is not the thing to do. In the hospital, people with advanced respiratory infections are given fluids and breath air that has been humidified with ultrasonic humidifiers. This added humidity and hydration helps to maintain the viscosity of the mucous and secretions so that the patient is better able to clear them from their lungs and airways. The medications used to treat RI's in snakes tend to have a dehydrating effect on the animal over time and many snakes with RI's do not drink as they normally would. This results in the mucous and secretions in the snakes lungs becoming much thicker and more tenacious and much harder to clear. Also, when a snake is dehydrated, the medications are much harder on the animals kidneys. For this reason, I now administer fluids (3-5cc fluid for each 100 grams of body weight given with a syringe with a long bulbed needle) once a week to all snakes that I am treating for RI's and I have noticed a profound improvement in outcomes. The difference the fluid therapy makes has been nothing short of remarkable in my experience.
Hope others find this useful.
Grant Whitmer

I wanted to thank everybody for all of their advice. I took my BP to the Vet today, and i have him started on anti biotics. Hopefully all will be well 10 days from now.

Jason

Just an update. I got my BP into the vet and she gave me antibiotics for the little guy. Its my first time injecting a snake so i was really nervous the first time. I dont think i did it completely because there was a big lump after i did it. Anyway, thanks again for all your help.

Jason