Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Quick question...I understand that people generally try to avoid breeding related animals (aside from those on the rush to prove out morphs and such), but what about animals that share the same sire but have different dams? Are they "related", "unrelated"? Should a pair in this situation not be bred? Basically, what is the general consensus on this?

Thanks,
Marcus

in my honest opinion, breeding a male boa to his half sister would:
not be enough to be considered 'inbreeding' to the point of deformities and other malaties.

be just enough to stick with the lineage (color/pattern/look) while still introducing new blood and keeping it fresh.

not be enough to prove out a certain gene or trait in an animal through extensive filial generations.

my only concern would be if these are albinos with KNOWN issues...
for instance, if one of their parents were a deformed albino (ie. missing eye), and these half related offspring ALBINOS were bred back to eachother, I think that would still give problems. I would stay away from that.

in just about any other case out there, you should be fine.

joe
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

I think it is possible to see deformities with half-sibling breedings. I would only do it is there was a really good reason to do it. I would not do it if it was avoidable, and I would certainly not do it with albinos.

Caden

I dont hardly think snakes do a background check when they meet in the wild.....at least I don't think they do....

All kidding aside (and I hope you did not take that wrong) just tired and in a funny mood ha ha!

Anyhow most snakes in the wild have a relatively small territory so that would lead me to believe that inbreeding is a natural occurrence that cannot be avoided.

That being said....
It has been proven that problems may arise as you line breed for too long without introducing new blood. It does not matter whether it is a morph or not things genetically eventually line up to produce negative deformities....ofcourse we want the pretty deformities limited to color and or pattern...........

So I would say just pay attention to the outcomes of the litters and add new blood once in a while.

Bob

Why do you consider color and pattern as deformities??

I think color and pattern aren't a deformity. I consider a deformity as.... Kinks, missing eyes, extra parts, or any other instance where the snake is not "formed" correctly. To me a deformity is something that "could" bring down it's quality of life.

I realize that in the wild that an abnormal colored or patterned snake could bring down the quality of life, but normally they'd only make them an easier target for predators. Mainly because they'd be easier to spot.

A "mis-shapen" snake would also be an easier target for pretators, but in that case, it might be an inability to escape that would make them a target. Some boas are so badly mis-shapen that they don't survive very long after birth. Anyway I think when talking about defomities in snakes that color and pattern shouldn't be considered a deformity.

Also deformities are "generally" random. They can't be "consistantly and predictably" reproduced. If they could we could eliminate them all together.

A boa with a different pattern or color can still be formed correctly. It's just got a different paint job. I've always thought of different colors or patterns a genetic mutation. Color and pattern morphs can be consistantly and predictably reproduced.

I apologize, you may have taken what I said a bit too literal.
The word "deformity" may have been a bit strong. But you are right color and pattern is not so much a deformity as kinks big eyes and other things we dislike.

I did not mean to connotate such a negative meaning. I love the color and pattern "deformities"....lol.

Bob

Thanks, fellas. I was just curious if people marketing "unrelated pairs" could possibly be selling animals with the same sire but different dams. I'm assuming that a reputable breeder would let a buyer know if this were the case, but as we all know, not everyone is a reputable breeder.

I appreciate the feedback,

Marcus

Actually I see people advertising "unrelated pairs" of Albinos or het for Albinos all the time.

The problem with this is that, "there's no such thing". At least, not in the Kahl or Sharp Strains. In Kahl strain they can all be traced back to the original male. In Sharp strain they can all be traced back to the original female. I'm not sure aobut the T+ Albinos, but it "could" be the same with them too.

.
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin