Reptile & Amphibian Forums

what do you all recommend for sealing and protecting the inside walls of a large iguana habitat? we were initially thinking of using formica somehow but we've since all but abandoned the idea because of time and money constraints, so we're thinking about painting with a good tough exterior paint. any suggestions, recommendations, etc. for specific paint to look for or other alternatives? thanks in advance, i look forward to posting pictures of Zilla's new habitat.

I myself am in the middle of building two 66"W x 80"H x 96"L fully modular cages. Much of the work is still in the cutting pieces and gathering parts stage. Sorry again no pics as of yet.

The walls are a laminated ply framework made of ply and expanded ploysterene. The inside surface is FRP or Fiberglass Rienforced Plastic, it will sand up to all the abuse. The outside surface will be tileboard.

FRP by nature is waterproof, and all the seams of the entire cage will siliconed to make a watertight or as watertight as possible cage. The cage is designed to hold a great deal of substrate as well another reason I went FRP over some other product.

Good Luck
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Jeremy

"I am become death, the destroyer of worlds" July 16, 1945 Robert Oppenheimer

1.1 Double Het "Sharp" Snow RTB's
1.1 Hypomelenistic RTB's
0.2 Pastel Hypo RTB's
2.0 Double Het Stripe Albino RTB's
0.1 Suriname RTB
0.1 Anerthrystic RTB
1.0 Ball Python
1.1 Rhinoceros Iguana's
1.0 Green Iguana
1.1 Cream Golden Retrieviers
1.0 Pomeriaian
0.3 Catus Terribilis
0.1 Spouse
0.0.1 Youth -coming soon-

What are the cage walls made from? Are they plywood or what? And how thick is the material and how are the walls/floor constructed?

I like FRP like Jeremey said, but there are still time and money constraints.

Regardless, I do not recommend an exterior paint. Exterior paints get their durability from being flexible and UV resistant enough for an exterior application. These same traits make them less water resistant for an interior application. And no, the amount of UV produced by your lights won't matter (I get that question a lot so I thought I'd answer it up front).

In a nutshell, you want to use the hardest and highest gloss interior paint that is flexible enough for the substrate that you plan to apply it to. Let us know what that is and we can go from there.
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Current snakes:

0.0.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - Java locale (green)

2.2 Gonyosoma janseni - Seleyar locale (all black)

the walls are constructed with 2x3 framing and luan (sp?) plywood lining the interior walls. we actually ended up going to the hardware store today and got some interior/exterior semi-gloss 100% acrylic paint (high gloss wasn't available in the colors we wanted), which seemed like it would be durable and washable enough ("highly scrubbable". looks like i'll be using that unless someone convinces me i'm about to make a huge mistake. paint cost $30 total so it wouldn't be a huge loss.

the floor is a frame covered in MDF with super tough vinyl tile on top and we're trying to find the best solution to seal the walls to the floor.

One problem with the "highly scrubbable" paints is that they don't do well on flexible substrates. If this luan is 1/4" or less you might see some cracking over time. But since this is an exterior product my guess is that it is somewhat flexible.

I can understand why you're not worried about a $30 loss, but it really makes sense to use the right product the first time as you might have adhesion problems if you recoat it with something else later.

I would be more inclined to use a waterborne polyurethane. If the luan is 1/2" or thick, use a regular urethane. If the luan is 3/8" or thinner, I'd use a floor waterborne poly.

These are expensive - about $50 per gallon.

The best is made by General Finishes and is only available at woodworking specialty stores. See if you have a Woodcraft in your area.

Otherwise, the Varthathane products are okay and widely available. They make a regular, floor, and spar. I just listed those in order from hardest to least hardest. Again, you want to use the hardest finish that can withstand the flexing and/or movement your cage will see.

the floor is a frame covered in MDF with super tough vinyl tile on top and we're trying to find the best solution to seal the walls to the floor

This could be a problem. Those vinyl tiles are not the best at blocking water - it can penetrate inbetween the tiles. And MDF will not deal with this well.

