Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This is my ball python.

Here's another.

You need to get rid of that screen and get that light out of there. I just beamed my 40w light with a raytec and it read 142 degrees!!!!

You need to research about an animal before you get one..

I feel very sorry for your ball.

Yikes! Get that light out of there! And you should take the snake out to photograph it. Where did you get it, anyway?
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*~Ginevive~*

The light is ok...I just have to screen off the light, which I will do. Well, I've taken him out before to clean his cage, but according to "The Ball Python Manual" I should take him out once in a while and for short period of time until he gets use to being handling. I didn't want to stress him out.

What are you talking bout? He's happy...the temperature at the basking spot is at 90-95 degree during the day. That's what all the good book said...the basking spot should be at least 90 degree. He use the basking area very frequently...and I provide the hide box on both the cool end and the hot end. FYI, I bought the "The Ball Python Manual" by Phillipe de Vojolis and he said that they need quite high temperature to fair well. Young snakes spend a lot of time basking at higher temperature because they are growing. He has a very good appetite and is very alert...he's behaving normally. I only take him out once in a while because according to "The Ball Python Manual" you should take it out an handle it for short period of time occassionally until they get use to you. So, far I haven't had any problem with my snake. The only I need to do is screen off the light from the snake...

That animal will end up stressed/burned if you keep that light in there!

And the screen is a problem waiting to happen. If you feel the screen is safe, then I would like you to rub a chunk of it all over your face for 2-3 hours a day for 1 week straight.

It's not even a problem...I don't know what you are talking about. They haver rough scale, and the wire screen are space further apart. The animals can easily rub agains the wood with glass sliding door and wear away skin even worse than the screen lid. Anyway, I have never heard of anyone having trouble with the screen lid...the reason for not using screen lid like this is because the animals can escape, ball pythons are known for being escape artists. It's locked down securely. A lot of people have the sliding screen lid, and I have never heard any experts recommending against that. And, I don't know what you are talking about he loves basking at the hot spot. Young snake spend a lot time basking. I think if he was too hot he would moving around the cage looking for a cool spot. Most reptiles require toasty environment to do well. There is some reptiles that need to bask until they get so hot that the average body temperature is lethal to other reptiles and animals...I hardly call that cold blooded, you think.

You do as you wish, and again, I feel for your animal.....

Anyway, people make the mistake of comparing ectotherms with endotherms. Warm blooded animals, like mammals, have trouble keeping cool in hot weathers. Reptiles, on the other hand, rely on external source of heat to maintain body temperatures, so the temperature they are comfortable with is not necessary comfortable for warm blooded creatures. Infact, we humans like the cold more than the heat. This is not true for cold blooded creatures...they feel comfortable in hot weather, actually.

Knott, it seems in your previous posts that you are regurgitating information that you have read word-for-word without any common sense, OR practical experience to back up your ideas. You should listen more and speak less. Let people think you are stupid, don't open your mouth and prove it.

Yeah you really don't need the light. Even if screened off, the snake could either rest itself against the screen and get burnt anyway, or even rub its nose raw from the screen. do you have a heat pad with thermostat below the tank? That's a better heat source. I would think that the light would dry things up a lot, and the snake needs humidity to shed properly, that is unless one of your hide spots is a "humid hide." And you can ditch the sticks too; comfortable BPs hardly ever leave that hide spot.
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*~Ginevive~*

The problem with the heating pad is that I have trouble keeping high temperature of 90-95 for the basking area so I can maintain the rest of the cage at 80-85 degree. I will either have to use it in dual with the light bulb or get a high wattage incandescant bulb. I find that if I keep a large water dish at the hot end the humidity goes up and this is when the snake is most active, at night with the humidity. Anyway, I use a different bulb during the night. Because I have the AC on at night...I use a 100 watt night bulb and cover the the top with old shirts and blankets. The snake acutally spends a lot of time climbing and basking at night everytime I check the temperature. Anyway, for ball pythons, you need to keep it at high temperature as with most reptiles to do well...they need toasty environment.

