Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi all:

Just went to Hamburg yesterday and Man, what a great show. If you will remember, I was the one who said that I was going to get more BP and more pigmy rattlers at the show. Well I did.

My BPs that I bought at the show went through a lot of stress (the show and then the long drive to a new home). However, they didn't hesitate at all to feed. I hope this means that they all have a great feeding response. Don't you think that if they will eat under all that stress, that they must be great feeders?

These babies were starving! These things are pretty skinny and young. They measure 15 to 16 inches. Their ribs are showing and spine is showing. I am not entirely certain if they are not dehydrated, even.

However, each of the three ate rodents. See the snake in the left corner? She already as a lump in her (from an adult mouse), and she is swallowing a rat weanling.

Price could not be beat! $8 a piece. I am smiling! (I actually bought four and I am keeping two.) The fourth one who is not pictured did not eat. I am going to let her settle into a great environment with good hide box and rehydration and good temp/humidity. I am sure she will come around. I am only keeping two of these babies. The other two will go to my neighbor.

What a great pic. Three feeding babies with no special arrangement. Just feeding out in the open on the table!

Click this blue line: All the purchases from Hamburg. Including Pigmy rattle snake& copperhead

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Longtang. I like snakes and rats.

$8.00 great deal. Males or females?
I was at JY's table. Hot as all get out!
Glad to see your feeding them. They must have been real hungry.
Good luck with them.
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RicK Denmon

Ball Boutique,Inc.

>>$8.00 great deal. Males or females?
>>I was at JY's table. Hot as all get out!
>>Glad to see your feeding them. They must have been real hungry.
>>Good luck with them.
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>>RicK Denmon
>>
>> Ball Boutique,Inc.
>>
>>

All Females! I popped them myself and had the vendor check my work. Only one out of the four was incorrect (ie I did it first and then the vendor found hemipenis). I like girls because I like big ball pythons. I like the way they feel substantial and hefty when you hold them. Hopefully these will grow to be 5.5 lb big girls!!

cheers.

I love Hamburg! Did you see my hots? I love pigmy rattlers!

I now have 3 pigmies, one Copperhead and four ball pythons!

cheers.
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Longtang. I like snakes and rats.

I wouldn't be surprised if one if not more of those balls that just ate die on you within 2 days. Hopefully I am wrong, but in my experience if you take a very thin baby ball (or burm) and feed it a large meal they are unable to digest the meal and it eventually kills them. If you asked me I'd say the one on the bottom left will go first and possibly the other two. Hopefully you prove me wrong!

Corey

>>I wouldn't be surprised if one if not more of those balls that just ate die on you within 2 days. Hopefully I am wrong, but in my experience if you take a very thin baby ball (or burm) and feed it a large meal they are unable to digest the meal and it eventually kills them. If you asked me I'd say the one on the bottom left will go first and possibly the other two. Hopefully you prove me wrong!
>>
>>Corey

Okay, it is a deal. I will keep you up-dated on the condition on her and all of my new babies.

It is my personal experience that BPs will surprise you again and again with how much they can handle.

I am pretty sure that she is going to be just fine. I love my babies and would never intentionally do anything to harm her.

Have you actually had burms die on you from feeding? Can you tell me more about that? It isn't that I don't believe you if you say that is your personal experience. It is just that my personal experience with BP's tells me that Pythons will turn even the largest of food into a pile of poop with ease.

Also, could you give me an idea of how long it will be before I can consider that I am out of the "Danger Zone?" My guess is that if she is fine four days from now (and the lump disappears), then there will be nothing to worry about.

thx in advance.
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Longtang. I like snakes and rats.

This only happens when you let the animal go too long and they get thin and then you feed them a really big meal. I've had it happen to both balls and burms.....only with the skinny problem feeders though. If they are still alive in 3 days then you will be fine. Most times you feed them and then 1 to 2 days later they are dead with bloated bellies.

Corey

Okay, it is a deal. I will keep you up-dated on the condition on her and all of my new babies.

It is my personal experience that BPs will surprise you again and again with how much they can handle.

I am pretty sure that she is going to be just fine. I love my babies and would never intentionally do anything to harm her.

Have you actually had burms die on you from feeding? Can you tell me more about that? It isn't that I don't believe you if you say that is your personal experience. It is just that my personal experience with BP's tells me that Pythons will turn even the largest of food into a pile of poop with ease.

Also, could you give me an idea of how long it will be before I can consider that I am out of the "Danger Zone?" My guess is that if she is fine four days from now (and the lump disappears), then there will be nothing to worry about.

thx in advance.
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Longtang. I like snakes and rats.

