Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hey all,

I just got back from a 3 day trip to alterna land. Not many herps but the ones I found were very nice. Here is a recap:

6/21 - US 90 del rio to pumpville
Nothin', nothin', more nothin', no wait...(backing up), SWEET! My first alterna! It was just hanging out on a small rock cut just west of Oshman Canyon (West Langtry). He is very pretty interm. light phase 1.0. The stats: temp 89, time 11:40pm. 5 minutes later I spotted a Texas Long-nose and those were the only 2 snakes I saw that night.

6/22 - Juno & 90 West Langtry
Again the evening started out slow. The only snakes seen were what I'm pretty sure was a Mojave rattler, I'll have to post the pic to get everyones expert advise, and a dor whipsnake. On 90 a whole lot of nothin' until I arrived to my magical alterna road cut at Oshman Canyon. A nice dark blair's phase 0.1 awaited my arrival. Don't mind if I do. temp 84, time 1:30 am.

6/23 - 277 to Buffalo creek
a few other herpers out, but not many herps. Maybe everyone else had better luck but the only snake I saw was a juv. baird's rat (which was cool). I did have an extremely freaky thing happen though. I was shining my spot light on a cut when all the sudden a honey bee flew into my hair and started stinging me in the head. What the hell is that about! I took that as a omen that it was time for me to leave.

Well that was my trip. I apologize to the fellow herper I met a motel 6. I said I'd show you the alterna I collected but I had to get home. Sorry

Nathan Compton

I doubt it was a Mojave rattler. I've never seen them east of Brewster county.
Congrats on your first alterna. Gets you wired, doesn't it?

Hi John,

Thanks for bursting my bubble! Well the more research I do and examining the picture the more I think it was just a light colored atrox. Do atrox from west texas tend to be lighter in color then in other regions of the state? Is there any easy, reliable way to tell the species apart. I know that with mojaves the white margins are supposed to be much wider then the black on the tail and something about the facial markings is different. I have included the picture in question and a picture of the atrox color pattern I usually see. Can you see why I'm confused. Thanks for the help.

Nathan

Nathan-

You're right-if that's not a Mojave, I don't know what is!

Brad Chambers

The way the pattern turns to bands near the tail makes it look more like a mojave or viridis. ALso on scutulatus and viridis the postocular stripe goes past the end of the mouth, whereas with atrox it doesn't. Of course, the viridis doesn't have the coontail. I don't believe that either scutulatus or viridis is reported from Val Verde or Terrell counties, at least not in any of my books. Also on the one you found the white is much wider than the black on the tail, another characteristic of scutulatus.

If it is either of those, it was probably released. Don't feel badly about the confusion. I still get confused by them now and then. I've caught scuts I thought at first were viridis, atrox that were scuts, etc.

Just looks like an atrox to me, at least from that photo. Sometimes they confuse me too, but I still think atrox on that one.

Walking a large Mojave on a cut adds a new dimension to field collecting.

As I understand it, these are the LAST snakes in Texas you'd choose to get nailed by. The venom is more potent and the snakes have a higher yield than other Mojave populations.

A scut:

An atrox from the same locality:

Nathan,

That is an odd atrox with aberrant diamond shapes. The head is also atrox like.
Desert atrox can be much paler than those from other areas.
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Chris Harrison
San Antonio, Texas

that is a very nicely-patterned atrox.

Troy

Definitely an atrox. Why is it no one is mentioning the scales between the eyes? Scut has two large scales and atrox has 5-6 small scales. If you really want to be sure you could cut the snake open. The meat on the bottom of the ribs of a atrox is white. The meat on the bottom of the ribs of a scut is black.

About the range, I and L. Box found a 53" female scut about 15 miles west of Sanderson. It was verified and documented in Denny Miller's book. Right now I do not remember if it was extreme East Pecos or extreme West Terrell, but somewhere around there. I have found several over the years around the eastern edge of Pecos County.

ECT

Nice alterna!!! The crotalus looks like a hybrid between an atrox and mojave. If you really want to know if its a mojave just tube it and count the scales on the top of the head,that is if your comfortable with tubing a mojave. The mojave has a triple row of enlarged scales on the top of its head. Sorry I don't have any alterna,heres a speckled king pic though. Kevin

Congrats on your first Alterna. Nice to see that folks are seeing more animals these days.

Best Wishes,

Steven Owens