I just thought you should know that "The Ball Python Manual" by Phillipe de Vojolis was released in 1997. You may want to find a more up to date book to base your information on. Alot more has been learned since this book was written.

That Ball eggs take 90 days to hatch!!! Ha ha, what a crock!
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Knot...99.9% of forum users know that reptiles (ball pythons included) need a "toasty" environment, 90 degrees on the hot side. Also, ball pythons do not require much light, they are nocturnal animals. The screen can pose a problem down the road when your BP is long enough to "climb" up the side of the tank and try to go out for an evening stroll, if you know what I mean. It will push and push to try and escape, as you mentioned. Screening can cause injury, bruised noses etc, as was also mentioned. Having a hide on the warm end and cool end is great and I also see no problem with the "sticks", although they are not necessary, they won't cause any harm either. Afterall, there are "sticks" in the wild and many species of snake actually use them and other substrate materials to aid in shedding (although I doubt they are aware of this). Furthermore, the under the tank heating is the best and can be accomplished using your glass tank. You may just need to check the temperature in the enclosure at the start until you find the temperature you are looking for. I would purchase a thermostat to help control the temperature. They are fairly inexpensive and it takes the guess work out of it. I also think it is great that you are reading up on your python, but the "Ball Python Manual" is not the only source out there, which was also previously mentioned. A very large number of forum users have very extensive experience and knowledge with regards to caring for ball pythons. When several people tell you the same information, you may want to take notice and consider it for future reference. Just trying to help. Nice BP by the way. Good luck!

Thanx...I will do something about the screen lid. I'm gonna put the smooth screen over and under the top of the wire lid. I make a better lock when it grows up. I have the elastic straps that I can use to hold the lid down...but so far it hasn't been able to push the lid up yet...at least if I didn't know about not high enough, anyway.

Why spend so much time and effort to improve a sub-optimal enclosure. Your python will take a while to grow up, during that time you might want to save up for a purpose built plastic enclosure. These are escape proof, they hold humidity well, and you can even find some that have optional built in heating for use with a thermostat.

As I am sure you will soon learn...this board is only trying to offer advice...we have been through this before. Also, the lesson about ectotherms and endotherms is wholly unnecessary. To someone offering advice from experience it could also be a little insulting. Try not to let a husbandry criticism get to you. We might be a little short because we see these kind of set-ups nearly every day. Best of luck to you. There is nothing like seeing an animal thrive when it is provided optimal conditions.

What about the screen is not okay? Is it because of the kind of screen it is or are all screens considered bad? I'm looking into getting a BP and the majority of what i have read on them, and I've read a lot from many diff sources, says that the thing to have is a locking screen lid. So I'm a bit confused. Also I had an Iguana for 5 years until she got a tumor and i had to put her down and I kept her in a glass aquarium with bulbs for heating and I didn't have a hard time keeping it humid and that was at 85%.
Tomorrow

This is a good part of my problem here. I see alot of posts by Knot / Knott where he is offering advise and posting links to this Iggy website, WHY? This is the BP forum and they are two entirely different animals!!!

Your Iguana NEEDS a basking light, Royals do not, they are nocturnal animals.

The screen is just idiotic in my eyes, why cover your pet with something that can/WILL harm them?
And I'm not even going to carry on and argue about that damn light INSIDE this Balls cage.

I apologize for getting worked up a bit, it just pisses me off when I see people offering poor advise on animals they dont keep properly themselves.

I wish you luck with your snake Knott, I would also like to suggest you start taking advise from others that deal mainly with Ball Pythons and have been doin so for quite some time.

I agree with most of what you said, but instead of yelling at him telling him to get rid of the screen, how about you tell him to ditch the screen, and then give him some ideas to other things that he could use for a lid to his aquarium?
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Josh
My Email

I too get sick of all the insults, especially to newbies...we were all there once. Yes, most of us probably keep our BP's in rubbermaid type containers with heat tape or heating mats, but some people either do not have the adequate equipment or cannot afford it at the given time. Many times I read posts and do not respond because there are too many "know it alls" on here and I am not saying that there are not "know it alls"...it is just the attitude that goes along with it. Example...realvenom, while you are trying to help, the attitude is pretty harmful. New herpers are not going to listen when your attitude is condescending. I think it is important to understand that many newbies are trying and have listened (many times too often) to some flunky at a Petco or the like. They need proper guidence, as we all do from time to time. No one knows everything. Many on here probably come close, but I will be the first to admit that I have asked questions several times on here, but I would be more than a little ticked off if someone talked to me that way. Lets all try to be thoughtful...ok, I am down from my soapbox. I am not trying to offend anyone, just expressing my 1st amendment rights.

