Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just got this guya few days ago, and was sold to me as a brindle rat .. This is my first snake, and I have no idea how to tell a brindle rat from a corn.

I've got several pics of him, if anyone can help make a positive ID on this guy, I'd be very thankful. I like the idea that he's a brindle rat, but if he turns out to be a corn, I'm still happy with the snake, he's a beauty and very sweet.

Thanks for any help!

Bill

He looks like a corn to me, but I could very well be wrong. Have you posted this in the corn or rat forum? perhaps give one of them a chance to look and see whatcha got there. Nice lookin snake regardless of his heritage.

Yeah...when posted in the rat forum, someone there thought he was a corn. I honestly don't have a clue, the important thing to me is how sweet he is. Thanks for the compliments, you're right, he IS beautiful. Of course, I'm biased

Bill

>>I just got this guya few days ago, and was sold to me as a brindle rat .. This is my first snake, and I have no idea how to tell a brindle rat from a corn.

Look at your snake's head. The brownish stripe that extends diagonally downard from the eye to the corner of the mouth is called the "postocular stripe". In the picture above the postocular stripe stops at the corner of the mouth. This is cited as a distinguishing feature of the Elaphe obsoleta ssp. (Black Ratsnake group), vs. Elaphe guttata ssp. (Cornsnake group); in Cornsnakes, the postocular stripe extends onto the neck (Conant and Collins, 1998).

However (a big one!), using field characteristics, albeit reliable ones, to differentiate captive-born snakes can be problematic. At best, one could say that your snake is consistent with a variety of the Black Ratsnake, Elaphe obsoleta ssp.

If anyone has a different opinion, please share!

Hope this helped.

John D
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I am so not lesdysxic!

0.1 Creamsicle Cornsake "Yolanda"
1.0 Bairds Ratsnake "Steely Dan"
0.1 Desert Kingsnake "FATTY"
0.1 Black Rat (WV Rescue) "Roberta"

John,

That helps tons! Based on the brown stripe, it would appear that Templeton is indeed of the rat snake variety. The two best things that have happened today are 1) I've learned a little more about identifying traits in black snakes and corn snakes. 2) I got to hold my new lil guy for about fifteen minutes with absolutely NO indications of aggression or tension from him. He seemed very contented to be held and at complete ease.

Thanks much for the response and as you said, if anyone else has opinions or tips on how to distinguish between those varieties, I'd love to hear them as well.

Bill, knoxpatch tennessee

....a black rat(elaphe obsoleta) with that much pattern would have to be no more than a year old.can tell from your pic that that snake is bigger/older than that.looks pretty much to me like an anerythristic(no red pigment) cornsnake..could possibly be a hybrid with a black rat(corns have been successfully hybridized with species a lot less closely related to them than the ratsnakes-so it's very possibly a hybrid)...that being said,i can see it being 100% corn,but definitely not a pure black rat imho.
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"with head raised regally,and gazing at me with lidless eyes,he seemed to question with flicks of his long forked tongue my right to trespass on his territory" Carl Kauffeld

It is either a Ratsnakes (P. obsoleta) or a cornsnake (P. guttata). From that photo it is hard to be sure. It would help if you could show us a photo slightly more from above.
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Chris Harrison
San Antonio, Texas

The remark about the post-ocular stripe is valid. That is key to obsoleta. I am like Chris, however, & would like to see the top of the snake's head. If it has a "spearpoint" mark, that is key to guttata. If it has that mark, it could be a cross between the two species. One other thing...corn & fox snakes are ratsnakes. That is the proper name for the whole genus Pantherophis(Elaphe).

~~Greg~~

I'll get some pics of the top of his head and post. As for his age, he's just now a year old. His birthday was in mid August of 2004, so he's just barely over a year old. The pics are deceptive to his size .. that's my fault.

"His birthday was in mid August of 2004, so he's just barely over a year old."

Did you mean Aug 2005, or 2 years old????

Steve

D'oh!

2005 .. he's a year old lol

Bill