Reptile & Amphibian Forums

My panther 3 month old currently spends most of the time with his eyes closed. He does eat n drink, to my consolation, but I can't help wondering if his closing of eyes signal any illness. When disturbed at night, he doesn't even open his eyes to see wat's happening. Is that normal? Is it because he's young n in need of ample sleep like a human baby? Or could it be my 60W Zoo Med basking light too bright or drying for his eyes? If anyone could answer this worried pet owner's question, I'll be most grateful.

Its not normal that he spends most of his time with his eyes shut.

You asked..."could it be my 60W Zoo Med basking light too bright or drying for his eyes?"...how warm is it below the light? I believe that this light doen't emit UVB rays? Do you have a full spectrum light that emits UVB as well on the cage? (The light shouldn't pass through glass or plastic.)

Do you gutload your insects? What insects do you feed him? Do you dust the insects?

Do you have a substrate? Is he pooping? Drinking? How do you provide water?

Hi Kinyonga, thanx for coming to the rescue again. I do not use substrates. And u're right about the Zoo Med basking light not emiting full spectrum light, so I rushed down to get myself one yesterday. I'm now using the Arcadia Extra High Output 7% UVB D3 Compact Reptile Lanp, is that good enough? As for the feeders, I give the crix T-rex high calcium crix formula, I also throw Zoo Life Vitamin Powder into the feeder bowl, but my cham has never eaten from the bowl for the 1 month he's been with me. So the ones he eats are the free roaming ones with no powder on them. As for water, I use a simple drip bottle system that allows water to constantly drip onto the branches n plastic leaves. His eyes were slightly sunken this afternoon, and his eyes still closed. So I mixed a little of the vitamin water into water n forced fed him. Is that alright? My only consolation so far is that his grip is much firmer than yesterday's. Perhaps the UVB lighting is doing him some good, I really hope it isn't too late.

I'm concerned because you are saying your chameleon's eyes are slightly sunken and that he still isn't opening his eyes. If a solution isn't found quickly, then I recommend going to a vet.

Sorry if I have asked these questions before...but I can't remember everyone's details. I answer too many posts and I can't keep them all straight...or spend time looking up previous posts.

Correct temperatures are important for digestion and thus nutrient absorption. Calcium, phosphorous, D3 (thus UVB) and vitamin A are all important in bone health and need to be in balance. Preformed vitamin A can build up in the chameleon's system, beta carotene sources can't. Vitamin D3 from supplements can build up in the system...but D3 produced from sunlight/UVB can't.

You said..."u're right about the Zoo Med basking light not emiting full spectrum light, so I rushed down to get myself one yesterday. I'm now using the Arcadia Extra High Output 7% UVB D3 Compact Reptile Lanp, is that good enough?"...I don't think I have ever used that bulb...is it the one pictured here under "Zoo Med Compact Reptisun" in the following site? They don't list a 7% one here though. The light shouldn't pass through glass or plastic or the UVB won't be any good, BTW.
http://www.robharvey.com/reptiles/lighting.htm

I usually use Repti-Sun 5.0's florescent tubes. I try to remain consistant in which bulbs I use so I don't have to adjust my supplementation. I use a regular incandescent light in a metal hood for a basking light. Use the wattage that gives you the correct basking temperature.

Direct sunlight would help too...is it too cold to take him outside?

What are the temperatures in the cage under the basking area and in other areas of the cage away from the basking light? (I always put my basking light on one end of the cage so that it gives a warm side and a cool side.) You don't want to bake him! Is he sitting under the basking light or in the cooler area of the cage?

You said...As for the feeders, I give the crix T-rex high calcium crix formula, I also throw Zoo Life Vitamin Powder into the feeder bowl, but my cham has never eaten from the bowl for the 1 month he's been with me. So the ones he eats are the free roaming ones with no powder on them"...I free-roam all my insects and I dust them before I put them in the cage. I know the dust will fall off if they are there too long...but they will at least get some with dust on.

I dust with a phosphorous-free calcium powder at most feedings. Insects have a poor ratio of calcium to phos. so dusting with calcium helps to balance it out.

I use a vitamin powder twice a month and its one that has a beta carotene source of vitamin A (see comments above about vitamin A).

Because my chameleons don't usually get direct sunlight, I dust lightly with a calcium/D3 powder twice a month. I also use a wide variety of greens and veggies, etc. to feed to my crickets and try to give other insects I have a nutritious diet too. I'm not a fan of commercial diets....but again, its just my opinion.

What source of vitamin A is in the gutload and vitamins you use? Is there any vitamin D3 in either?

You said..."His eyes were slightly sunken this afternoon, and his eyes still closed. So I mixed a little of the vitamin water into water n forced fed him. Is that alright?"...I only use vitamins twice a month as I said above. You said he's eating and drinking...so if the insects are well fed and dusted properly then you don't need to do this. Since he hasn't been getting UVB...has he been getting D3 from the gutload or vitamins?

You said..."My only consolation so far is that his grip is much firmer than yesterday's. Perhaps the UVB lighting is doing him some good, I really hope it isn't too late"...I don't know how fast the light would work. I hope its not too late too.

Hope some of this helps...and that I haven't overwhelmed you!

I agree the closed eyes are not a good sign.

That being said, all is not lost. I once had a very young one, smallest of the clutch, that kept her eyes closed for short periods of time throughout the day. I beleive she probably hatched a little early, thanks to their siblings, and perhaps just wasnt quite as robust to start. She was the "runt". But luckily within a couple months she grew out of it and became as active and eyes-wide-open as the rest.

The UVB light is very very important. Remember to change your bulbs frequently (the UVB dies off much sooner than the visible light).

As is proper feeding of the insects you feed to your young and growing chameleon. Do not rely on vitamin and mineral dust suplements. Ensure she is getting the right kind/amount of vitamins from eating her prey insects. I'd be happy to share my gut-load recipie, if you need one. I feed it both to my crickets and roaches.
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SandraChameleon@gmail.com
BC Canada