Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Thanks to all the posted suggestions in review #1 thread. I think I've gotten most of the suggestions in. Sorry for whatever I may have missed. Please review again and let me know what I may be missing.

Terms:

Mutant gene = any gene that is different from the corresponding normal gene. Not necessarily a visual mutation.

Het = heterozygous = having two different genes within a gene pair. Most commonly one normal and one mutant but could be two different mutant genes.

Homo = Homozygous = having both genes within a gene pair the same. Can be normal or mutant.

Super = slang term commonly used for Homo dominant mutant gene pair.

Trait = Physical appearance that it distinguishable from normal.

Recessive = Trait is only expressed when the gene pair is Homo for the specific mutant gene.

Dominant = Trait is expressed when the gene pair is Het or Homo for the specific mutant gene. Het and Homo specimens are not 100% distinguishable from each other. Note, in some Dominant traits some of the specimens can be visually identified as Het or Homo.

Codominant = Similar to Dominant except the Homo specimen will have a 100% distinguishable appearance from a Het specimen.

Double Het = has two gene pairs where one gene in each pair is normal and the second gene is a mutant gene. Ie double Het for snow would have a normal gene paired with an albino gene and a normal gene paired with an anerythristic gene.

Triple Het = same as double Het except applies to three gene pairs.

Color mutations in boas:

Albino/Amelanistic (Tyrosinase negative): Recessive - a lack of melanin (black pigmentation) Kahl and Sharp strains.

Anerythristic - Recessive - a lack ______ (red pigmentation) two known strains (type I and type II)

Hypomelanistic - Hypo - Dominant - a reduction in the black pigmentation

Caramel Albino (Tyrosinase positive) : Recessive - Colombian and Nicaraguan strains

Caramel Hypo (Boawoman Hypo)-recessive-a Hypomelanistic trait with similarities to Colombian T-plus Albinos and Pastels.

Pastel - Polygenic - A line of boas selectively bred for less than normal black pigment, not related to a single gene pair.

Blood - Recessive - A Hypererythristic mutation.

Named Color mutation combinations:

Ghost – homozygous anerythristic / heterozygous hypomelanistic
Super Ghost - homozygous anerythristic / homozygous hypomelanistic
Snow – homozygous anerythristic / homozygous albino
Sunglow – homozygous albino / heterozygous hypomelanistic
Super Sunglow - homozygous albino / heterozygous hypomelanistic
Bloody Salmon – homozygous blood / heterozygous hypomelanistic
Moonglow – homozygous anerythristic / homozygous albino / heterozygous hypomelanistic
Super Moonglow – homozygous anerythristic / homozygous albino / homozygous hypomelanistic
Pewter - homozygous type II anerythristic / homozygous blood
Caramel Hypo (Boawoman hypo)- ??????

Locale Related Color Mutations:
Sunset – homozygous hypomelanistic having 50% Hog Island Boa blood
Salmontine – heterozygous hypomelanistic having 50% Argentine Boa blood

Pattern Mutations:
Arabesque – Dominant?
Jungle – Codominant - Originally identified in Sweden,
Motley – Codominant
Stripe – Recessive
Reverse Stripe – Recessive?
Leopard – Recessive - dark color, a mix of underlying tones and marbled pattern.
European Squaretail - Recessive - long list of variable characteristics.
Scoria - Recessive? - Pink pattern-less with two parallel lines down back.
Aztec - Dominant?
Gray pattern-less - unknown
-----
Thanks,

Dave "Rainbows-R-Us"

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB)
2.7 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (adult breeders)
2.5 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2004)
4.8 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2005)
2.1 Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 Het for Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 BCI "Elvira" normal from 1989
1.0 BCI albino / het-anery
0.1 BCI Hypo / het-albino
0.1 BCI Anery / het-albino
0.1 BCI Hypo (possible super)
1.0 BCI albino het stripe
1.0 BCI salmon hypo
0.1 BCI ghost

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

for the pattern morphs!!

I don't have any myself YET!
-----
Thanks,

Dave "Rainbows-R-Us"

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB)
2.7 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (adult breeders)
2.5 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2004)
4.8 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2005)
2.1 Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 Het for Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 BCI "Elvira" normal from 1989
1.0 BCI albino / het-anery
0.1 BCI Hypo / het-albino
0.1 BCI Anery / het-albino
0.1 BCI Hypo (possible super)
1.0 BCI albino het stripe
1.0 BCI salmon hypo
0.1 BCI ghost

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

I don't have time to go into detail on all of the genes, I have a plane to catch... but here's a quickie on my personal favorite gene.

