Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Full article availabe at URL through a PDF link

Suicide Attempt by the Intravenous Injection of Rattlesnake Venom.
Southern Medical Journal. 99(3):282-284, March 2006.
Morgan, David L. MD; Blair, Hollie W. RPH; Ramsey, Ryan P. MD
Abstract:
A 14-year-old male milked the venom from a rattlesnake and injected it with a syringe into his right antecubital vein in a suicide attempt. He immediately developed severe pain and vomiting, then hypotension, swollen lips and tongue, and coma. The injection site did not have the considerable tissue damage seen with severe rattlesnake envenomation. Critical hematological abnormalities, gastrointestinal bleeding, and hematuria developed over 24 hours. He received crotalidae polyvalent immune fab (ovine) antivenom and was discharged after 5 days without sequela. This patient's clinical findings were similar to those seen in patients bitten by rattlesnakes with rare intravenous envenomation.

http://www.smajournalonline.com/pt/re/smj/abstract.00007611-200603000-00022.htm;jsessionid=EngDqKv90uaamG3c1JcQxWezfyBhBHj0wgNnXhPtablQqgBtt0vC!-1861031787!-949856144!9001!-1

Killer article Wes!

Thanks a ton.

Jason
-----
www.buckeyeherps.com

I could not get access to the journal. I tried a guest log in and I still think they want payment before I can get to the document.

Darn.
Sorry about that ladies and gents. Yours truly should have checked the links before announcing that you could pick them up at that site. It seems as if they want $12 to access the item if you don't already subscribe to their journal.
Sorry about that.
Maybe the item is available at one of the libraries within the region?
abashed
Wes

I might try and tap into some of the data bases I have subscriptions to through the University. Interesting case. The attention to detail was what really surprised me. How the kid got the snake milked without getting bitten in the first place was kind of a shock. Well, I guess the abstract never said he didn't.

Talk about a painful method

Yeah I also wasn't able to access it, but it will soon be available through school. I did some searching and it doesn't look like they have any March issues up yet, but when I get I will let everyone know.

Jason
-----
www.buckeyeherps.com

The medical center is in Temple, TX, so I would say it most likely was C. atrox

Cheers!

Al
-----
Confidence is what you feel before you comprehend the situation.

Here's the abstract from another write-up in 2003 with a few more details:

Intravenous injection of rattlesnake venom
Blair, HW; Ramsey, RP; Morgan, DL
Journal of Toxicology: Clinical Toxicology [J. Toxicol.: Clin. Toxicol.]. Vol. 41, no. 5, p. 701. Aug 2003.

Intentional intravenous (IV) injection of various substances such as lamp oil, mercury, cyanide, arsenic, sublimate solution, and bleach have been reported to the Toxic Exposure Surveillance System. A thorough literature search revealed three reported cases of suspected self-injected IV rattlesnake envenomation, however we report the only known case of intentional IV injection. A 14 year-old male found vomiting and confused on a roadway stated to EMS that he "injected snake into myself." It was later determined he had milked a rattlesnake and then injected the contents with a syringe into his right antecubital vein in a suicide attempt. Intense pain immediately followed, and patient sought help. His right antecubital fossa had an area of erythema with multiple pinpoint petechiae. He was confused, tachycardic, unable to protect his airway, and a blood pressure could not be obtained. He was intubated, begun on a dopamine drip, and initially received 4 vials of CroFab registered antivenom. Initial laboratory tests showed an elevated white blood cell count, elevated INR, and decreased platelets. The patient's hospital course was complicated by a gastrointestinal bleed. He received a total of 22 vials of CroFab, 2 units of fresh frozen plasma, 6 units of platelets, IV fluids, and supportive care. The laboratory values returned to near normal within a few days. The patient was discharged on the 5th day with a normal physical examination. Although other reports of suspected IV rattlesnake envenomation were found in the literature, we report the first known self-inflicted injection. Despite the rapid onset of life-threatening symptoms, this patient was managed successfully with antivenin and supportive care.

Descriptors: Venom; Toxins; Crotalus

sorry but if you want to end your life...just do it right the first time and dont take a needed supply away from other people

Thats a whole lot of effort for that desired end result...i wonder if there is a bit more to this story

The kid is 14!

Did it say if he found the snake and did this or was he keeping it?

>>sorry but if you want to end your life...just do it right the first time and dont take a needed supply away from other people

It hurts me that people, such as yourself, might share this view. Ever been touched by suicide? Ever consider the people this kid would be leaving behind? I, for one, am glad he didn't "do it right the first time." He needs help and, in my opinion, is more deserving of the crofab than the venomous snake keeper. How many of us are contributing to scientific knowledge through our venomous snake hobby? The vast majority of us do it because of our love and fascination with these creatures...ultimately selfish motives. On the other hand, we've got a confused kid who didn't feel that life was worth living for some reason or other. To wish ill upon him is disgusting. Maybe, just maybe, some of us need to reevaluate how much value we place on human life.

Regards,
Wes Anderson
-----
Pro Humanitate...
Peux ce que veux. Allons-y.
Davidson College Herpetology

The second article says it was written in 2003? Might be interesting to find out if any other problems set in later down the road-it's sad that it happened, but there might be other things that could be learned about the venom from this case, being one of 3? cases of IV envenomation.