Pythons in the wild will usually find something to eat usually before they become emaciated. That is why it's ok to let your ball and pythons acclimate first beofore you feed it, usually not long enough to have any ill effect and causing emaciation. Snakes can go for a long time without food, but even they have limits. You should have gone with a smaller food item...like a pinkie or smaller fuzzy.

Not sure if you are right but it was a BIG meal. Might have been first meal. Just hope they have 89-90 heat on them to help digest.
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RicK Denmon

Ball Boutique,Inc.

correct........

wonder if they came with the proper veterinarian papers of good health?>???

and they wonder why te pet trade is going to chit.....(actually BEEN chit all along)......

$8........

...........I actually sold NO balls yesterday to anyone other than a friend from a store(he knows every year to get them .)...

I didn't look around.....I don't have to......I know the "piles of spaghetti" were all over the place....

and YES snakes that are starved for a long time can die if they finally eat........

good luck.........

All the imports here have been hatched for awhile. all are starting to look skinnier and skinnier. People buy so many and don't house and feed them properly. Bet thousands have died so far this year. some with the sellers some with the purchaser. I realize that some people do buy imports and care for them properly, but i feel that they are the exception. guess that is life though. but it is very sad.
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Derek Affonce
DeKeAff Exotics
dekeaffexotics.com

...I would have to agree, but I wasn't going to be the first to say it! With boas it's even worse! Scott J. Michaels DVM
P.S. Did you see that skinny japanese kid won the Coney Island Hot Dog Eating Contest for the 3rd year in a row!

wow.....too bad you didn't get captive born FAT babies.....
they weren't too much more money eiter........
and they were just 5 isle rows away........
did you say Hi to me or Demo????......LOL.....

o well.........someone else will get them at double price......at Daytona or at the pet sop that got them yesterday........

have fun.........pray they hold the food...if they don't puke in a few days you should be ok.........

JYReptiles

Was Demo the good looking guy next to you? LOL
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RicK Denmon

Ball Boutique,Inc.

No...that was Steve..............

hahahaaaaaa

I want to get a CB 03 female at Daytona(no imports for me). How much are you going to be selling them for?? I am sure there will be many there, but I want a healthy CB. I want to get a feel for how much they are gonna cost. Thanks,
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Josh
My Email

lots of wild caught at Daytona......dont't be fooled......

normal captives....?....hmmm...wonder if I even saw any there.....

oh yea......I remember.........tere was at least a few there.......at PMHerp table.........

alot of the rest were imported......but they weren't $8 anymore.........

yep............

JYReptiles

Believe me, I am not going to buy one without asking if it is CB or not, and I also know some people will lie. Maybe I will just buy one off line, there are a few in the classifieds that I was looking at...
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Josh
My Email

I bought a Cb holdover from 2002 from Susquehanna Ectotherms for $40. She's a real nice looking snake and she has a lot of meat on her. I saw a lot of Ball pythons at the show, but I liked Ted's the best. Buying really small snakes makes me nervous, so I usually go for 1 year olds.

Ted is a good man. Feel safe with him. At one time he worked for Pete. JY had some nice one too!
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RicK Denmon

Ball Boutique,Inc.

Yea, but I am kinda hoping to get a young one, just so I can raise it up. My other bp's were bought as adults...
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Josh
My Email

I like Ted alot.........I have NO problems with him at all......and if you didn't buy one of mine......Ted is the best person to actually buy one from..........he has so many nice snakes........too many.......you wouldn't believe his numbers......LOL........anyways.........the balls e as are nice,2002,and they did a good job from the time they had a boat ride............I bet on it.........

have fun

good luck

cannot wait till Ted actually makes my new rack for my adult balls...........boy....they will be happier too........
(28 x 28 inch boxes.............

JYReptiles

But what about the pair you got from me? gee...I feel abandon.
My balls are nice too!
How sooooon you forget.
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RicK Denmon

Ball Boutique,Inc.

How do you stop people from needlessly taking animals from the wild? You supply that demand w/ quality animals & try to eduacate them. You are in a room full of fellow Americans who care enough to properly house their animals & provide an environment to successfully maintain & breed colonies of beautiful creatures & you buy 6 WC @ $8/ea. - most of which are definately doomed. You could have easily supported your fellow herpers habit and paid $50 for one that was actually cared for, captive-bred & healthy. Keep smiling - ignorance is bliss. You have made some African very happy w/ your 50 cent profit you have provided him. Just say NO to wild-caught unless it is something that you cannot find in captivity. There is a reason they say, "You get what you pay for".

I was given a ball like that just over 6 weeks ago, she needed a week's worth of vet treatment for dehydration and malnutrition costing £120 (I'm from the UK) before she was even strong enough to take her first meal. She also had at least 3 broken ribs which still haven't healed. Thankfully she eats on her own and is gaining weight now, but when I first got her, her whole digestive had shut down so I wouldn't be surprised if these ones just can't cope with whole food, espcially such large items.