Arabasque- (btw... I believe is co-dom, but not 100% sure)

A genetic circle-back boa with a ladder-tail, often having a very brown color with some specimins having a beautiful pink tint to them. Recently it was brought up that they have longer, narrower heads than your typical boa. Still in debate whether its a BCC or BCI.

As for co-dom/dom, I'll find out soon enough. Here I go braggin' again about my new female, a Pete Kahl produced/holdback 2003 Arabasque 100% het albino who has a date with one of my albino males very soon. You guys are gonna get sick of hearing about this girl by the time I'm done. haha

Thanks, you prove it Codom and I'll change it GOOD LUCK with that pairing.

I'll add this to my description:

A genetic circle-back boa with a ladder-tail, often having a very brown color with some specimins tinted pink.
-----
Thanks,

Dave "Rainbows-R-Us"

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB)
2.7 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (adult breeders)
2.5 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2004)
4.8 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2005)
2.1 Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 Het for Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 BCI "Elvira" normal from 1989
1.0 BCI albino / het-anery
0.1 BCI Hypo / het-albino
0.1 BCI Anery / het-albino
0.1 BCI Hypo (possible super)
1.0 BCI albino het stripe
1.0 BCI salmon hypo
0.1 BCI ghost

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

I would almost say you had to add in that they are almost always highly speckled.
With everyone so concerned about 'clean' boas, I think that is why this mutation has been on the back burner for so long.
-----
- Jason F.

Arabesque – Dominant? - A genetic circle-back boa with a ladder-tail, Typically highly speckled and often having a very brown color with some specimins tinted pink.
-----
Thanks,

Dave "Rainbows-R-Us"

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB)
2.7 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (adult breeders)
2.5 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2004)
4.8 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2005)
2.1 Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 Het for Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 BCI "Elvira" normal from 1989
1.0 BCI albino / het-anery
0.1 BCI Hypo / het-albino
0.1 BCI Anery / het-albino
0.1 BCI Hypo (possible super)
1.0 BCI albino het stripe
1.0 BCI salmon hypo
0.1 BCI ghost

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Ok good ... now just put it all on a web page so that we can direct everyone there when they ask questions about genetics.
-----
- Jason F.

"Ok good ... now just put it all on a web page so that we can direct everyone there when they ask questions about genetics."
-----
- Jason F.

I've been tinkering around with this same idea for some time - just haven't done anything with it yet. I purchased the domain: www.boagenetics.com about a year ago with the intent of doing something like this. Right now, the domain just points to my web site, but I'm willing to set up an actual page with the info gathered here.

I just don't want to post anybody else's work without their permission. If all of the contributors to this thread are in agreement, I'll be happy to set up a page with the information posted on this thread.

What do you all think about this?

email me and I can send it to you.
-----
Thanks,

Dave "Rainbows-R-Us"

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB)
2.7 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (adult breeders)
2.5 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2004)
4.8 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (sub-adult from 2005)
2.1 Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 Het for Hypomelanistic BRB
0.1 BCI "Elvira" normal from 1989
1.0 BCI albino / het-anery
0.1 BCI Hypo / het-albino
0.1 BCI Anery / het-albino
0.1 BCI Hypo (possible super)
1.0 BCI albino het stripe
1.0 BCI salmon hypo
0.1 BCI ghost

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

I am deffinately for it. I would even suggest contacting people to get permision to post history information about the genetics similar to the boa morph page available from kingsnake. Information such as that which is on Peter Kahls website about the history of the albino mutation and from Rich Ihle with the salmon mutation etc.

Deffinately post the link when its completed.
-----
- Jason F.

sounds like a great idea! I'd love to see it, please post a link when it's finished.

I posted in yesterday's thread about there not being any known tyrosinase negative albino boa constrictors.

It might help put over the dominant/recessive/codominant thing if you made a table 4 rows x 4 columns.

(blank cell) | 2 mutant genes | 1 mutant gene paired with 1 normal gene | 2 normal genes
Dominant mutant gene | (combination of columns 2,3) Snake does not look normal | Snake looks normal
Recessive mutant gene | Snake does not look normal | (combination of columns 3,4) Snake looks normal
Codominant mutant gene | snake does not look normal | Snake does not look normal and does not look like the snake with two mutant genes | Snake looks normal.

Unfortunately, I don't know how to do a table on these forums.

Paul Hollander

What about adding a list of bloodlines like harlequin, lipstick, bubble gum, scarlet, coral, orangasm, ronne pastel, davey pastel, salmon hypo, orange tail hypo, and so on. Anyone else have any other bloodlines they would like to add.
Michael Burton

Not to be mean or put down your idea, but what does that have to do with genetics.
With all do respect the bloodline names are designed to give credit to the individual(s) who put in their efforts to develop the quality of animals associated with that bloodline. Although they are distinguished from non-named bloodlines, the are still working with the same genetic mutations (lipstick albino is still just an albino).

