Welcome to kingsnake.com's message board system. Here you may share and discuss information with others about your favorite reptile and amphibian related topics such as care and feeding, caging requirements, permits and licenses, and more. Launched in 1997, the kingsnake.com message board system is one of the oldest and largest systems on the internet.
Well I got this corn about 3years ago, bought as a normal. But over time his markings have faded and he's more evenly coloured all over. Is he really just normal? Its no big deal either way, jus curious, at one point he was a fairly boring brownish colour but in the last few months has become more of an orangey/red colour.
Just thought I'd ask you guys!
it looks a lot like a bloodred. Does it have a pure white belly? Possibly with pure red near the tail. no black thought. You said you have had it since it was a baby? Did it have a grey head? These are all standards of bloodred. I did notice black around the face, although small amounts. Some people say thats acceptable, some don't like it. Two of my bloodreds have small black flecks.
I also got a snake that looks kinda like yours. But, I got him as an adult. He also has tiny amounts of faded black on his belly. I was told after much deliberation that he was just a very red Hypo normal. Here are his pics
-----
****Misty****
www.sneakyserpents.com
"Yesterday was the deadline for all complaints"
the pics make him look kinda orange, but he is red. Here are two more pics. The first one is a pic of One of my Bloodreds. Someone else might be able to give you better pics to compare to. Answering the belly question would help a lot. But you have a very pretty snake.
-----
****Misty****
www.sneakyserpents.com
"Yesterday was the deadline for all complaints"
His bellys kinda like the one in your pic, a few black markings, although its not white, more orange with a few markings
A belly pic would be nice. I, myself would guess bloodred from the top. But, if it has the black checkers at all on the belly, its probably not. Maybe Het for the diffused pattern. It could be at the lower end of the bloodred scale. I have two bloodreds that I consider poor quality because they have the black flecks around the head. Do you know if the head was grey when it was a hatchling?
Looks like you might have to do what I am going to have to do. Breed the snake and see for sure if it is a bloodred. Breed it to another bloodred, see if you get bloodred babies.
Like I said, a belly pic would help and others will for sure offer their opinion. I am definitely not an expert.
This is the blood that I consider lower quality
-----
****Misty****
www.sneakyserpents.com
"Yesterday was the deadline for all complaints"
Il get some belly pics up as soon as I can. Im no expert but to me he just looked normal as a baby, Im not really a corn guy myself but something about him stood out even though he seemed completely normal at the time. Just intrigued with the change in patterning on him
... some normals will have reduced belly checkers and patterning. This is particularly common in upper keys corns. If he looked like a normal as a hatchling, and wasn't sold as anything unusual, then I doubt he's anything but a normal.
-Kat
-----
This Space For Rent
Having bloodreds myself, I agree. If they were bloodreds you'd know - 1.) From the grey heads and vanishing side patterns etc, and the price would have been much higher.
Corns final pattern may not come for 3-5years old. It probbly just has a reduced pattern.
Nice looking corn though!
-----
1.0 Green Iguana
1.0 Bearded Dragon
0.1 Blizard Leopard Gecko
1.1.1 Corn Snakes (2 Blood Red, 1 Orange Amelanistic)
1.1 Ball Python
Thats what I thought but just wanted to get everyone's opinions. He's a great snake whatever he is! Not part of any big breeding program so it's not really an issue
Thanks to everyone for their input!!!
Happy Herping
I'm not saying it i a top notch bloodred. And I would like to see belly shots, and a shot of entire body. Those pics are heavy on the huge. But the background was very close to the saddle. I would say some bloodred in there. I hate the word het for bloods. Some used "wannabe bloods" lol I have a few myself, and no 2 are a like.
More pics. One that show his true colors. I can take pics of my 1 feamle and make her look 4 different ways with lighting.
Nice snake for sure.
-----
Thanks for reading.
Big Tom
Lol. I am just teasing you!
I knew you would have something to say about the bloodred debate.
---Hey, is your computer fixed? I know you were having issues with logging on with Herpzilla?
Notice that in my post I mentioned that the snake could be het for the "diffused" trait. I was thinking of you! lol
I think there are some snakes that just need to be bred out to prove or disprove what they are or are not. Belly, body shots help a lot though.
-----
****Misty****
www.sneakyserpents.com
"Yesterday was the deadline for all complaints"
Here's one of him lying with our amel. Might give you an idea of what colour he is. Belly shots on way
>>that snake is not a "normal"
there is something there
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)
Draybars Snakes
_____
That snake is a normal, possibly from upper keys lines. Normals can and do have reduced side pattern and belly checks, without being carriers of the diffuse gene.
