Reptile & Amphibian Forums

A couple of friends and I are considereing building
something I've been thinking about for a while.

Briefly, it's a sytem for controlling heating,
lighting and possibly other things like misting sytems
for reptile enclosures. The biggest difference between
our idea and anything else I've seen is that rather
than having a separate box with controls for each cage
or small group of cages, the controllers would be
networked and contolled by software on a PC. Aside
from allowing setup of large groups of cages from one
point, it would allow more flexible control.

For instance:
Set heating and lighting to gradually change over a
specified period.
Set heat and light ranges and times to gradually
change with programmed "seasons".
Group cages by home region to simplify setup.
Possibly allow web based monitoring and override of
settings.
Possibly integrate web cams.

We hope to keep the price for the controllers below
the price per cage (not counting the PC) of all but
the very simplest current controllers (dumb
thermostats), so that this will be affordable for
private keepers (like me).

What I need to hear are:
Who would be interested in this?
Who thinks it sounds too complicated and is perfectly
happy with current, simple controllers?
What (if anything) are you using now?
For any breeders or curators with large display
collections out there, is this something you need?
Would you be willing to work with something from a new
company?
What are you using now?
Does anyone know of anything similar that I might not
have seen yet?
Any other features you would like to see?

We would not be building the heating or lighting (at
least for now), just the controllers.

Please let me know what you think.

(Moderators: I hope this is appropriate. It seems to be OK under my reading of the TOS but there's certainly a commercial aspect to it, so if you disagree please remove this post.)

First of all, kudos for a great idea. I think you are on to something. If you can get something like this up and running I think you will do well and help a lot of people out. For me its all about safety. It is scary to hear about faulty controllers and fires. If it is safe I would buy it in a heartbeat. I would use it for tropical snakes and so would'nt need a lot of extras but am really interested in the fact that it could control multiple cages and racks. Pay close attention to safety and maybe put safety features in like automatic shutoff and (other ideas here).

Dan

had no way to implement.

Duh, first priority is safety.

One thought I had was beyond the individual sensor probes and outputs, There could be a room probe as a master. Such that if the room temps go over a set level, all heat sources are turned off. Kind of a summer failsafe.

To make it cost effective, maybe the probe/output units could be modular? Where they connect to a buss and are addressed so you could expand as you wish. Some may want to heat an entire stack of boaphiles with one sensor probe. Others may have elaborate cage stacks with two controllers per cage, one for basking spot, one for ambient temps. Obviously the cost of the system would be driven by the number of controlled temps (probe/heater output) and should be variable to suit the needs of the individual. Also, probes should be seperate, plugable units. Since all would be controlled by some central PC, some cages will be much further for probes than others.

Or, the probe/heat conmtroller could, be localized to the cage with a data cable conmnected either to the PC or to a Buss that "snakes" (pun intended) around the room.

>>A couple of friends and I are considereing building
>>something I've been thinking about for a while.
>>
>>Briefly, it's a sytem for controlling heating,
>>lighting and possibly other things like misting sytems
>>for reptile enclosures. The biggest difference between
>>our idea and anything else I've seen is that rather
>>than having a separate box with controls for each cage
>>or small group of cages, the controllers would be
>>networked and contolled by software on a PC. Aside
>>from allowing setup of large groups of cages from one
>>point, it would allow more flexible control.
>>
>>For instance:
>>Set heating and lighting to gradually change over a
>>specified period.
>>Set heat and light ranges and times to gradually
>>change with programmed "seasons".
>>Group cages by home region to simplify setup.
>>Possibly allow web based monitoring and override of
>>settings.
>>Possibly integrate web cams.
>>
>>We hope to keep the price for the controllers below
>>the price per cage (not counting the PC) of all but
>>the very simplest current controllers (dumb
>>thermostats), so that this will be affordable for
>>private keepers (like me).
>>
>>What I need to hear are:
>>Who would be interested in this?
>>Who thinks it sounds too complicated and is perfectly
>>happy with current, simple controllers?
>>What (if anything) are you using now?
>>For any breeders or curators with large display
>>collections out there, is this something you need?
>>Would you be willing to work with something from a new
>>company?
>>What are you using now?
>>Does anyone know of anything similar that I might not
>>have seen yet?
>>Any other features you would like to see?
>>
>>We would not be building the heating or lighting (at
>>least for now), just the controllers.
>>
>>Please let me know what you think.
>>
>>(Moderators: I hope this is appropriate. It seems to be OK under my reading of the TOS but there's certainly a commercial aspect to it, so if you disagree please remove this post.)
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB, selectively bred from good stock)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
13.26 BRB
11.16 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Although this is a worthwile project, the main flaw of course is that you're relying on a PC being up and running 24/7. If you are running Windows, then that isn't possible

In the control industry, the direction taken has been embedded controllers that you can program and monitor via PC, but do not need the PC up and running to use once programmed.

There are some temperature controllers that have an embedded web server. You simply connect the controller to your network, then open a browser on your PC to the URL of the device and start manipulating setpoints and such. Many use RS232 or RS485 communications via your PC serial port.

Here is a standard controller that uses RS232 to set it up and display on your PC:
www.omega.com/ppt/pptsc.asp?ref=CNI_Series&Nav=temp03

Here is a controller that can be setup with a PC via Ethernet:
www.omega.com/toc_asp/frameset.html?book=Temperature&file=CNI16_Series

There are controllers that do ramp and soak, which means you can set a lower temp for the morning, then ramp up to your daytime temps (over as long a time as you want) then gradually ramp down to evening lower temps.

Here is such a controller, but uses a serial connection, not an Ethernet connection:
www.omega.com/ppt/pptsc.asp?ref=CN8201_CN8202&Nav=temp03

Here is another:
www.omega.com/ppt/pptsc.asp?ref=CN9600&Nav=temp03

See the prices of these units? Not bad, eh? Of course you must add the thermocouple probe and wire and software, so it does add up. Also, you need to hook it up to an SSR that they sell. So it isn't cheap persay, but will do alot of wattage. They do not dim lights, but are perfect for non-light-emitting heaters like RHPs, ceramic bulbs and heat pads.

For lighting, I am not sure. Using a low-cost PLC, you could likely program dimmer function using pulse-width modulation, but I am not sure how for A/C lights. However, Helix does it cheaply, so it isn't difficult.

First, thanks for your input, this was something I hadn't seen yet.

>>Although this is a worthwile project, the main flaw of course is that you're relying on a PC being up and running 24/7. If you are running Windows, then that isn't possible

1) Maybe I should have mentioned that the controllers would be mostly autonomous (web enabled, embedded controllers). I just didin't want to bore everyone with too much detail.
2) We would likely put out Windows, Linux and Mac versions of the software as well as a web interface.

The links you gave are similar, but note two things.
1) The price at the top of each page is without a PC interface.
2) As far as I can decipher, while the more expensive models say they have two outputs, they seem to be controlled by the same signal (they just provide higher wattage), so it looks like $235 per each independently controlled device. With any luck, that's several times the price we would be shooting for (by having fairly large numbers of inputs and outputs on the same controller).

>>1) Maybe I should have mentioned that the controllers would be mostly autonomous (web enabled, embedded controllers). I just didin't want to bore everyone with too much detail.
>>2) We would likely put out Windows, Linux and Mac versions of the software as well as a web interface.
>>

Well then, that changes my stance on the subject. I think the herp industry needs controllers such as what you have described. Props to you!

(You're not alone lol)

>>PS - are you saying my detailed post was boring?

No, I wanted all the detail any else had to offer...