Reptile & Amphibian Forums

OK, let me introduce myself to the forums. My names Kamil, 17 years old and from NYC. I've been constantly checking up on these forums but I just never posted...yet. So heres my issue...

About a month ago I added a new little creature to my in home zoo *lol*. A nice baby Suriname male RTB. He is about 22 inches long and I was told he's about 4 months old. This seems just about right huh? Anyways, I have him in a 20 high tank **i know i know, they grow big and need space, i know, hes moving into a custom 47"x17" enclosure soon enough** However, i siliconed glass to one of the sides of the tank so he basically has a 2nd level to go on, thats basically his "cold side". On the bottom left there is a hide , on the right is his big water bowl **that he NEVER goes in** and on the top he has another hide. He never actually goes in the hides which i find a little weird but normal i guess. He kind of scrunches himself up behind the hides, i dunno, hes weird. All i use are UTH's. he warmest side is kept constantly at around 90-93 with a slight drop at night, since i figured temps should go down at night. And the cold side *2nd level* is at around 80. Humidity was at around 80-90 at first but i quickly changed that after he started making clicking sounds. Its at around 50-60 now n hes no longer making the sounds. **********sorry for the long explanation but i knew you guys would be asking later on*******

Newho, my problem is his eating. He is captive bred n born as of what I know. When i received him he looked SLIGHTLY skinny, but def. nothing major. This was a little over a month ago. I figured he would have shed by now also but nothing yet. Okay, 3/4 days after i got him i tried feeding him and he ate like a champ * i feed him in my tub btw * i waited a week and tried feeding him again, but this time i figured i would give him live, but stunned, food rather the FT. At frst he didn't seem extremely interested but within a minute or two he attacked and took it down. 4 days later unfortunatly he regurged, maybe because temps were too low, i dont know. So i waited a few days and tried feeding him again, which i know now was a mistake but he didnt eat anyway. So, i waited about 1.5 weeks and tried feeding him....wasn't interested. a few days later tried again and he ate but very strangely. He wasnt interested but eventually just started licking it sort of and jsut opened its mouth and made me put it in. I was like wtf, none of my other snakes ever did that. He swallowed it but he was so weird that day. Like, he was trying to be gentle or something. *btw im feeding him FT mice fuzzies or rat pinks, same size* A week later i tried feeding him again with no luck. And now, as I'm writing this its been two weeks where my little boy hasn't eaten and I'm worried. I want him to eat and fatten up. What am i supposed to do? Should I be worried????
Ok, so sorry for the long post, but i know you guys are the best here and you answer quickly. Thank you ahead of time....

P.S. I've always been told that these snkes are supposed to be active but mines far from it. I named him snoozey for the fact that he always sleeps. I never see him roaming around his tank, even at night. Like I see him move from warm to cold side but thats about it. Thats his routine, warm up, cool down, warm up cool down. I never actually see him move...just when i look at his cage hes in diff positions, and like i said always around the hides not it. ANd ive only seen him perosnally drink twice, i guess he does it when im not there but still....
When i take him out at night and sometimes during the day, 2/3 times a week, hes a little curios...smelling around but eventually he just retreats back into my hands, get comfortable and falls asleep until I move again and then he starts moving.

HELP! *LOL*

Hey, man!
Here's just some standard stuff for baby snakes:
Usually, it seems that smaller snakes do better in smaller spaces, especially nervous ones. It's almost counterintuitive. You'd think he'd want as much room as possible because that's what you'd want, but he really just wants to hide and be warm. He'll grow into the larger cages later, but when they're new and stressed, you want to kind of build up their confidence. If they feel like they're out in the open, they may fear that some predator will pick them off. In my personal opinion, I think stress can lead to regurgitation.
I keep babies in little sterilite shoe boxes. It's in a rack system because I have a few, but you could probably just get one and put some heat tape or a heat pad on one side so that he has a temperature gradient if you’re only planning to have one snake. If you’re planning to raise a few baby snakes, a shoebox rack system will change your snake keeping experience forever. Your cage and heat situation will make or break you every time. Anyway, make sure he can choose to be cool or warm at any time. I think the night drop is a good thing. I use it for all of my snakes. It seems more natural and seems to give them a "break" at night.
Anyway, another thing that can cause regurgitation is parasites. I don't care how great they look or who they came from, I check every fecal I can until I get 3 clean ones in a row or until I find something. If I find parasites, I treat them and start retesting to look for 3 clean fecals starting 2 weeks after the last dose of meds.
This is just some simple stuff, but I find it eliminates about 90-95% of my problems with baby snakes.
Bottom line:
1. small, well heated cage
2. check for and eliminate parasites.
Of course, now that he's puking, wait 10-14 days before feeding again, maybe soak him to rehydrate him and feed him something way smaller than what you'd "normally" feed him.
Just what I think. There are a lot of people on this forum with some really good ideas, too. Hopefully, they'll chime in.
Good luck!
Aaron

Ye, hes def. stayin the the 20 high for now, not a fan of the whole rack system. Plus for the fact that im 17, lives with the parents in an apartment, n already have a zoo in my house, racks aren't going to happen, lol. Plus, im moe of a fan of the aesthetic tank

But on the topic....should i be worried about the feeding. Its already been 2 weeks and he still isnt showing any interest. He's a little skinny and i want to fatten him up. And like i said, shudn't they be more active?

Snakes are nocturnal, they are active at night. This is why you don't see it do much.

Moving from side to side is being active. If he wasn't going cool/warm, then I would be worried.