There is a distinct tendency for people to imagine higher end morphs in snakes that are otherwise normal but are far towards one end of the normal spectrum. I'd bet you money that if you bred that snake to a bloodred you wouldn't get a single homozygous blood out of it.
Reduced side patterns and belly checks are really and truely only an indicator of 'het for bloodred/diffused' if there's reason to suspect bloodred heritage in the line. The reason that last caveat is there is because there ARE normals that can mimic the 'het bloodred' look... just like there are normals that can fake being hypo or caramel, and hypos and ghosts that can be mistaken for ultramels and ultramel anerys. As much as we like to think that you can look at a snake and say XX is het for YY just by looking, we really can't. If we have an inkling of its history, we can possibly make an educated guess, but with no background information, any assumptions we make are bound to be faulty.
-Kat
-----
This Space For Rent
>>
>>........we have an inkling of its history, we can possibly make an educated guess, but with no background information, any
assumptions we make are bound to be faulty.
That's all we are doing is making a guess. Hopefully based on experience, or research. But yes still a guess. AI predict (as I love to do this) we will be guessing a lot in the future. As there may be 3-5 ways to get to the same look. Especially with a snake with SOME bloodred in it's lineage. I'm not sure of the numbers, but it sure would be interesting to know, what percentage of breeders in the US know their snakes true lineage, and how many are just kids, or just have a few corns and pop them together. With just a few complex morphs (in a genetic way i.e. not 1 simple recessive gene) the morphs will have far more variability and hence much harder to define by phenotype.
JMO
-----
Thanks for reading.
Big Tom
>>That snake is a normal, possibly from upper keys lines. Normals can and do have reduced side pattern and belly checks, without being carriers of the diffuse gene.
>>
>>There is a distinct tendency for people to imagine higher end morphs in snakes that are otherwise normal but are far towards one end of the normal spectrum. I'd bet you money that if you bred that snake to a bloodred you wouldn't get a single homozygous blood out of it.
>>
.
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)
Draybars Snakes
_____
>>>>That snake is a normal, possibly from upper keys lines. Normals can and do have reduced side pattern and belly checks, without being carriers of the diffuse gene.
>>>>
>>>>There is a distinct tendency for people to imagine higher end morphs in snakes that are otherwise normal but are far towards one end of the normal spectrum. I'd bet you money that if you bred that snake to a bloodred you wouldn't get a single homozygous blood out of it.
>>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>.
was going to respond but saw no real reason to add anything
or start any sh&&
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)
Draybars Snakes
_____
1 those pics are so red period it is hard to tell. It's like someone turned up the color level on my monitor.
As for the so called bloodred, the side color nearly matches the patch color. Is that a normal look? It's also hypo, a natural sign in bloodreds.
JMO
-----
Thanks for reading.
Big Tom
Yeh he is really red to look at, especially today when i took those pics, he just shed last night. Never know for sure what the hell he really is but if i knew how he would turn out id have found out all i could even though i dont really have plans to go further with corns.
Yea it's up and running. Not new new, but I do not do that much on PC's any more, so a slower P-4 is plenty.
As for the bloodred, It's a coin toss. I wish someone could take 50 of these "maybe, could be, is it a bloodred" and breed them in a way to prove or disprove. Then we can see before pics of them, and what they produced.
My 1 wannabe has a solid red vent, usually a great sign, but the pattern on top is not so great.
And I had my very VERY nice female bred to an outcross? at least it was diffused. Babies were all over the place as far as the way they looked.
-----
Thanks for reading.
Big Tom
>>I'm not saying it i a top notch bloodred. And I would like to see belly shots, and a shot of entire body. Those pics are heavy on the huge. But the background was very close to the saddle. I would say some bloodred in there. I hate the word het for bloods. Some used "wannabe bloods" lol I have a few myself, and no 2 are a like.
>>
>>More pics. One that show his true colors. I can take pics of my 1 feamle and make her look 4 different ways with lighting.
>>
>>
>>Nice snake for sure.
>>-----
I don't know about bloodred or outcrossed bloodred but that snake definitely doesn't look normal.
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"resistance is futile"
Jimmy (draybar)
Draybars Snakes
_____
Help, tips & resources quick links
Manage your user and advertising accounts
Advertising and services purchase quick links
