Reptile & Amphibian Forums

So I am trying to "Powerfeed" my snake . . i want her to get big and i hear that the first two years are the most important. So i am trying to keep her VERY well fed for those first two years so that she may take advantage of the potential growth.

Now here is what i am doing. I have her on a regiment of one Hopper mouce every 4 days. She is about 21" atm. She has no problem feeding and allways eats the mouce within 5-10 minutes of me putting it in the tank with her. I was speaking with the snake guy at my local pet store and he also told me that if i increase the temps to just under the limit of the snake (so if you dont want to keep a BRB over 85* keep the temps in the lower 80's 80*-83*) he said that this will increase the metabolism and make the snake grow faster.

Does this seem right? and are there any ill effects to be had from doing this? I just want to make sure im not harming my snake by "power feeding" it. If powerfeeding is o.k. How am i doing with it? can i feed it more?

Thanks,
Russ
-----
Russ
1 Brazillian Rainbow Boa (< 1 year old)
1 Rosy Boa (G/F's Snake)

Somehow i have to feed both?!
Melbourne, Fl

Sorry, don't mean to be offensive but I believe you will NOT get ANY replies saying this is a good thing. SLOW DOWN grasshopper!!! Power feeding leads to obese, short lived snakes. Some have even found they don't breed well.

Once a week for a neonate is fine, I have raised many with that regimen and all are nice and healthy.

>>So I am trying to "Powerfeed" my snake . . i want her to get big and i hear that the first two years are the most important. So i am trying to keep her VERY well fed for those first two years so that she may take advantage of the potential growth.
>>
>>Now here is what i am doing. I have her on a regiment of one Hopper mouce every 4 days. She is about 21" atm. She has no problem feeding and allways eats the mouce within 5-10 minutes of me putting it in the tank with her. I was speaking with the snake guy at my local pet store and he also told me that if i increase the temps to just under the limit of the snake (so if you dont want to keep a BRB over 85* keep the temps in the lower 80's 80*-83*) he said that this will increase the metabolism and make the snake grow faster.
>>
>>Does this seem right? and are there any ill effects to be had from doing this? I just want to make sure im not harming my snake by "power feeding" it. If powerfeeding is o.k. How am i doing with it? can i feed it more?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Russ
>>-----
>>Russ
>>1 Brazillian Rainbow Boa (< 1 year old)
>>1 Rosy Boa (G/F's Snake)
>>
>>Somehow i have to feed both?!
>>Melbourne, Fl
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB, selectively bred from good stock)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
13.26 BRB
11.16 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Simmer down amigo, Thanks for the responce. This is why i posted.

This was my thought when the guy that worked at the pet store told me about this. I said "well wouldnt feeding it this much stress it out and make it obese?" But he said that young snakes can be fed a lot without an issue because they need the nutrients to grow, and when they are young like this they use most of the food twards growing, not becoming obese. This made sence to me seeing as a young person eats a lot, has a fast metabolism because they are growing (using more nutrients for growth rather then just substaining life)

I assumed this was just giving it the best chance to get as large as it could. Then as it gets older i would slowly feed it less and less (because it needs food more to substaine then to grow)

I guess i am horribly mistaken?

thanks
-----
Russ
1 Brazillian Rainbow Boa (< 1 year old)
1 Rosy Boa (G/F's Snake)

Somehow i have to feed both?!
Melbourne, Fl

Actually, you and the petstore are basically correct. Baby snakes need a relatively larger food intake for growth. The problem comes in deciding how much is enough vs how much is too much (or not enough).

Basic feeding rule of thumb is:

one appropriate sized prey item per feeding (can be multiple of appropriate size not available). Appropriate size is same diameter as largest diameter of freshly voided snake. AKA, just pooped.

hatchling to yearling once per week
yearling to adult once every two weeks
adult female (non breeding) once every three to four weeks
adult female (breeding) once every two weeks betwen dropping litter and going off feed for next breeding cycle.
adult Male, once every three to four weeks.

The different schedules for adult famales are to compensate for periods of time when gravid females may not eat anything at all and if they do eat, only infrequent small meals.

-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB, selectively bred from good stock)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
12.24 BRB
11.13 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

I assume there is a threshhold for the point at which more food wont corrilate to more growth.

Obviously there is a scale if you give snake X ammount of food it will increase growth rate by Y% up to N (in which N is the threashhold aka point at which more food does not mean more growth) and in this case anything more then N or the threashold, will overflow and will no longer be used from growth OR substaining, it will go into storage (aka FAT!)