I appologize if I am out of place but i just dont see how named bloodlines fit with genetics.
-----
- Jason F.

No not out of place at all. I would just like to see a list of all of the bloodlines as well. Not saying they have different genetics or anything. It would be nice to have a morph list a morph combo list and hopefully a bloodline list.
Michael Burton

I understand. I guess that would be helpful but any breeder could just make up a name for their line and the list could be endless.
-----
- Jason F.

Major changes -- "Homo" is also slang for "homosexual" so I prefer not to use "Homo" at all. I have also taken the liberty of changing "het" and "homo" to "heterozygous" and "homozygous" in this file. Slang terms are okay for conversation and run of the mill forum posts, but I think we should aim a little higher for more educational stuff. I added "wild type or normal" and added "mutant gene" to "dominant", "dominant", and "recessive". I tried to make the phrasing smoother and picked up a few spelling errors. The final version should be run through a spelling checker before posting.

Wonder what I missed.

Paul Hollander

>Terms:
>
>Mutant gene = any gene that is different from the corresponding normal gene. Not necessarily a visual mutation.

Wild type or normal = A snake that looks like most of the snakes found in the wild. The gene at each locus that is found in a snake that looks like most of the snakes found in the wild.

>Het = heterozygous = having two different genes within a gene pair. Most commonly one normal and one mutant but could be two different mutant genes.

Heterozygous (slang - het) = having two different genes within a gene pair. Most commonly one normal and one mutant gene but could be two different mutant genes.

>Homo = Homozygous = having both genes within a gene pair the same. Can be normal or mutant.

Homozygous = having both genes in a gene pair the same. Can be normal or mutant genes.

>Super = slang term commonly used for Homo dominant mutant gene pair.

Super = Slang term commonly used when a snake has a gene pair that is homozygous for either a dominant or a codominant mutant gene.

>Trait = Physical appearance that it distinguishable from normal.

Trait = A physical appearance that is distinguishable from the normal physical appearance.

>Recessive = Trait is only expressed when the gene pair is Homo for the specific mutant gene.

Recessive mutant gene = A mutant gene that has its trait expressed only when the gene pair is homozygous for the specific mutant gene. A heterozygous individual looks normal.

>Dominant = Trait is expressed when the gene pair is Het or Homo for the specific mutant gene. Het and Homo specimens are not 100% distinguishable from each other. Note, in some Dominant traits some of the specimens can be visually identified as Het or Homo.

Dominant mutant gene = A mutant gene that has its trait expressed when the gene pair is either heterozygous or homozygous for the specific mutant gene. Heterozygous and homozygous specimens are not 100% distinguishable from each other. Note, with some dominant mutants, some of the specimens can be visually identified as heterozygous or homozygous.

>Codominant = Similar to Dominant except the Homo specimen will have a 100% distinguishable appearance from a Het specimen.

Codominant mutant gene = Similar to "dominant mutant gene" except a homozygous specimen can be distinguished from a heterozygous specimen 100% of the time.

>Double Het = has two gene pairs where one gene in each pair is normal and the second gene is a mutant gene. Ie double Het for snow would have a normal gene paired with an albino gene and a normal gene paired with an anerythristic gene.

Double het = Has two gene pairs where one gene in each pair is normal and the second gene is a mutant gene. I.e., double het for snow would have a normal gene paired with an albino gene and a normal gene paired with an anerythristic gene.

>Triple Het = same as double Het except applies to three gene pairs.

>Color mutations in boas:

Any entries that are skipped are okay, as far as I know.

>Albino AKA Amelanistic) - Two independent mutant genes: both recessive - a lack of melanin (black pigmentation) Kahl and Sharp strains.

Albino (AKA Amelanistic) - Two independent mutant genes: both recessive - a lack of melanin (black pigmentation) Kahl and Sharp strains.

>Named Color mutation combinations:

Any entries that are skipped are okay, as far as I know.

>Super Sunglow - homozygous albino / heterozygous hypomelanistic

Super Sunglow - homozygous albino / homozygous hypomelanistic

>Locale Related Color Mutations:

All okay, as far as I know.

>Pattern Mutations:

I don't know enough about these to be able to contribute.

I haven't read all the replies but I suggest you start with the word gene, what is a gene, and that is comes in pairs. If I were you I would mention that gene pairs line up on the double helix of DNA or something to connect the novice to something they already know about.

Caden