Well said, Wes. You're not the only one that shares your views.

from suicide thoughts and was a keeper of hots and thought of ending my life with venom among other methods. I called a local suicide watch program that got me in to a therapist and medication for very deep depression. Some of you know me on these forums as a poster and or my years as a west Texas hunter, expo/reptile show attender of past, a breeder of past, a hot keeper of past and of my retail pet and reptile store/s of Kansas City. I am not embarrass to tell all of my thought and desire to end my life. While my suicidal thoughts have diminished, I will be on anti-depressant for awhile. I can tell you there is NO right way of suicide. One cannot determine " why don't they do it right " scenario unless you have been in that mode of thought or something that led to it. My .02 cents.
-----
I may be old , cantankerous, crabby, and cynical, but......

Thanks for sharing your story. That took a lot! As an internet developer I have gone through many jobs over the past few years and fell into a deep depression at one point. You don't realize how bad it has gotten till you are right at the end. For me it was a mixture of job loss, an already existing chronic illness flair up from the stress, and those wonderful anti-depressents (the one they had me on had NOW has a side effect of depression listed) that had me sitting there with one of my swords figuring the best way to fix it into place. At that point I realized there was a problem. The thing that stopped me was that I looked at it as the coward's way out- NOT meaning that any other way but for me and my situation.

Bottom line, if someone is thinking those thoughts venomous snakes are not the best thing to be around. I can not imagine how painful that would be...
-----
Bryan, Atlanta GA

1-0-0 Rescued Ball Python - Apep
0-1-0 Rescued Mountain Horned Dragon - Ki
0-0-1 Rescued Aggressive Bearded Dragon - Zeus
0-0-1 Rescued Non-Alpha Green Iguana - Bud
1-1-0 Rescued Rats... no wait... ROTTEN Little Cats - Ra, Bastet
0-0-1 Rescued Dieting Panda Hamster - Mr. Fluffy
0-1-0 Rescued Little Angelic Kitten - Isis
1-0-0 Horse... whoops... BIG Golden Retriever - Jake
0-1-0 Wife
2-0-0 Kids

Why all of a sudden is this confused? needed sympathy?

"ultimately selfish motives. On the other hand, we've got a confused kid who didn't feel that life was worth living for some reason or other."

Is not suicide selfish? Human being in nature is selfish. and there are 6.6 BILLION of us KILLING this earth as we speak.. to be completely insensitive, whats one less? one less that is ruining, or possibly destroying our hobby by bringing it into such light..."boy commits suicide by rattlesnake... LETS KILL ALL SNAKES so this doent happen" would be the next headline

" To wish ill upon him is disgusting. Maybe, just maybe, some of us need to reevaluate how much value we place on human life."

I have never wished ILL on this kid, just dont call out for attention when your not willing to go through with your intentions

I also don't believe any of you know me well enough to know whether I have had suicidal thoughts or not, whether I have tried to commit suicide before or not. Do not pass judgement on others.

"let he who is guilt free throw the first stone in a glass house"
PatrickR

>>Why all of a sudden is this confused? needed sympathy?
-----
Pro Humanitate...
Peux ce que veux. Allons-y.
Davidson College Herpetology

Why does he need sympathy? Because each life is of infinite worth. If others could only realize that, we would be better off in every possible way including economically, and in turn ecologically.

Why do I assume he is confused? Because he is a 14 year old kid. Years back I had a friend who committed suicide at age 15. He had great family and friends, was a super nice kid himself and seemed to have everything going for him. At such an age how can someone be anything but confused if they want to end their life?

I have no knowledge about your experiences with suicide. Never claimed to. The questions I posed were more of a way of saying that I have experienced those things, and from our vastly differing viewpoints I had the feeling that our experiences may not be close to the same.

I don't have time to write out a full reply, but when I accidently submitted a blank message with a title of "Because" I did not want anyone to think I was being merely childish. I will finish this reply later if I feel an additional reply is warranted. Have a good one.

Regards,
Wes Anderson

>>Why all of a sudden is this confused? needed sympathy?
>>
>>"ultimately selfish motives. On the other hand, we've got a confused kid who didn't feel that life was worth living for some reason or other."
>>
>>Is not suicide selfish? Human being in nature is selfish. and there are 6.6 BILLION of us KILLING this earth as we speak.. to be completely insensitive, whats one less? one less that is ruining, or possibly destroying our hobby by bringing it into such light..."boy commits suicide by rattlesnake... LETS KILL ALL SNAKES so this doent happen" would be the next headline
>>
>>" To wish ill upon him is disgusting. Maybe, just maybe, some of us need to reevaluate how much value we place on human life."
>>
>>I have never wished ILL on this kid, just dont call out for attention when your not willing to go through with your intentions
>>
>>I also don't believe any of you know me well enough to know whether I have had suicidal thoughts or not, whether I have tried to commit suicide before or not. Do not pass judgement on others.
>>
>>"let he who is guilt free throw the first stone in a glass house"
>>PatrickR
-----
Pro Humanitate...
Peux ce que veux. Allons-y.
Davidson College Herpetology

Gee Mike!
We didn't know!
Depression is a VERY real ailment and Bonnie and I wish you success in your treatment.
You have always been a stand-up guy and a great vendor at our shows and we hope your recovery stays on track!

Randal

Anyone who is interested can email me and I will send them the medical case report describing this incident.

BTW: It was venom from a WDB (C. atrox)

Cheers!

Al
-----
Confidence is what you feel before you comprehend the situation.