Reptile & Amphibian Forums

hey guys,

i was wondering. it is about a month after my female panther laid her eggs and well for the first few weeks, they looked great. but recently they started to wrinkle up a lot. and also the color from a beige color changed a little darker. i added some water drops about each eggs but what about the color change? please help me out guys. thanks

santho t....

I can't personally help you (never did the breeding thing) but it looks like no one has replied so I can direct you to this article - good luck!

lele
Eggs: Laying to Hatching

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Chameleon Help & Resource Info
1.0 Nosy Be Panther Chameleon - Cyrus
0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna. She's now hanging from her big jungle gym in the sky
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
1.1 Side-blotched lizards - Ana and Stan for now
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skippy
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh, Died 4/21/06
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha, donated to science 4/4/06
?.? Pinktoe Tarantula - no name yet

thank you.. i really appreciate it.

maybe she'll see her name and chime in
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Chameleon Help & Resource Info
1.0 Nosy Be Panther Chameleon - Cyrus
0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna. She's now hanging from her big jungle gym in the sky
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
1.1 Side-blotched lizards - Ana and Stan for now
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skippy
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh, Died 4/21/06
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha, donated to science 4/4/06
?.? Pinktoe Tarantula - no name yet

lele gave you a good site to show you eggs that are good and bad. If you could post a picture of the eggs it might help. Panther eggs never seem to be as straight forward as veiled eggs or C. chameleon eggs when it comes to hatching/incubating.

You might be having a problem with the substrate moisture level or the temperature...or (worse option) the eggs might be dying. (I hope not.)

Here's an article with some information about egg incubation...don't know if it will help or not...
"Egg incubation: The standard technique involves spacing eggs in a vermiculite-filled container with a tight lid to retain moisture. Perlite can be used also. Vermiculite should be at 400 (0.4 to 0.7 parts water to 1 part dry vermiculite). Incubation varies from 6 months to 12 months (or longer) depending on the temperature, moisture content of the incubation medium and perhaps the locale of origin (climatic variation). If the temperature is kept at 65-78ºF hatching can occur in 6-9 months. The eggs are laid before vascularization and a 3-6 month diapause (no embryo development-dormant) is associated with this species. If incubation temperatures are too high in the early stages of incubation, diapause is extended. It is recommended that temperatures in the mid-high 60's to low 70's be used in the first couple of months with a gradual warming if one wishes to break diapause. Candling of the eggs can determine if the eggs are in diapause (yellow light) or are undergoing vascularization (pink color-blood islets). Eggs incubated at over 80ºF in early incubation can remain in diapause for over 12 months in some cases."
http://www.adcham.com/html/taxonomy/species/fpardalis.html

You said...."i added some water drops about each eggs"...don't drip the water on the eggs when you do this. Its said to wash off the protective anti bacterial/fungal coating the eggs have when they are laid. (I worded it this way because I have never put water on my eggs so I have not experience with the coating being washed off.)

As for the color change, generally good eggs are white if they are good (there are pictures in the link lele gave you) and they do have a natural change at the very end of the incubation as the eggs get ready to hatch.

Some changes in color during the incubation often mean that there is something wrong. The UVB exposure and the supplementation appear to play a bigger part in egg health with panther chameleons than some other species....and the balance is not easy to attain.

Here's some information about panther chameleon egg health...
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/abstract/68753/ABSTRACT?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

This one is a lot to wade through but it talks a lot about the success and failure of eggs...
http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:UI0pp-q1NTUJ:www.reptileuvinfo.com/Docs/Cham.pdf "furcifer pardalis" AND eggs&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=20

More..."The one scientific study we are aware of addresses egg hatchability in Panther Chameleons (Furcifer pardalis) and the authors suggest that a low level of UVB (a gradient between 15-33uW/cm² as measured with a Solarmeter 6.2) supplied for 12 hours a day is optimal. High levels are seen to be harmful.14,19 Our experiences are similar to these findings; one of the current authors maintains gradients of up to 30uW/cm² in all his chameleon vivaria."
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/whatreptilesneed.htm

"Panther Chameleons (Furcifer pardalis) and Oustalet’s Chameleons (Furcifer oustaleti) are found in open forest as well as trees and bushes alongside Madagascan roads. Both species are often found in the same trees.
Their environment is bright with high levels of UV, however neither species basks to the extent that a bearded dragon does. In addition they are arboreal, and as vegetation absorbs UVB, parts of their day are spent within trees and bushes in sheltered UV areas.

Oustalet’s are larger than panthers with thicker, tougher skin. Surprisingly, testing various skin samples for males of both species using the Solarmeter 6.2 showed Oustalet’s skin has a higher UVB transmission rate. This would suggest the Oustalet’s chameleon may have a higher UVB requirement than the panther chameleon.

Adult Panther Chameleons showed profound differences depending upon their sex and breeding condition. A gravid female had a transmission rate of 34%; an old, non-breeding female and an adult male both had skin transmitting only 19%. It is possible the gravid female's increased requirement for vitamin D3 and calcium is, in some unexplained way, altering the skin's absorption of UVB.

Juvenile Panther Chameleons
Skin from several baby panthers were tested and UVB transmission was found to be around 50%, and a sample from a sub-adult male transmitted 42%. These readings are significantly higher than for the adults tested. A number of reasons for this difference are suggested below:

1. Fig. 15: baby panther chameleons hide in bushesBody size / overall skin thickness.
A panther’s skin is thinner when a baby than as an adult.
However when comparing skin thickness and UV transmission across species, both Oustalet’s and Parson's skin are thicker than panthers and yet both allow more UV through. Therefore it seems likely this extra transmission is for reasons other than, or at least not limited to, body size.
2. Requirements for Growth.
Baby chameleons are fast growing and the demands of laying enough calcium down for strong bones means their D3 requirements and therefore their UVB requirements are higher than those of adults.
3. Basking Preferences. At times of higher D3 requirements (e.g. gravid female) adults increase the time they spend basking, and the resulting additional UVB exposure facilitates higher vitamin D3 photobiosynthesis. Unfortunately basking in the wild carries a cost, namely, exposure to predators. (It’s also worth mentioning that basking reptiles tend to bask longer and have slightly higher body temperatures in captivity than in the wild, possibly because the threat of predation is removed.)
The dangers of predation for a baby chameleon would be higher than for an adult. In fact it would seem so much more dangerous that baby chameleons inhabit a different area from the adults. The wild Jackson’s chameleons from the back garden of Mary Lovin in Hawaii 52 illustrate this point well. Adult Jackson’s tend to inhabit the middle to top of the trees and bushes. The babies spend their time closer to the ground in more sheltered low-level bushes.
The babies by habit and habitat are not exposed to the same levels of direct sunlight as the adults. It seems possible that the higher UVB transmission in the babies’ skin would compensate for the more sheltered environment, where there is less UVB light, and also for the babies’ higher demand for vitamin D3.
In captivity, we should consider the extra UVB requirements that a baby may have compared to the adult. However, sufficient UV shelter (generally provided by live plants) and a UV gradient must be provided to allow for proper self-regulation of exposure."
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/skintests.htm

Sorry I can't give you a more definite answer.

This was resolved on another forum. The eggs were from a virgin female.
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CANADIAN SILKWORMS