Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Over the past few years I've become pretty well acquaintened with the reptilian/amphibious world through leopard geckos, anoles, snakes, and toads and I would really like to try my luck with dart frogs. I've done quite a bit of research, but I find it's best to actually talk to those who own an animal because they often know intricate details that care sheets and books may lack. Before I begin asking a million questions, I'd like to apologize if I seem pretty naive...I just want to make sure that I will do a good job of taking care of these lil guys before I get all excited and go get one.

1) I'd like to start of with a single frog (probably D. auratus or D. azureus) so I don't place two lives in the hands of a newbie owner who has no experience. I figure with one frog, I will be able to monitor the animal's personal condition more closely than if I had two. I know that many people like to get frogs in pairs, but can a single frog be content and well on its own? (probably an obvious question but I'm just really paranoid about the welfare of my charges)

2) Housing. I have a 10 gallon tank that I'd like to use to house my dart but am not sure if I want to create an actual living terrarium (I'm not really talented with plants). Does anyone use silk plants or plastic plants in their dart enclosures? If fake plants are unsatisfactory, what do you guys think about putting a small, potted pothos in the tank? I've used pothos w/my anoles and they really seemed to love the cover that the leaves gave to both their branches and the ground.

3. Lighting/heating. Are the florescent bulbs necessary for the frogs or just the plants living in the tank? If it is necessary for the frog's well being and survival I will be more than happy to accomodate, but if I can use fake plants and avoid florescent lights, I would prefer it. Also, what is the best air temp for keeping a dart? The room the tank would be kept in never falls below 70 and RARELY, if ever, touches in the low 80s (76 would probably be the average temp). Would I have to provide supplemental heat or would my dart be completely happy at these temperatures?

4. Misting/Water. I was thinking of providing a shallow dish of water (like a glazed bottom to a clay pot) filled with river stones for the dart as well as misting the tank daily to ensure proper humidity. Do you think 2 thorough mists (morning and evening) would be ok or should it be misted more?

5. Food. I know many keepers use fruit flies as the staple diet for darts but I have a roommate and I'm not sure if she'd appreciate having cultures of fruit flies in our living space. Does anyone feed their adult frogs other small insects? I was mainly thinking of extra small phoenix worms, waxworms, butterworms, and pinhead crickets. If I used these feeders as my dart's main diet, how often would I feed the lil guy?

Again I know I sound pretty ignorant, but most of the sites I've found regarding dart frog care center around vivarium/terrarium care and sometimes its hard to discern which is necessary for the frogs' survival and health and the plants' survival and health. Thanks in advance for the help, I won't make a move until I'm certain that I can give a dart the best of care.

I went to the nursery today and by the end of my trip decided to create a true blue terrarium after all. The plants I got are small coleus' plants with wide leaves and an affinity for shade and moisture.

So now I have a NEW set of questions pertaining to housing:

What do you guys use for drainage (base layer)? I've heard of people using everything from perlite to gravel to course sand.

What kind of moss works well for quick ground coverage (club moss?)?

Sorry for all the questions!

I recommend you vist Black Jungle or another terrarium/vivarium site. Asking questions I admit helps a lot more but I think pictures help us along the way create our own ideas of what it is we want to achieve.

By the way a lot of people are going to a product called Terra lite its a clay based pellet that is light weight and makes an excellent base layer for a terrarium/vivarium. In conjunction with Co-Co Bedding I think that is all you will need my 2 cents.

Good Luck
-----
Jeremy

"I am become death, the destroyer of worlds" July 16, 1945 Robert Oppenheimer

1.1 Double Het "Sharp" Snow RTB's
1.1 Hypomelenistic RTB's
0.2 Pastel Hypo RTB's
2.0 Double Het Stripe Albino RTB's
0.1 Suriname RTB
0.1 Anerthrystic RTB
0.0.11 Red Bearded Dragons
1.1 Rhinoceros Iguana's
1.0 Green Iguana
1.0 Ball Python
1.1 Cream Golden Retrieviers
1.0 Pomeriaian
0.3 Catus Terribilis
0.1 Spouse
0.0.1 Youth -coming soon-

I'm currently building a new habitat in a 10 gallon for my tiny Phyllobates lugubris, using the Coco-Tek substrate for the false bottom and Great Stuff to attach the cork bark, so will take some photos as I go and post them for you. It will be more or less a drip wall down the cork bark.