I would suggest putting another flooring material over these tiles - don't bother pulling them up. This could be done in the future if you want to leave things as is for a while.

I would also putting something up the first 8" or so of the walls, or a few inches more than whatever your substrate depth will be. Even if you'll use newspaper I recommend putting the tiles one layer up the sides as this is where Iguanas will scratch the most.
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Current snakes:

0.0.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - Java locale (green)

2.2 Gonyosoma janseni - Seleyar locale (all black)

first let me start by saying i very much appreciate your input.

the floor material is actually linoleum, and i assumed it would be fine since it's sold primarily for kitchen floors which get mopped often and spilled on and seem to hold up well to the moisture over time, no? we won't be using any substrate covering that, he poops every day in the bathtub so it only needs to be wiped down from time to time to pick up any food debris, etc. and to catch any drip or spillage from the water bowl (which will be attached to prevent the whole thing from spilling over).

i'll look into the other paints you recommended but i'm not so much worried about cracking as i am the whole stuff just getting scratched through and peeling off, being toxic to lick, etc. we'll have plenty leftover for patching up as normal wear occurs.

floor material is actually linoleum, and i assumed it would be fine since it's sold primarily for kitchen floors which get mopped often and spilled on and seem to hold up well to the moisture over time, no? we won't be using any substrate covering that

Is this a single sheet of linoleum or individual linoleum tiles?

The tiles work okay for a kitchen, but over a MDF floor in a reptile cage is far from ideal. Regardless, I think you'll be fine given the description you gave. And it's not like you can't go and put something else on later, even over the walls if the paint completely fails.

Post a picture when the cage is complete and your Iguana has been moved to it.
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Current snakes:

0.0.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - Java locale (green)

2.2 Gonyosoma janseni - Seleyar locale (all black)

well, we haven't laid the linoleum (tiles) down yet so it's not too late to return for something else. we were initially thinking formica but when faced with a fast approaching deadline we caved and compromised with the linoleum tiles because of availability and ease of application. now our deadline has been pushed back several weeks so we have a bit more time to make sure it's done right the first time.

the single sheet linoleum available at the store seemed much softer than the tiles we were able to get. we considered plastic reinforced fiberglass sheets for the walls and floor, but that was shot down due to one side being textured and so not very easy to apply or wipe clean (maybe we just have a smaller selection than other areas).

pics will definitely be posted when construction is complete, it will be a major improvement over his current house.

epoxy would work well. once it cures its safe enough to eat off of. What I recently used was glazecoat (it was the only thing I could find at my nearest lowes improvement store)

http://www.glazecoat.com/GlazeCoat.htm

i dont know how similar it is to envirotex(sp?) but it wasnt a harsh odor when wet, it didnt take long to dry, and after a day or so its as hard as a rock I still am leaving my cage outside for a good week just to be safe. i have tried the polycrylic stuff in the past and honestly it wasnt that good( im sure some people here swear by it and I hope not to offend but I just dont think its sufficient).

the epoxy (which covered the inside of a 30" x 40" x 50" cage twice over)is $19 at lowes and I am sure theres a similar product at home depot . its definately worth messing with to see if you like it.

tom

epoxy would work well. once it cures its safe enough to eat off of.

Well I'd say "some" epoxies are safe enough to eat off of. Glaze Coat would certainly be one of them.

What I recently used was glazecoat (it was the only thing I could find at my nearest lowes improvement store)

i dont know how similar it is to envirotex

Identical, from what I understand.

I still am leaving my cage outside for a good week just to be safe.

I hope you don't mean out in the sun. You really don't want this stuff exposed to UV light before, during or after the curing process. Get that cage indoors.

i have tried the polycrylic stuff in the past and honestly it wasnt that good( im sure some people here swear by it and I hope not to offend but I just dont think its sufficient).

