Reptile & Amphibian Forums

A little back ground first....

We saved a baby snake from a cat attack about 4 weeks ago.

Wasn't sure what he was so posted pics on the "what kind is it" board. The general consensus is that he is a baby black rat snake. Which seems completely reasonable. He has a grey background with white outlined black saddles. And a checkerboarded black and white tummy. There was also some talk that he might be an Eastern milksnake.

Well my little guy just shed, and instead of getting darker as I expected a black rat snake to do, his colors have gotten lighter. the white boarders are more pronounced, and his once pure black saddles are now showing a hint of "bricky" red in the centers with a still dark black boarder.

So I guess what I'm asking is this, is this normal for a baby black rat snake? do they perhaps turn redish before going black? I think (from what I can see, he is still very small) that he has smooth scales and one vent scale, but I'm not willing to bet the farm on that yet.

I suppose the only why to know for sure, is to have some patience and wait to see what he grows up into, but I have 3 kids so patience is in short supply LOL LOL

Any help would be appreciated.

Carrey

There are a lot of shades of black rat snakes. Sounds weird but depending on where you are, they can range from "greenish" to brindle reddish to the obvious black. Most snakes look lighter in their new, fresh skin so I'm not surprized you're seeing a little more color now.

My last normal black rat (Virginia locality) had brownish grey saddles as a hatchling and grew up to be black as coal with some white around the chin and belly. He just got darker over a couple years. If you do a search on google for elaphe obsoleta, you can compare your snakeling to others if you're still confused.
Good luck!
Lora

I had to think about it after reading your update, but I'm staying with Black Rat snake. (Besides, if Oldherper says it's a Black Rat, then take it to the bank - it's a Black Rat! )

Young Eastern Milk snakes of that size would have saddles (blotches) tending toward *bright* red. That's the reason for the nickname, "red adder." I wouldn't call that little guy a red adder, would you?

One way to confirm it is to check the anal plate (which covers the, um, naughty bits). If it's single, milk snake; if it's divided (two scales instead of one), rat snake.

Also, rat snakes have weakly keeled scales, at least at mid-back. Milk snakes have smooth scales. The keels sometimes are so faint on young rat snakes as to be almost indiscernible, so this may not be the best way to confirm the ID.

As for the change in color you're seeing, that well may be a simple result of shedding. Color and pattern will be brighter and bolder once the old skin is off, so you might be seeing a tinge of red that you just couldn't see before, but was there all along.

michaelb

That is a Blk Ratsnake - they make great captives!! Please check your local ordinances on keeping reptlies native to your state. It is illegal to keep Blk Ratsnakes in PA & you have to have permits in OH to keep them. Indiana also has some ordinance regarding captives - they (lawmakers) make it very difficult to actually find out what is illegal & what is not. I would hate to see another innocent person made into a criminal for caring for an animal....take care.

That is a Blk Ratsnake - they make great captives!! Please check your local ordinances on keeping reptlies native to your state. It is illegal to keep Blk Ratsnakes in PA & you have to have permits in OH to keep them. Indiana also has some ordinance regarding captives - they (lawmakers) make it very difficult to actually find out what is illegal & what is not. I would hate to see another innocent person made into a criminal for caring for an animal....take care.