Perry, I get sick and tired of newer people not listening, he had others that warned him of the screen top and lamp inside the cage.

Knott, I would advise you to purchase a UTH and place it beneeth one of the two hides. I have been keeping Balls for some time, and I still use the Zoo-Med heat mats for ALL of my Ball Pythons. I have never had the temps get over 94 with these heat mats when used in a glass tank.
Another suggestion would be a Plexi or Lexan cover for the tank. This will help keep the heat and humidity inside.

I will apologize AGAIN, to you (Knott) for over reacting. It did bug me how you seemed to disregaurd the advise of others,and please think twice before posting advise to others that are new/newer to keeping Ball Pythons

This is an animal that we all love and enjoy, and im down for helping/being helped by others.

P.S. Knott, If you have any problems with a UTH or the new top for this tank, please email me the tank size and your address and I will send you the proper heat mat and top...ON ME!

Al

Knott, my email addy is Als-Beautiful-Balls@new.rr.com

That's ok...I'll have to build another lid for it. Maybe I'll make a sliding door with acrylic plastic, or a hinged lid with locks. I have been doing some search...and there is an undertank heating pad that is especially made to raise the ambient air temperature in the tank 20 degree higher than the room temperature. It was suggested by someone that if the lights are inside the cage I should screen it off...I think it was both Philippe de Vosjolis and Malissa Kaplin. I read her bio and she does keep a ball python at the moment, along with other reptiles. Many of her care sheets was even translated into Dutch, Chinese, French, etc and used... by the many herpatological societies around the world including the Americans. Maybe I wasn't reading it right. She has been studying, self-taught, and asking vets about what she is doing, taking care of the reptiles for a long time...since when the hobby was still young when there weren't many caresheets out there. Even some vets use her caresheets. The main reason she was doing this is because she worked at the animal rehabilitation center dealing with reptiles...most of her reptiles, at one time she had many reptiles, were, and are, rescued animals, and because she wasn't able to find the specific caresheets she had to do a research on her own from many text from university, and asking vets.

Thats it, Many have told you that these people have no idea how to take care of anything.

Just keep learning from these "pros"

Im done with this BS

"I read her bio and she does keep a ball python at the moment"

The people that replied to your dumbass keep 100s of balls at the moment...

If you are gonna drop names, drop names that people respect!

OK...I must admit that I agree with you on this one. What are you gonna do. Knott...he is right...there are people on here that keep way may BP's than either of the two you mentioned. And when you post ignoring good advice, I suppose you get what you asked for

s

Ok, it might just be a lost cause. But realvenum, i will take the free heatmat....lol....save me $20.
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Josh
My Email

Just tryin to help the young man.

d

You're probably right about the screen lid. So, if they don't spend time basking; then don't they seek hiding spot during day that is very warm when they are babies? Isn't there like the night when they are not active? At what temperature at night are they most active? And what is the preferred temperature of their hideout during the day for babies, and for adults, also. How do you achieve higher temperature at the hot end with the heating pad, if I don't use the light. Is there like a special heating pad that I could use?

You must have bought a defective heating pad or your thermometer is a piece of crap. All reptile pads I have had get up to 100degrees, and I have never had the problem of getting the temp high enough, but i have had the problem of getting it low enough. Go buy a reptile UTH, and stick it under your tank, buy a rheostat too, plug the uth into the rheostat and then adjust the rheostat, until the ground temp reads 88-90 degrees. This will be perfect. Put your substrate down, and then put the hide box over where the uth is. Ditch the light, you wont need it, the uth will be the only heat source needed. If your thermometer still reads that it is too low, go buy a new digital one at Wal-Mart for 15 bucks.
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Josh
My Email

I just brought up my Iguana, because you expressed concern about the humitity not being adaquit with the cage set up that way. Thats all.