Polycrylic would not be my first choice for a waterborne poly. Far from it. But it does allow one to build a nice protective finish for a lot less money than bartop epoxy. It might need to be recoated a heck of a lot more often, but it is also very easy to repair.

the epoxy (which covered the inside of a 30" x 40" x 50" cage twice over)is $19

This does not sound right. The absolute thinnest these products should be applied is 1/16" inch and that takes a certain amount of practice and skill. Even then the $19 one quart kit would only cover 16 sq. feet.

Did you only cover the bottom of the cage or something?
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Current snakes:

0.0.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - Java locale (green)

2.2 Gonyosoma janseni - Seleyar locale (all black)

I hope you don't mean out in the sun. You really don't want this stuff exposed to UV light before, during or after the curing process. Get that cage indoors.

well the first few days it was raining so it spent much of the time in the garage but the past week its been outside like everyday. what does the UV do thats so bad?

This does not sound right. The absolute thinnest these products should be applied is 1/16" inch and that takes a certain amount of practice and skill. Even then the $19 one quart kit would only cover 16 sq. feet.

Did you only cover the bottom of the cage or something?

i did the inside walls (3 walls) as well as the top and bottom.
the front is basically all glass so no epxoy there i did them all twice and still had about half a solo cup left over after that.

tom

UV light is very harsh on finishes. Even the most expensive spar urethanes need to be recoated often despite having the strongest UV absorbers available.

Envirotex and other bartop epoxies have zero UV inhibitors. I think UV exposure could be very bad, especially if the finish was not fully cured.

What is the exact size of the cage? Indicate L x W x H?

Also, you did buy the one quart kit, correct? 1/2 quart each of resin and hardener?

I'm just curious to calculate how thin you poured it and to keep track of how well it holds up.

I have seen some restaurant tables that were poured pretty thin. I guess you have to get the stuff really warm and work very fast. My wife and I are soon going to have two very large surfaces to pour and I'm hoping to get it pretty thin. This is why I'm so interested in your data. I have used this stuff a fair amount but have never tried to go thinner than 1/8".

Thanks.
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Current snakes:

0.0.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - Java locale (green)

2.2 Gonyosoma janseni - Seleyar locale (all black)

I hope the UV doesnt deteriorate it too fast because I plan on using a mercury vapor bulb which Id imagine puts out a fair amount of UV radiation.

i think u saw my previous post showing the hole in the wall this cage is going into, the steel frame notes the side dimensions (for visual reference)

my cage foor is 32" x 42"
the front is 42" x 69"
the back is 42" x 48"

the glaze coat can go as thin as you want it to. my floor is 1/2" birch plywood and the walls are 3/16" hardboard .

Ill tell you the plywood was way eaiser to work with than the hard boad.

Actually, MVBs come nowhere close to the UV rays of the sun, especially the UVC spectrum which is what can degrade finishes. No concern there.

the glaze coat can go as thin as you want it to.

Is this what it said on the label? That seems quite contrary to what is recommended by other bartop epoxies. In fact most list 1/8" thickness to insure that people don't complain, try to return the product, etc.
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Current snakes:

0.0.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - Java locale (green)

2.2 Gonyosoma janseni - Seleyar locale (all black)

the glaze coat can go as thin as you want it to.

Is this what it said on the label? That seems quite contrary to what is recommended by other bartop epoxies. In fact most list 1/8" thickness to insure that people don't complain, try to return the product, etc.

My main concern is not getting an 1/8" slick perfect surface. I just want to inhibit offgas and make it waterproof. imho 1/16" or 1/32 of epoxy is probably better than 1/8" of any other sealant options available at lowes.

this is the first time I have used the stuff so I dont know what lies ahead in terms of longevity. but to the touch it feels like its all entriely coated in epoxy and the stuff is hard as a rock, this is good enough for me.

In the future if it ever cracks or flakes off ill be sure to post about it so future epoxy users will know whats insufficient in terms of thickness. but I am not going to add more unless whats already laid up proves to be inefficient.

Tom