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For cochran: Hognose star gazing

Colchicine Mar 29, 2006 09:30 PM

Cochran:
Your original post was removed because it violated the TOS, but I wanted a chance to respond to your post anyway.

For others, his post referred to his hognose being fed exclusively mice, but he somehow made a connection between diet and his hognose's behavior of "stargazing".

I have appreciated you backing me up on the diet controversies in the past, and I am telling you now that I am sure that of all the crazy things people have thought of about mice being a detriment to hognoses, neurological disorders is not one I have ever seen listed. The stargazing behavior you described, can be more easily attributed to chemical toxinosis, bacterial or viral infection, trauma to the head, and even parasites. I would have a hard time figuring out a mechanism by which diet alone could be responsible for this problem. Given the list of possibilities above, I hope you can understand that this behavior can be a sign of a serious problem. Giving it away for someone else to figure it out won't solve it, but taking it to the veterinarian will. Since I haven't heard of this behavior being reported in hognoses before on this forum, I would very much like to hear about the diagnosis. A good luck!
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Virginia Herping
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VaHS
Virginia Herpetological Society
http://fwie.fw.vt.edu/VHS

"The irrational fear of snakes is the only excuse a grown man has... to act like a complete sissy" - Colchicine

... nature has ceased to be what it always had been - what people needed protection from. Now nature - tamed, endangered, mortal - needs to be protected from people. When we are afraid, we shoot. But when we are nostalgic, we take pictures.
Susan Sontag

Replies (6)

joeysgreen Mar 29, 2006 11:46 PM

I don't want to push the envelope, but Boid Inclusion Body Disease-like viral inclusion bodies have been found in a few colubrids (namely neonate cornsnakes) that died shortly after symptoms. If I recal correctly they did star-gaze, but it was never determined if the disease that is generally considered boid exclusive is capable of passing to colubrids. Consider sending the body /- samples via your vet to the U of Florida (or U of Guelph if in Canada) for postmortem and histopathology.

Ian

DarylLai Mar 30, 2006 12:40 PM

Good thing you brought this up because my hognose took a fall right before he changed his feeding behavior posted here - http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1044002,1044002

He was "star-gazing" for almost a month, but he no longer does it and acts like himself. Do you think there was any damage done to the head? Correct me if I'm wrong but I doubt a vet could do anything about this, especially if it's from a fall.

Daryl
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SP Engineering (www.sp-power.com)
x.x Green Tree Python
1.0 Western Dusty Hognose
x.x Pacman Frog

joeysgreen Apr 02, 2006 06:53 AM

IF the neurological problems are from trauma to the head, medications can be given to shorten the healing time, and hopefully reduce long term effects and likelyhood of death.

(ex. steriods, anti-inflammatories, and diuretics all prove usefull in reducing pressure on the brain for certian cases)

Hope this helps

Ian

cochran Apr 02, 2006 03:40 PM

Thanks for the advice but, after doing a little reading I've came to the conclusin that there may be no problem after all.My hog really is'nt "stargazing" after all,she exhibits a climbing like movement when i'm holding her But, on the ground she acts fine.I've seen a boa stargaze before and it held its head in a sharp right angle to its body.Bad use of terminology on my part. sorry!, jeff

jmartinix Apr 06, 2006 03:19 PM

can anyone please explain to me what star gazing is? i'm new to the snake world, with my first hognose.
thanks.

cochran Mar 30, 2006 01:49 PM

hey!, thanks for the fast response to my previous post.I also need to apologize for my bad judgement and bad terminology.You are correct about stargazing(I used the wrong term to describe my hogs behaviour)Maybe there is no problem after all.When she is on the ground she crawls normally but,when I'm holding her she acts like she is reaching for a limb or something to climb onto,kinda like an arboreal snake would do.Also as for her head shape,it looks like she still has that "baby" snake look.nothing like my W/c adults.I will post pics as soon as I can. Thanks! jeff

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