>>I was given a ball like that just over 6 weeks ago, she needed a week's worth of vet treatment for dehydration and malnutrition costing £120 (I'm from the UK) before she was even strong enough to take her first meal. She also had at least 3 broken ribs which still haven't healed. Thankfully she eats on her own and is gaining weight now, but when I first got her, her whole digestive had shut down so I wouldn't be surprised if these ones just can't cope with whole food, espcially such large items.

Man. I have read all the replies and I do feel a little uneasy about the whole wild caught trade thing. I mean I was aware that lots of BP's are imported. However, now that I am closer to the whole thing, it does hit me that I am contributing to poor conditions to baby BP's.

Vendors who import them by the lot-ful don't really take care of them properly. That is correct. I now have seen it personally.

This is definitely a consciousness raising thread and my awareness level has been raised by this thread.

Furthermore, all this talking about a shut-down digestive system: I am very much starting to feel a bit worried. Overall, my babies do look okay. However, I am going to have many sleepless nights over the next 2-3 days until I know that the babies have pulled through.

Then once I know they have pulled through, I will slow down on the big sized feeding until I build their systems back up. Once I build their systems up, I will resume the occassional LARGE feedings. I am of the school that large once in a while is a good thing. I don't know, But when I started BP's, my internet mentors were of the big Prey school. That school of thought have always served me well and given me very much extremely healthy animals. Their heads also have grown very well (in fact, my first BP was fed on mice for a year before I bought him. His head looked small at one point, BuT NO LONGER!--Since I have started feeding occasional extremely large rodents to him)!

cheers.
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Longtang. I like snakes and rats.

Very Well Put!!!!!

I went to Petco today to get some water bowls for my ball pythons(the only reason I ever go to Petco). I saw $99 baby ball pythons, which actually did not look bad, and $9.99 medium fancy rats, which were nothing more than feeder rats with a black spot on its head. This means you spent around $2 less on your ball pythons than the price I saw for rats, its food source! I think some of the newer reptile hobbiests who have not been around for the other throw away pets (anoles, red ears, iguanas) see the Ball in the store for $99 and think it is COOL, and a great DEAL when they find the same snake at a show for $8!!! What a deal, instead of buying one, I can buy like 5 for half the price of one at a store. The problem is, $8 ball pythons are most always imports, or non feeding animals. So you may end up spending $40 or more on a few snakes, when you could get one nice CB for $50-100. Yeah, it is alot more, but the CB animal will most likely live, eat, and thrive. WC animals may or may not, and just knowing that SHOULD be enough reason for someone not to get one. So if you do get one, for $8 and know ahead of time half the $8 snakes will not survive, that is unacceptable in my book, and is like tatooing Cheap@$$ on your forehead. What your original post told me was that you are too cheap to buy cb, do not care about all the 1000's of animals that are imported and die, just so you can have your $8 ball. It is pathetic, and this is the problem, just like the addicts that are the demand for all the drugs, with no demand for $8 balls, there eventually would be less and less supplied. CB balls are abundant, WC are no longer really needed, except the yearly morph animals, BUT THIS would not be 1000's each year, maybe 10 or so at the most. These animals would also not be shipped in the horrible conditions, and grouped 20 or more to a tub etc. WC animals should be used to establish a captive breeding population, not to provide cheap throw away pets to selfish individuals.

Dave

$50?....LOL....I was there with balls for $30.....noone looked......with all the $8 and $15 balls they just grab them up

the one local pet shop gets 50 at a time or 100....they sell them for $19.99 with a NO guarentee on them policy...tey sell in a week or two.........and die in 3......?...LOL

really......I didn't look around at all.too hot and too busy.......

........people............you have to ........ate it?.......

JYReptiles

Well, you should have gone with a pinkie. Food size should increase gradually because the snake will not be able to digest a huge meal very well after they have been starved and has become emaciated. You can actually make things worse. Veteranarian will do the same thing, only the right amount of food. Because the snake was starved, there bodies aren't able to produce a lot of digestive enzymes and that much amount of food will not all be digested and probably some will rot and make the snake sick. Just keep it warm with the basking spot of 90-95 degree and it will keep the rest of the cage at about 80-85 degree. This higher temperature will help metabolism and boose the immune system.

How do you think their body produces chemicals...they get it from the food they eat. If they emaciated, they can't make a lot of the digestive enzymes...no raw materials.

If you feed a snake too large of a prey, it can't beat the bacteria when it comes to digesting it. If it's an older snake, it'll usually gurge, but it can be lethal.