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the longest males go without eating

xblackheart Mar 24, 2006 01:24 AM

One of my male's last meal was two weeks before I brumated him back in November. He has still been refusuing food. He has shrunk considerably. When can I expect him to start eating again? 5 months just seems like a crazy long time to not eat. If mating season does not end until may, he may not eat for 7 months. I offer food all the time, even keep him in a container over night with it. He is not deathly skinny, or anything, but what is the max time until I should start to worry and maybe even force feed? I will try the feeding tricks that I use for hatchling before force feeding, of course. I just want to know if 5 months or more is normal. My other male that is still refusing food did not start brumation until late december and he is still looking good.
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**********Misty**********
Stress is when you wake up screaming and then you realize that you haven't gone to sleep yet.

2.3.0 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.3.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.0.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog

Replies (10)

HerpZillA Mar 24, 2006 10:55 AM

Yea that is a long time Misty. When I have had snakes like that I just go through what ever tricks I can do. I may change the food, trying to find something he is interested in. rats mice and er other rodents available. Although I hate getting things hooked on odd food items, but at 5 months I would try.

Also temp changes, my first option is always a bit warmer, then I may actually try a week or so cooler. Kind of a semi brumation to get him to snap out of it. If you can get him to strike (probably not, but it works great with babies) I "slap feed" forceps, sometime they strike and grab it, if he gets it in his mouth get away not to distract him at all. Again I've used this with great success in babies, adult corns just do not strike.

Then also change substrate. Some people use wild mice (be careful on that).

But if he was big enough to brumate, he must be at least 3'? At some point I will say enough is enough. At that size I'd put a pinky rat in his mouth, not a full force feed and see if he is willing to take it down. I would start small to get his stomach going again. Try to start by just getting the feed items head hooked on his teeth so when he tries to back up it does not fall out right away. Again, they are so easily distracted so make sure there is nothing to do that. You, maybe a view of other snakes etc. To me, if they take it down like this that is the best type of "force feed". Yea you put it in his mouth, but he also willing took it down. If he doesn't, try a few times, keeping in note the stress on the snake. If no success try a little further after a day or so for him to rest.

I wish you the best of luck, corns usually come around, even if you have to make them.

tom

>>One of my male's last meal was two weeks before I brumated him back in November. He has still been refusuing food. He has shrunk considerably. When can I expect him to start eating again? 5 months just seems like a crazy long time to not eat. If mating season does not end until may, he may not eat for 7 months. I offer food all the time, even keep him in a container over night with it. He is not deathly skinny, or anything, but what is the max time until I should start to worry and maybe even force feed? I will try the feeding tricks that I use for hatchling before force feeding, of course. I just want to know if 5 months or more is normal. My other male that is still refusing food did not start brumation until late december and he is still looking good.
>>-----
>>**********Misty**********
>>Stress is when you wake up screaming and then you realize that you haven't gone to sleep yet.
>>
>>2.3.0 bearded dragons
>>0.1.0 water dragon
>>1.3.0 leopard geckos
>>12.20.0 corn snakes
>>1.1.0 jungle corns
>>2.3.0 king snakes
>>1.1.0 false water cobras
>>1.0.0 royal (Ball) pythons
>>0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
>>1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
>>0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
>>0.1.0 rat snake
>>0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
>>0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
>>1.1.0 emperor scorpions
>>1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
>>0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog
-----
ontogeny recapitulate phylogeny

Charlie Mike

I am your worst nightmare! I have a three-line phone and plenty of time to kill!
(Dale Gribble)

1.3 Bearded Dragons
6 baby female Western hognose, 3.5 adults some friend some mine,,,building breeding stock)
1 Corn snake (bloodred) 0.2 1 MIA In the house I hope
1 baby creamcycle 0.1
2 Okeettes I think? 1.1 youngens
ochrocephala oratrix 0.0.1? Adult, and a killer!
ochrocephala auropalliata 0.0.1? Adult
2.0 Dogs,
0.2 Cats,,
0.1 Wives, (Long term captive!,, I mean ME!)
1.1 Kids (Paininthearsius takamemonii) J/K great kids
-----
tom

www.herpzilla.com

APLAXAR Mar 24, 2006 12:25 PM

My male king and corn ate their fist meal this morning after comming out a week ago, i fed a small hopper each, the king didnt hesitate much, the corn hesitated alittle, he grabbed it wrapped it up and then dropped it, i picked it back up with hemostat he hit it again right on the head perfectly and then took it down, while reading Kathy Love's new book she says that she has had few experiences with males that almost starve themselves to death, but they usually come out of it, so hopefully it is just heat, or he just inst ready yet.

adam

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1.2 THAYERI
1.2 SPLENDIDA (1.0 ALBINO/ 0.2 HYPO)
1.1 CORNS SNAKES (0.1 SNOW/ 1.0 STRIPEDSUNGLOW)
0.1 REDFOOT TORTOISE
1.0 LEOPARD TORTOISE
0.1 PYXIE FROG
0.0.1 HORNED FROG
0.0.1 TADPOLES

xblackheart Mar 24, 2006 07:35 PM

He was one of my breeders, so has been back to normal heat since Feb 14th. I have tried live pinkie mice, and a few other tricks. I will try a couple more. He seems to only want to mate and does not care about food. My other "stud" has been eating between matings just fine. I will see how things go this week.
-----
**********Misty**********
Stress is when you wake up screaming and then you realize that you haven't gone to sleep yet.

