Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Just wondering...... How many people think these would look better if crossed with a hypo BCI ?

Just a fair question? Not trying to start anything.
I own typical hypo's, albinos, sunglows, etc. and have nothing against them.

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are they florida redtails?

They are either produced by me, by another private bcc breeder or w/c's.

You should send him over here!

I forgot he was one of the snakes I posted.

I'll send him over though in exchange for the reverse striper you got from Paul Edwards. lol

BTW, How is that guy?
Post a picture for me. I dream about that snake.
Hope you are well.

Alex C.

contact me at you earliest convenience?
Please keep posting pics.
I do not mean to be demanding but is hard to get to see beauties like those !!!!
THNX,
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Joel Pretz
JP Reptiles

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I don't know that anything could be done to improve those animals.

Simply spectacular.
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2.1.0 Kidletts
0.0.1 Ball Pyhton (Rex)
0.0.1 Okeetee Corn (Maizey)
0.1.0 BCI (Ruby)
0.1.0 Cat (Ginger)
1.0.0 Pughuahua (Ranger)

Surinam I have EVER seen...Beautiful...REALLY BEAUTIFUL

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Executive Reptiles
Amanda Kingsbury & David Kendrick
www.executivereptiles.com

While I could see the beauty of certain crosses.....I am all for maintaining "pure" bloodlines. I have the utmost respect for others that do this type of breeding.
I think you are correct in a sense. Those are some killer surinams. It would seem a shame to not be able to see what the next level those animals will produce.
Those are some friggin awesome Surinams!!! I have some from Tudehope as well. Someday I will be breeding my Yagi Surinam with my male Tudehope.
Keep posting those beauties!
John
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"To be the best..........You must lose your mind."

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"To be the best..........You must lose your mind."

Won't change their appearence one bit,they'll look just as magnificent as they do now... however,it sure would drasticly improve those offspring that won the coin toss !
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EMAIL quit editing my signature!

Based on what I have seen from hypo x suri breedings you lose the suri pattern and then some. I do not see the point.

Not only would you be tainting the BCC with an already crossed/tainted animal(hypo), the end result are less attractive babies than a nice true BCC.

There are plenty true bcc that are more hypo/pastel looking than most hypos out there.

If anything you would get nicer hypos, not nicer bcc's.
There's enough tainted stuff out there. Keep it real.

As I have said.....I truely respect those who do not agree with the crossings.
That being said, I must disagree with you.
I will only speak to my litters and not others.
My Ghost was bred with a Surinam who really didn't have many widows peaks. It had more of a "standard" look to it. So, it makes sense that the babies did not gain much if any at all. Some of the babies really do have mom's looks.

You also have to remember. There has been a lot of selective breedings that have been done with Surinams. There are bloodlines have have more peaks than others. More color than others. Etc. To say that the babies you have seen won't carry that look in future selective breeds is short sighted to me. As far as I know, my breeding is the first ever breeding with a Surinam and a Ghost. I personally think there are great things to come with these breedings. In a few years I will be able to breed the siblings together and have some possible super 50/50 ghosts. Also, some 50/50 anerys.

Just think of some of these "pure" animals in the beginning.
1)albinos looked like yellow banannas. Now, through selective breeding they are as red as ever.
2)hypo have sky rocketed in looks from the first import.
3)There are many more examples.

Personally, my feelings are not going to be hurt with this conversation. I honestly did this breeding for myself. Others that are interested in this project welcome.
Those who are not..........That is your right.
Take care,
John

>>Based on what I have seen from hypo x suri breedings you lose the suri pattern and then some. I do not see the point.
>>
>>Not only would you be tainting the BCC with an already crossed/tainted animal(hypo), the end result are less attractive babies than a nice true BCC.
>>
>>There are plenty true bcc that are more hypo/pastel looking than most hypos out there.
>>
>>If anything you would get nicer hypos, not nicer bcc's.
>>There's enough tainted stuff out there. Keep it real.
>>
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"To be the best..........You must lose your mind."

that if you breed any of the bcc's that SurinameMan posted to a hypo, I do NOT think the bcc pattern will passed on to the offspring.

You would get nicer hypos but uglier suri's.
In my opinion a nice suri is prettier than a nice hypo, that's all.

I respectively disagree.
With my breedings I have seen pattern traits carry to the babies.
Even with my breeding the BCC x BCI I can see them mother's pattern.
What will be really interesting for me is when I can breed one of these 50%ers to a highly peaked BCC. That should be interesting.
John
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"To be the best..........You must lose your mind."

That's what I'm thinking. Then, after you have the hypo trait, keep breeding to pure suris to bring the pattern back in.