The only thing to argue is what is the threashhold. At this point i will just take your word for it and only feed once per week.

However there was one point that was not adressed from my origional post. I was told that a higher temperature may lead to increased metabolism and thus faster growth, or more growth potential. IF this is true this might increase the value of N right? So with a increased threashold one could potentially feed more to the snake with less ill effects.

For instance, things like exorsize affect this with humans, a 14 year old olympic swimmer might need more intake then a 14 year old video game player. In the snakes case the heat is used isntead of exersise.

That might have been a bit of a mouthfull but i hope i made sence.

Does this seem viable to you? Do you know of anyone that does this?

thanks
Russ
-----
Russ
1 Brazillian Rainbow Boa (< 1 year old)
1 Rosy Boa (G/F's Snake)

Somehow i have to feed both?!
Melbourne, Fl

Temperature must play a huge role in reptile metabolism. I believe that there is a temperature that maximizes enzyme activity (I think it's 84 - 88° F) At low temperatures, digestive enzymes work slower than the natural bacteria living in the gut and food rots before it's digested. At temperatures above 88, natural bacteria flourish and again, rot exceeds digestion. Both of these cases lead to regurgitation. I've never read any literature on this and it's only my inference (but it sounds good doesn't it?).

I'm sure that all of this could be quantified by measuring the rate of respiration at different temperatures. I'll leave this to all of the grad students who participate in the forum.

For now, I prefer not to overfeed my animals. I always like to keep them just a little bit hungry. Giving them a rest between meals gives more opportunity for handling and I think it serves to keep their systems clear (although none of my animals defecate after every meal).
-----
Mike Lockwood
www.tooscaley.com

Me being the Engineer student that i am . . LOVE this stuff!

Obviously keeping a BRB at 88* isnt a good thing for the snake, no matter how good it is for the enzymes . . However, 83-84 might be ok, right? I wonder what effect size potential vs. tempurature Food is, I would love to find some definate corilation.
-----
Russ
1 Brazillian Rainbow Boa (< 1 year old)
1 Rosy Boa (G/F's Snake)

Somehow i have to feed both?!
Melbourne, Fl

Not that I am an expert on Brazilian rainbows, but I have always fed snakes under a year old one appropriate sized rodent (equal to to up to 1.5 times the girth of the widest part of the snake when 'voided' of any waste material or previous meals) or two smaller sized rodents (girth size less than girth size of snake) every 5-7 days. After they are a year old, I decrease frequency to once every 7-10 days. After mature (2-3 years of age, depending on the species) I feed once every other week, unless I want to get them up a bit in weight for breeding, in which case I would feed once a week or once every 10 days. (haven't bred any of my snakes yet but am planning to do some in this and next season if all goes well).

My female rainbow which I bought about two and half years ago (picked up in February '05. I believe she was hatched summer of '04 giving her size at purchase). Two months ago, she was 1500g and 5'8". Now I am not sure her size. She is quite thick, but no signs of being overweight that I can tell, though I wonder at times. She is a ferocious eater, always willing to eat probably more often than I feed her, but I do feed good sized rodents to her. I don't think I ever used mice with her, starting with either rat pinks or fuzzies, I can't remember now. Now she takes medium rats. I am sure she would breed well this season but not sure I will do it this season. The male i bought has yet to eat for me, and it has been a month now. Idiot that I am I forgot to ask what he was feeding on, maybe he likes live rats instead of the frozen thawed I have been offering so far.

Baby BRB's seem to do better a bit cooler than the adults, so I don't think more heat would help in growth. I don't believe it to be a digestion issue, the warmer temps tend to dry out the cage more and baby BRB's thrive on high humidity. For that reason I never made holes in my hatchling rack drawers. My babies do very well in the high humidity caused by limiting the ventilation. I do however pull out every drawer every day to check and clean if necessary so they do get a good air exchange once/day.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC)
0.2 kids (CBB, selectively bred from good stock)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
12.24 BRB
11.13 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Yea,I've never heard anything but high humidity with the youngn's I have my fancy little auto-humidifier in the cage and if i dont touch anything (no misting) It wont ever go below 85% Humidity. You can certainly keep a hot and humid enviroement (I should know, im from the florida keys 90*F 99% humidity anyone? lol)
-----
Russ
1 Brazillian Rainbow Boa (< 1 year old)
1 Rosy Boa (G/F's Snake)

Somehow i have to feed both?!
Melbourne, Fl