Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi
I have 4 Firebelly toads that have been doing great. I noticed all of them have a coffee brown coating over there eyes the last few days. They live in a tank with a firebelly newt.I also had a newt from found in Mount Poconos Pa. The Poconos newt died after a few months but everything was ok till Tuesday?
Thanks
frank
born2haunt.com

why the heck did you put them in with a newt? the newt probally died of the toxins the fire belly toads produced, if you had done any research you would have known they are TOXIC, which means, yeah, they will hurt other things if kept in the same tank. ever think of that? just cause they both have the word fire belly in their name doesn't mean you can put them together, kinda common sence don't you think?

The Pet store were I got the frogs & newts were in the same tank. I've seen them in the same tank in more then one store. Also the fire belly newts & frogs don't seem to have a problem. They been together for months with no problem. I think the tank may just be a little too cool so I'm working on that right now.I'll post if it works.
You may want to cut back on your coffee in take a little
frank

and just cause a few places put them together you will? what about all the places that don't? and what about all the information on them, in books, magizines, online, in every single one it says they are TOXIC. that means don't put them with anything. plus their care is completely differnet, newts water should be about 63 and the toads water should be about 78. yeah, big difference.

otis, you need to calm down a take a deep breath. one, the fbn is still alive and currently living with the toads in the tank and the wild cuaght newt from PA is the one that died, if i read correctly. two, i have had 5 korean fbt's, yellow-bellied toad, 2 japanese fbn and 1 chinese fbn together for mare than 15 years without a problem. the toads have excreated their toxin in response to a small bullfrog that jumped into there tank while i was cleaning them, the bullfrog died quickly, but the newts, both species are fina and still alive today. the toads need a reason to excrete their toxin, such as extreme stress or fear of being eaten, and since the newts have no chance of eating the toads, they pose no risk. during feedings i frequently have a newt bite a toads foot or vice versa, and there have been no ill effects.

yeah, please don't tell me to calm down. ask anybody else on this forum that knows about toads and newts and they will tell you not to put them together. i have fire belly toads and know that they need a reason to secrete toxins, but what if your frog all of a sudden starts getting stressed out, not because of a fear it's going to get eaten, but because of something else? why risk it, its not fair to the newt because you're the one messin up.

the calm down was because i assumed you jumped to conclusions to quickly since your post didn't match the original and based on your typing, you would have been yelling at this person if you two had met in person and there is no reason for it. as i said in my previous post, i had newts and toads together when a bullfrog escaped from me a got into their tank. this possessed the toads, or at least two of them to excrete their toxins into the water portion of the tank where they, the three newts, and the bullfrog where. within 20 minutes of being exposed, the bullfrog, who was nearly 6 times the size of the largest toad and much larger then the smallest newt, was dead in my hands, and all of the toads and newts where perfectly fine. this happened to me 12 years ago and all of the toads and two newts that i had then are still alive and well. the other newt, who i believe was about 14 years old, died last year. my current tank has one european fbt, 3 oriential fbt, 2 korean fbt, 1 japanese fbn, and 1 chinese fbn. all of these amphibs have been together for more than 8 years and i have never had a problem b/t them. sometimes a toad grabs a newt if food gets close and sometimes a newt bites a toad, but they all have all their fingers, toes, tails, and limbs and seem quite happy. if you are going to mix species, you must be able to provide a habitat that is suitiable for all the species and plenty of food for each. i hand feed my all my amphibs and the firebellys are fed every two days. if you have experience and do things right, then most combinations of mixed species, provided habitats, food, and temps are similar, can be done successfully. i currently have 5 mixed species tanks, some with only to different species and one with six different species. i even have a mix with two whites treefrogs and two crested geckos and have never, not once had a problem with any amphibs not getting along with each other. now maybe i'm just lucky, but i seem to be doing something right.

again, don't tell me to calm down. seriously, ask anybody else if you should keep them together. heres a link, you should read it. you ignored the part where i said their habitat is very different, do you not get that? just cause your stuff is still living, doesn't mean it's healthy, or happy. you're getting lucky, because what you're doing is incredably stupid. i'm not saying ur stupid by any means, just what you are doing.
sure, theres people who can get away with mixing stuff that they shouldn't be, but one day something will go wrong, esp. if u have so many mixed species tanks.
mixing species article

is was not telling you to calm down in my last post, i was explaining why i had said to in my original post. if you would read more carefully and comprehend what i and others wrote then you would not be so confused an defensive. i have read that article and many many others on mixed species and have talked to many "experts" in the field of herpoculture many many times about mixed species tanks and what is and is not safe. one thing you need to realize is that the temps that are generally stated in most books and caresheets usually come from no more than five sources, meaning that most people who wrote the book or care sheet or what not have never actually been to the native habitats of the animals that they may be writing about and only know the figure other have posted in the past. i know for a fact that Bombina orientalis is generally said to enjoy water temps in the high 70's, and while that is average for wild specimens habitats, they have also been found thriving in areas where water temps rarely reachthe mid 60's. the different species of fbn generally like water temps in mid to low 60's, but have been found in water temps ranging from 52-73 degrees in the wild. i have my water temps at 67-70 degrees and the ambient air temp at 74 degrees. all of the species of fbn and fbt are mainly semi-aquatic and spend most of the time in shallow water, which my habitat simulates perfectly. i have seen first hand the habitat in which Bombina orientalis is found in the wild in south korea (i was there 4 years ago and collected some research data of my own, as stated above) you may also be interested to know that fbt and fbn are not the only animals inhabitating the waters of europe and eastern asia. there are other species of amohibians that inhabit the same waters and habitats of the "highly" toxic frogs, and there not all floating belly up. while most people may not be qualified to successfully create mixed species tanks, some are. call it dumb luck, blind stupidity, or skill, but again, as stated for the hunderdth time, i have NEVER, NEVER, NEVER had a problem with the four species together. not saying other have not, it is well documented that people have very bad luck mixing the species, but that is almost always the fault of the person doing the mixing and not the ones being mixed. if you pay close attention to the behavior of your herps and ensure that they are properly cared for and kept, then you should have no problem mixing certain species. i am not saying that it is for everyone, but i'm not saying that it is impossible either, just giving you my opinion and experience, just as you are. i did not mean to offend you otis, and i apologize if i did, but you seemed to be a bit to agressive with your answer and not giving any info on the subject, only attitude. and you may be right, he may have a problem in the future as may i, but he has not had a problem yet, nor have i. and here is a little seceret for you, science doesn't get anywhere by being causious, if you want to make an impact and either prove or disprove a theory, then you must act. and sometimes, actions have unfortunate consequences and outcomes.
whether anyone decides to mix species or not is their decision, and i try not to show favor either way and let the facts determine how you should decide. i'm just supplying the facts that you have not, otis.
i'm sure i forgot something and if i did i will post later. and more questions or comments are welcome.