So check back in a day or two when it should be finished and planted.
-----
Patty
Pahsimeroi, Idaho

4 D. auratus blue
5 D. galactonotus pumpkin orange splash back
7 D. imitator
6 D. leucomelas
4 D. pumilio Bastimentos
4 D. fantasticus
6 P. terribilis mint and organe
4 D. reticulatus
4 D. castaneoticus
2 D. azureus
4 P vittatus
2 P. lugubris

1. A single frog won't be lonesome. You are NOT naive. You will do a good job, and darts are among the easiest frogs to keep in general, believe it or not.

2. 10 gallons is fine for one frog or even two of either auratus or D. azureus. If you chose auratus, you don't have to mate them up, but with D. azureus, a pair is better. While 5 gallons per frog is a general concept, a larger tank for the larger frogs such as a 20 might be better. Some darts are more territorial than others.

Don't use artificial plants. Live tropical plants with a soil substrate make a better habitat for darts over all, and require less maintenance. Coleus, however, is not an appropriate plant. It will straggle around under these conditions. Get something like Peperomia, Pilea, Fittonia, perhaps some ferns, Selaginella, mosses, etc. As was said, look on Black Jungle.

3. Lighting is for the plants. Get the fluorescent bulbs with the plant spectrum "sunlight" lighting. The frogs will get their needs from dusting live food with calcium and D3 plus vitamins. Repti-Cal/Herptivite combination or Dendrocare are proven choices. You don't need extra heating. Your room temperatures are perfect.

4. Misting is essential at least once a day unless you have a waterway or sometthing more fancy, like a drip wall.

5. Fruit flies are the best staple. Consider Ed's Fly Meat Culture kits. They have wingless fruit flies and escape-proof/recycleable cultures. You can raise fruit flies in a dark cupboard if you don't want them visible. You feed your darts as much as they want to eat on a daily basis, and then go from there, depending upon the species. Some may tend to be eating machines and tend to become obese. Pinhead crickets and other stuff can also be fed, but fruit flies are really the most reliable. You can feed field plankton and even aphids in season as a treat, as long as you collect it from a pesticide-free area.

You do NOT sound ignorant by any means. Go ahead and make your move. Both the tropical plants and your frogs need the same things. You will establish a biologically recycling system that is relatively maintenance free.
-----
Patty
Pahsimeroi, Idaho

4 D. auratus blue
5 D. galactonotus pumpkin orange splash back
7 D. imitator
6 D. leucomelas
4 D. pumilio Bastimentos
4 D. fantasticus
6 P. terribilis mint and organe
4 D. reticulatus
4 D. castaneoticus
2 D. azureus
4 P vittatus
2 P. lugubris

I neglected to mention that club moss is not a true moss, but is Selaginella sp. It grows more like a fern and doesn't really cover ground like a moss. However, it is a neat plant to have in the vivarium, none-the-less. There are several species.

-----
Patty
Pahsimeroi, Idaho

4 D. auratus blue
5 D. galactonotus pumpkin orange splash back
7 D. imitator
6 D. leucomelas
4 D. pumilio Bastimentos
4 D. fantasticus
6 P. terribilis mint and organe
4 D. reticulatus
4 D. castaneoticus
2 D. azureus
4 P vittatus
2 P. lugubris

Hi Darksky:

Welcome to the world of Darts! We're glad to have you. Ask as many questions as you can stand, thats the way to become a more confident keeper. Everything Patty says is always reliable. I second and confirm your choice to go with live plants-in the long run you'll be way happier. Do go to Black Jungle, click on Catalog, and click on Gallery, and click on Pictures of 4 foot tank construction. There is a step by step with pictures on constructing a biologically sound and recycling type of tank as Patty mentioned before.

Though you feel you didn't have the green thumb with plants, you already do have experience with creating conditions suitable for other animals in your care. And it has seemed to me that developing the right conditions in the tank for the frog and the plants have been closely related(i.e when I got the right lighting for the broms in my tank and they flourished, the tank was then more humid and had more suitable sites for my Imitators to lay eggs-which they did. When I had plants that would drop some leaves as they grew and I trimmed them, Springtails and Isopods would eat them and help decompose them. These insects would populate the tank more and my frogs would eat them.)

Also, you are going to find that just as Patty said, Darts are way easier then people say they are(as long as you make the right conditions), and even more rewarding then you imagined, especially if you go through the seemingly more troublesome steps of constructing a "live" biological tank complete with plants and perhaps even a water feature.

We'll talk to you soon, glad your aboard.

Maggie