These animals don't jump up to lick you or do anything like that... just because he is not moving doesn't mean he's sleeping.

Some snakes don't like hides, some may not trust them right away, some just seem to push them away like they are in the way of their 'space'.

If the snake ate it's first meal F/t, and well, I don't know why you would try to go to live or stunned.. but anyway, stick with what works!

Maybe I missed it, but what were the temps on the cool side, hot side, and ambient temps?

Chances are likely that even though you were told it is a CBB snake, it may be an import, or farmed baby. These usually come loaded with parasites and are known for not eating and giving other problems.
Sure, they can be treated, and fixed, but this is not ideal for a beginner or normal keeper. Why buy sick and then spend to fix when you can just buy healthy for almost the same exact price...

Also, you feed in the tub... I guess you believe you are doing something good by not feeding him in his cage and whatnot.. and while many people think this is good, you may not have thought about how cold the tub is... or how different it is than what he's used to.

If you take a snake out of it's enclosure/habitat, and toss it in a cold tub, with you overhead watching, I wouldn't find it strange if none of the snakes would eat. And if this does work with the others, that doesn't mean it's right... that just means you've gotten it to work.
I would suggest another cage or tub, even a box.

The good thing is, coming on a forum like this and explaining so much gets you the experience you need to do beter... people chime in, you get others opinions, you get tips from people that have been doing it well for years...

Keep in mind some books we may read may be 10-20-30 years old! and written by people who may have had a good amount of knowledge o the subject, or they may have been the only ones with *enough* knowledge just to write that book.

Either way, actually keeping these animals and working with them daily will give you tips, tricks, and options that may not be available in these books.

The way I see it, if you are scared to ask questions or make mistakes, you are basically scared of succeeding.

So good job on coming here...

Best wishes... Joe
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

HA! i got you on this one joe! lol, i actually fill up the tub with warm water for a few minutes to warm it up. But i guess you're right...I'll just get something smaller.

Temps go from 90-92 about on the warmest side, slight drop at night. And then the coldest side is at around 80-82. Humidity is in the 50's.

And yeah, i knew he wasnt go to be crazy active but i figured it'd be more. Guess not. Sometimes he'll even spend a whole day or so in one spot on the cold side or whatever.

As for beeing wild caught. Its def. not. Ive had friends buy from him multiple time *Jay www.exoticjungle.net*. all their burms n bloods are doing fine. I don't know, im going to get my guy checked out soon just in case but please keep the replies coming.

Still would appreciate some repies about the feeding. Isnt it bad that he just doesnt seem hungry after two weeks?

While not eating is not good for any animal, snakes are very hardy creatures. Last year one of my baby Brazilian Rainbow Boas simply refused to eat. All his siblings were chowing down weekly and he just turned his nose. I tried everything and finally had to assist feed him but that was only after MONTHS of not eating. This guy was a few months old, had shed twice and had NEVER eaten. He was not growing but also was not wasting away.

Bottom line, a couple weeks can be an indicator of a problem but do not worry that he needs to eat or will soon die.

BTW, the picky eater, after a few sessions of assist feeding, now eats weekly and is growing like the rest, still way behind in size and will be until he reaches maturity.
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Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
10.22 BRB
10.15 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

i've been gotten! lol... sorry to assume that!
I went against my own beliefs!
"Always assume your assumptions are invalid. - Robert F Tatman"

So let's talk about refusing food.

This could be for many reasons...
the snake may have internal parasites, or maybe the snake isn't ready or totally healed inside from the last time...
Regurging can be very traumatic for a snake, and some may choose not to eat again.

If regurged a day after or so, this is not as bad... the snake can be fed about a week later, maybe more if you want to be ultra conservative...

If the snake regurged more than 2-3 days later, this is when that meal is already partially broken down, soaked in acids, and already down towards the end of their stomach or stomachs. At that point, the regurge is extremely strenuous, harmful, and dangerous. It sends more acids up through more stomach and esophagus, and this burns and tears the linings. this is when you should give it atleast 2-4 weeks rest before attempting again, and then attempting with a much smaller item.

The temps would be a bit warm for MY tastes and experiences.. for lack of a more suitable fix, you can try adjusting temps a bit and see if anything changes.. but you can only gauge this correctly after a few days minimum, preferebly longer, and while having fed him or alteast tried to during this time.

He can be stressed... maybe he's a bit too nervous with everything going on around him, since it's a glass tank..

Also, could be a chemical thing... like strong solutions used for cleaning, insecticides (roach spray), or other harmful substances used in or around the cage.

getting to.... what did you use to secure that glass in the tank?
did you do this after or before it ate the first time?
did you put the snake back in the tank soon after attaching the glass?
did he start refusing after this?

what did he eat the first time.. mouse or rat? and what was tried the other times?

have you tried to switch it lately?

then about the regurge... what size prey did you feed him?
how long after ingestion did he actually regurge?

then about activity...
snakes are not too active at all... and considering they are nocturnal, they may only be active for 2-3 ours during their 'day', which is our night.
so let's say you sleep from 12pm-8am... well that, being your night, will be their day, so to speak, and they may only be active 2-3 of those hours...
so if you're not awake and watching all the time, you may never see him move! and although you are not actually seeing him move, ever, he can very well still be an active snake... see what I mean?

BCC are much more sensitive when it comes to feeding, especially when so young... it may be better to give it a large rat pinky or small rat fuzzy every two weeks, as opposed to the same size colombian boa getting a large mouse every week.

Be well, Joe
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

A few more replies please???