Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Throughout the past several years I have bought several variable kingsnakes. They have become my favorites out of all the snakes I have. As I have learned more about mexicana kingsnakes I am not so sure that a couple of them are really Thayeri as they have a resemblance to either mex-mex or durango. Can any of you tell me how I can tell and if they think these are really Thayeri?

im no pro, but i would guess that the top pic is a hybrid, between a thayeri and possibly an alterna or a mountain king of some kind. I woul dalso say that the bottom pic is a mex mex king.
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South Texas Herps

with Mike. Here's a pic of an alterna x thayeri. Very similar to the snake in your first pic. I also agree that the second pic looks like a mex-mex.

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Vichris

Vichris Variables

Thanks for your thoughts on them. I am kind of dissapointed as I was told they were all Thayeri when I bought them. But I still find them great little snakes. For future reference, is appearance a givaway or are there other ways to tell?

I am rather intrigued by your thinking that the the one looks like an alterna hybrid. I bought her from someone I thought was a reputable dealer who told me that the parents were thayeri and looked nothing like her. She had white bands when she was smaller but they slowly turned gray

I would say your 1st pic could be thayeri.

I have a gray leonis from Dan www.serpentsonline.com that looks identical to that, just a little lighter gray.
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1 Eastern Blue Tongue Skink
2 Tarahumara Mountain Kingsnakes - Knoblochi
1 Thayer's Kingsnake - Thayeri
2 Golden Greek Tortoises
1 Pyxie Frog - 14 years old

While it is possible the first snake is pure thayeri, I think it's unlikely. Grey is not an uncommon background color for thayeri and red is not an uncommon color for bands/saddles. It is the pattern that is making me feel suspicious. That snake has bands like a milksnake phase, not saddles like a leonis. The proportion of red to grey makes it more of an intermediate phase than a milksnake phase. The head pattern looks like that of an alterna or greeri. No one can say for sure what it is, but my guess would be greeriXthayeri. It has that grey/green background that is common in greeri.

I concur with Greg's assessment of your snake—in my view it clearly has some greeri in it, but it most definitely is not pure greeri. Thayeri x greeri cross is as good a guess as any. Unfortunately, there are more hybrids out there than is often appreciated. A recent classified ad offered a snake that was a ruthveni x thayeri cross that had been backcrossed with pure thayeri for several generations; it looked like a very nice thayeri but instead was just a very pretty mutt. In this instance at least, the seller accurately represented the animal for sale, but that is not always the case. Best bet is to check out prospective sellers, do your homework, and you'll not be disappointed. Good luck!

Bob