Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Okay, please take a moment of your time and read through this - I will be as brief as possible. I acquired what was said to me by more than one person(s) Florida Box Turtles in a trade at the last Columbus Expo. The previous owner had all original receipts, and seemed quite experienced with Turtles in general. I was hesitant, because most of my experience is with Snakes & Lizards but I went ahead with the deal $1,200 in receipts for gravid Rosies (all just days away from dropping...why oh why??) Anyways, after quite a few very helpful "turtle people" emailed me for more details, etc...we shared some pics & some specifics and most BUT not all came to the conclusion these are interegrades (Florida x ?) and although opinions varied somewhat, it seems the majority of the ones that seemed most helpful and educated in this field agree they are not pure Floridas. I did not get any "hate" mail so to speak, which shows just how nice is is to be a part of this hobby w/ all of you Reptile fanatics, just friendly advice. I did try to state in my previous ads, that I was not a turtle expert and some "details" have came up with the animals and to email me for the specifics, but I wanted to re-post them and let everybody in on the full scoop. Although nobody accused me of purposely misrepresenting these animals, I thought maybe some of who who may not have contacted me felt I was without saying, so to all of you my apologies. I hope Jeff and KS is okay with this "ad" it probrably should be put in the forums. Just in case, I'm going to copy & paste over there as well. I've established a good name for myself in the hobby over the past 15 years, and hope to continue to do so. Thanks to everyone who helped!! Now...whether to sell them, or kick the guys butt who ripped me off, LOL!! You know what though?? I still like them, they're very "cute" animals!! I'm so used to Snakes, and they either bite or don't bite (still gotta love 'em) but these guys and girls seem like they almost wag their tails when I come home, LOL!! Thanks for all of your time and help!!

What make you believe that the little guy is an integrated box turtle? Perhaps I missed the posts, and will make an effort to read through them, but my opinion, just based on the photo, and the high shell, is that it is a Florida. The question you should have is who raised the babies, and do they have other box turtes mixed in with the Florida's - now that does not mean that they are integrated, because if there are enough females of the same subspecies they don't seem interested in other subspecies - except for Gulf Coast box turtles who will mate with about anything.

On the flip side, female box turtles can store sperm for many years, so if the female mated with another subspecies, you could get an integrated box turtle.

I guess before I accused the person of selling you integrates, you should visit where the babies were hatched and see if the adults are segregated or not.

Bill G.

I looked at the photos you had in the classifieds, and the other do look like integrates - actually very similar to Gulf Coast Box turtles - except for the head markings.

If you have the contact information to the person who sold them to you, ask them to explain why they believe they are pure Florida Box Turtles - if they don't give you a plausable explanation, request a refund of some sort - anyways that is what I would do.

Email me offline if you like.

Bill G.

Another question is are the parents from an "integrade" are of florida. Such integrade areas can produce a "Florida" looking parent, but the genes are unstable, and offspring could look mixed or like easterns. Also, some Gulf coast Box Turtles from the Florida Pan handle area can have florida traits, and this is further complicated if mated with floridians.

This is not so much your problem, but the problem with mixing subspecies like those who breed eastern x three-toed, eastern x western, florida x western, gulf coast x anything else. That's why anyone who has box turtles need to seperate out the different subspecies to prevent accidental breedings.

Mark

The baby you have pictured looks like a baby fl box. The other ones you had in your add looked like gulf coasts.

Steve

There are florida x eastern integrade zones in florida. Some unknowledgable folks will sell a turtle and name it by its geography. This does not work. Any turtle found near tallahasee could be an eastern x florida integrade. Gulf coasts are so variable in nature that they can sometimes easily labeled as eastern, three toed, or floridian.

Thank you all for your help!!