ANY "suri's" at all---*none* the offspring would be intergrades,hypos & non-hypos.as far as killing the potential market regarding true B.c.c. albinos...most locality enthusiasts are not particularly keen on "morph" production,nor the inbreeding to perpetuate recessive mutants...this leaves the targeted market audience: the "tainted morph breeders"...the value of the true B.c.c. strain of albino would then be more dependant on it's compatability,or incompatability with the other two existing strains of presumed T. neg. albinos.just my opinion,your milage may vary
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EMAIL quit editing my signature!

you wouldn't get any Suri's, only intergrades that won't be as nice as the offspring those suri's would produce if bred to each other. Crossing them would certainly be a shame.

On the albino issue.
Your right, most locality guys are not interested in morphs.
Aside from whether the albinos will be compatible or not, the problem with cross breeding is that eventually it will be hard to distinquish the true albino bcc's from the intergrades.

IMO, this will negatively impact the market for people looking for non-intergrades.

You have much of a point...(MHO) the "purity" issue is more a human mental concoction than a natural reality,if you're interested in preserving natural beauty,go to these locales,and take pictures...if you're interested in breeding snakes in captivity for pleasure,breed the ones that bring you the most of it...there are many more generic B.c.c. in captivity than there are documented true locality animals,(this can be verified by looking through the classifieds...breeding two animals with peaks & big red tails with zero collection/locality info doesn't make "pure" anything...again,only my opinion,I'm not interested in changing yours.
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EMAIL quit editing my signature!

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Frank Roberts
R&R Herpetological Frank Roberts & John Rodriguez

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Roberts'Realm of Reptile Research

if boas are just boas, why do you can them intergrades/crosses?

People have bred argentines with hypos, columbians with hypos, bcc with hypos knowing that they are crossing and thats fine.

Just don't use "lack of documentation" as an excuse and accept that crossing is mostly done for monetary reasons without regard to the animals themself.
Common sense tells us that Argentines,Hoggs,BCC,etc. have a certain look. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out.

I also don't want to change your opinion..it is what it is.
Good luck.

For ANY of the choices I make as a "breeder",and I don't attempt to blow smoke either,personally there are several types of boas I'm not at all interested in using in any of my projects,but my decisions are never governed by dollars over personal preference,and long term benefits...I keep accurate track of what I breed,and freely offer that info to anyone interested.
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EMAIL quit editing my signature!

Are generated & perpetuated by those that worry excessively about what others may think...do what you love,and do it well,and you'll be proud of your efforts,and happier with the results.
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EMAIL quit editing my signature!

There certainly are a few but not "plenty". Shoe me all the ones you think are hypos? I will bet you can't find 5 of them.

Caden

The surinames shown are already awesome animals.Breeding them with something else won't change their looks in any way.

The question is would your "typical" hypos, albinos and sunglows look better if they had this suriname blood in them?
I know what I think.

Fair question. I also have suriname, peruvian, corn island and crawl key boas.

Bill Kirby

IMO, the BCC blood is what makes the hypos and anything else(albinos,sunglows,etc) better, not the other way around.

Frankly, although crossing bcc to hypos makes better hypos, it makes uglier suri's. As you said, these crosses will enhance the albinos and sunglows though.

The only potential problem that we may encounter down the road if true bcc albinos are ever produced is that we won't know what is crossed and what isn't.

That said, I do forsee true BCC morphs popping up in the future.

"The only potential problem that we may encounter down the road if true bcc albinos are ever produced is that we won't know what is crossed and what isn't."

Who cares....they are still morphs and albinos..When breeding morphs you are getting what you the breeder desires from crossing whatever snakes you are crossing. If someone else happens to like them great, if not then that's OK too.

he was told they were not crossed.

True suri albinos will cost more than crossed ones.
Makes sense right.

My point is that they may look similar but not cost the same.

Understood.

change them. The offspring will not look anything like the BCC parent.

I agree you would get nicer hypos etc.,but IMO you get less attractive BCC.

With the animals you are breeding out, I do not see how crossing them would make a more spectacular boa. Those BCCs are incredible!

but before that, I would cry if you outcrossed those Suris. Those are amazing! As for the important info, I heard a little rumor today that the 100% albino Suriname male that is in the country bred a female. She has not popped yet, but appears gravid. Hets. will not be cheap, but this will be a serious true BCC morph that will definitely have an impact on the market. Of course there may allready be some hets. out there I don't know about. I'm just some guy who loves boas. What do I know?

Phil Goss

Who has him?
Was it to a pure suri?
(I'm assuming yes.)