1.1.3 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.3.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.0.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog

draybar Mar 24, 2006 08:03 PM

>>One of my male's last meal was two weeks before I brumated him back in November. He has still been refusuing food. He has shrunk considerably. When can I expect him to start eating again? 5 months just seems like a crazy long time to not eat. If mating season does not end until may, he may not eat for 7 months. I offer food all the time, even keep him in a container over night with it. He is not deathly skinny, or anything, but what is the max time until I should start to worry and maybe even force feed? I will try the feeding tricks that I use for hatchling before force feeding, of course. I just want to know if 5 months or more is normal. My other male that is still refusing food did not start brumation until late december and he is still looking good.
>>-----

wow, five months is a long time.
Five or six weeks to a couple of months, I probably wouldn't be too worried but that seems to be getting to the point where weight could start to drop quickly.
I have never dealt with a non-feeding adult but I would assume that a lot of the same tricks used to get hatchlings started might work to get adults feeding.
I think I would start looking at some of these options.
I would also go with smaller prey.
Maybe try something like a live fuzzie to begin with.
Then maybe try scenting a live fuzzie if a normal one doesn't work and just work from there
I have read that deer mice seem to do well at getting snakes to eat but I have no real idea where you would find them.
Hopefully someone with more experience in non-feeding adults can go into more specifics.
Good luck
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)

Draybars Snakes

_____

xblackheart Mar 24, 2006 11:18 PM

The 5 months includes the 3 months he was in brumation. I have tried different sizes of food, live and frozen. I tried to partial force feed him today. I got the rat pinkie started down his throat, on his teeth, but he tried real hard and finally got it out of his mouth. I brained a pinkie(dead) and have him in a container with it now. Hopefully he will start to eat again soon. In 3 years, I have not had this problem with him. This is his first year breeding, so maybe the only year that I will have this proble (I hope).
Would it be harmful to totally force feed an adult? I mean if I am careful with his jaw. I just noticed that he was able to push the pinkie back up with more force than the baby that I have that won't eat. (yes, I am still force feeding the little girl. - she still has no interest in food on her own)

Here are pics of my male adult, about 2 weeks ago.
And of course the anery baby that still refuses food

-----
**********Misty**********
Stress is when you wake up screaming and then you realize that you haven't gone to sleep yet.

1.1.3 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.3.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.0.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog

Kel Mar 25, 2006 09:56 AM

I had one that ate only twice in seven months. He went on hunger strike in the October when I moved house (upset by the upheaval I guess) then that ran into breeding season. He started eating in the May when I tried hand feeding him. I then had to hand feed for a further six months before he went back to his old eating pattern of just taking the mouse when he was put in the feeding tank with it.

Seven months should be OK as long as he doesn't lose loads of weight or start to show other signs of illness. If you're worried you could put supplements in his water to give him a boost. I'd alternate a probiotic (so that when he does decide to eat, his digestion will be up to it) with a vitamin/mineral supplement like Critical Care Formula.

xblackheart Mar 25, 2006 02:39 PM

Do they make vitamins specifically for snakes or is it a general reptile supplement?
Info on anything any of you use would be great.
-----
**********Misty**********
Stress is when you wake up screaming and then you realize that you haven't gone to sleep yet.

1.1.3 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.3.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.0.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog

BlueKing Mar 25, 2006 09:59 PM

Should be fine for a while as long as he retains most of his weight. If he gets a little skinnier, that's okay too. Remember, in the wild you will almost always find healthy snakes much skinnier than captive born ones of the same species. As long as all of his ribs don't start showing, you should be alright! I currently have a male, six foot kingsnake that has refused rats (his usual meal), mice, fuzzies (live or dead) and hasn't eaten since late November. But he's doing his job as a breeder and enjoying it!!! He's very healthy, still pretty thick and all over the females, LOL!!! I'm sure that once he's had a few copulations and settles down, his mind'll go back to rats!!!

Zee
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"I am an expert on everything, but I know so little and have so much to learn!" -Carsten "Zee" Zoldy-

xblackheart Mar 26, 2006 12:58 AM

I feel a little better now, knowing that I am not the only one who has a male that has not eaten since November. My male did his breeding duties (as I only had one female for him and only paired hem twice). He is not too skinny. If he starts to lose weight, I will seek other measures.

Can anyone recommend a good water supplement?

And still need an answer to whether or not it is safe to force feed an adult (if you are careful to not break their jaw)?
I know adults have stronger muscle ability, so I was wondering if they had stronger neck muscles than babies. If it comes down to it, will I hurt anything by forcing food into my male?
-----
**********Misty**********
Stress is when you wake up screaming and then you realize that you haven't gone to sleep yet.

1.1.3 bearded dragons
0.1.0 water dragon
1.3.0 leopard geckos
12.20.0 corn snakes
1.1.0 jungle corns
2.3.0 king snakes
1.1.0 false water cobras
1.0.0 royal (Ball) pythons
0.1.0 kenyan sand boa
1.0.0 Sinaloan milk snake
0.1.0 Tri-Hybrid milk snake
0.1.0 rat snake
0.0.2 prairie ringneck snakes
0.1.0 chilean rose hair tarantula
1.1.0 emperor scorpions
1.1.0 Congo African Grey Parrots
0.1.0 German Shepherd hybrid dog

BlueKing Mar 27, 2006 08:10 PM

Don't know about any water supplements (and NEVER needed them), but I CAN tell you that force feeding an adult is a lot easier AND is easier on the adults than it is on the youger ones or babies. Just make sure IF you do resort to force feeding, that you force feed SMALL meals only, ie: A four foot snake would get fuzzies. A three foot snake would get large pinkies. Hope this helps . . . And yes, force feeding (small meals) HAS helped me several times in the past . . .

Zee
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"I am an expert on everything, but I know so little and have so much to learn!" -Carsten "Zee" Zoldy-

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