Hello to all (some). I am new to this whole reptile thing and have had a ball for about 4 weeks. I can tell you I have spent countless hours researching the habitat and care of these snakes and find a lot of conflicting info. I just joined this forum and I can see there is also a lot of conflicting info here as well. On top of that there are a couple of hot heads who seem to know everything. I can find you a lot of care sheets who recommend lights and indicate wire tops are fine. I have read, composed by what seemed to be a respected herper, the only reason a ball will become injured by rubbing is if the environmental conditions are not optimal and he is constantly trying to escape. So far I have observed differently with my ball. I think he just likes to be handled by me. I have worried sick that I'm not getting the tank EXACTLY right and spent DAYS on it. I probably have 5 thermometers (2 digital) and 3 hygrometers in a 20 gallon long and an IR thermometer and am still paranoid everything is not right even though I can't find anything out of spec.

I really can't believe how Knott got his ass chewed so quick. I have come to the conclusion that you really need to pick and choose what advice you take. You need to research multiple sources and find a commmon answer to whatever question it is you may be researching. After that, you implement the info, make sure you take the snake to a qualified vet, then observe your ball and make your decisions from there. Now, this is simply my opinion and anyone can do whatever they want to with it. Sometimes I like to think my snake is living the life of luxury. I'll be damned if I'm going post any info of my setup, though and I will definitely not give advice until I have a lot more experience.

Anyway, for those of you who give good advice thanks for lending a helping hand to the novices like myself. There seems to be a lot of good info I will definitely be using. Now, as soon as I get enough confidence I won't be slammed for some unexpected reason I'd eventually like to post a picture of my pride and joy!!

I think that snakes kept in optimal conditions can also be harmed by the screen. Do you have adults? My snakes can get pretty restless when breeding time comes around...

I don't have any adults yet. I've only got one but hope to eventually get a few more and possibly get into some breeding. Depends on my living situation.

I have noticed my ball has spent some time "pushing" agains the top at it's "weak point" which I just fixed last night. My ball hasn't been active much outside hisher hide box until a few days ago so I haven't seen much "regular" behavior yet. He just got over some parasite my vet diagnosed him with and became really comfortable in his new habitat. I'm actually surprised how much his demeanor has changed in the last couple of days from reserved to what I perceive as content.

I've been handling him every day now since 48hrs. after I fed him last and he really enjoys being out of his cage. I have read some people say these snakes are inanimate and are primarily display animals. I completely disagree. There is definitely a personality to experience with BP's and I'm really wanting to get another one soon. I've decided to wait, though, until I've had some more time with this one. Some day when I have a few extra thousand dollars to spend I want one of those kick-ass piebalds. Those things look spectacular! I can sense this hobby may become quite an addiction!!

He got his ass chewed because hes been replying to posts with poor advise for atleast a few weeks. I cannot see how someone who does not have his enclosure glitches worked out, can tell other newbies how to set up their own tanks.

The point is, alot of people offered help with his setup, he insisted that people who keep 1 Ball Python know more than anyone else.

Also the crap where he recites some dumbass book word for word gets old as well. He was given advise from people with enormous experiance, and he chose not to listen.

Fair enough. I didn't know the history. I got the impression he was new to the forum. Guess I should sit back and read a while before I put in my two cents. I have just been kind of frustrated because of all of the conflicting advice from these "pros" on BP's. Both on the net and in books. Honestly I haven't spent enough time here yet to form a legit opinion.

I thought they know what they are talking about. I guess it's up to the reader to figure what's information is right. It's tough for a newbies to figure...if you can imagine, it's even difficult, sometimes, for experts. Anyway, I think they are experts because they have been studying about reptiles for a long time, since the hobby was still young...and I do agree, when I read it, that it makes sense...even the vets endorsed his book and Malissa Kaplin's caresheets, unlike many of the sites on the web...not that is wrong, but everybody's got their own ways of doing things right.