Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Are black widows harmful to chams, i found one in my chams cage this morning.

Uhh, I consider black widows harmful to everything.
-----
CANADIAN SILKWORMS

yeah, venom is venom. Now whether it would bite it with no provocation is something else, however, if your cham shot it and ate (without getting bitten) I do not know if it would still cause gastronomic upset - or worse. I have a friend who does research in spiders and is currently working with black widows - he's got cages full, pretty cool to see all the s'lings!

Where do you live? If you are in an area where there are black widows (and I assume you are) you may want to take extra precautions such as making sure that there are no openings large enough in the cage, check any new plants, food and branches you introduce to the cage.
-----
Chameleon Help & Resource Info
1.0 Nosy Be Panther Chameleon - Cyrus
0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna. She's now hanging from her big jungle gym in the sky
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
1.1.1 Side-blotched lizards - Ana and Stan
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skippy
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh, Died 4/21/06
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha, donated to science 4/4/06
?.? Pinktoe Tarantula - no name yet

This is slightly off-topic, but I cam across this article a little while back and found it grimly amusing.
It's about a guy in Berlin who was killed by his pet black widow, then later consumed by his feeder insects. He also kept lizards...

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2004092008,00.html

>>This is slightly off-topic, but I cam across this article a little while back and found it grimly amusing.
>>It's about a guy in Berlin who was killed by his pet black widow, then later consumed by his feeder insects. He also kept lizards...
>>
>>http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2004092008,00.html

I highly doubt a black widow would have killed him. They make you very sick yes, but kill? no - not unless you are already immuno-compromised or a very young child or elderly person or someone who is highly allergic to invert venom (like bees, wasps, etc.) ..and if you were that allergic to such venoms you'd not be keeping venomous inverts to begin with. And I have to say, I think the entire story in that newspaper is either made up or way exaggerated beyond belief.. termites do not feed on flesh. they feed on wood. snakes would not be feasting on a dead human either.
-----
_____

PHWyvern

I was bit 7 times by a black widow just a few months ago and ended up at the hospital for it.... Anyone at the Sacramento, Anaheim, or Chicago shows a few months ago may have seen the carnage on the side of my neck. It was definately not pleasant, but not a threat to kill me (and that was the side of my neck). Not something I'd like to experience again for sure!
-----
Tyler Stewart
Las Vegas NV
www.BLUEBEASTREPTILE.com

>>I was bit 7 times by a black widow just a few months ago and ended up at the hospital for it.... Anyone at the Sacramento, Anaheim, or Chicago shows a few months ago may have seen the carnage on the side of my neck. It was definately not pleasant, but not a threat to kill me (and that was the side of my neck). Not something I'd like to experience again for sure!

are you sure it was a black widow? They don't leave marks like the recluses, hobos and sac spiders do. Most people bitten by a black widow never even knew they were bitten.
-----
_____

PHWyvern

That's what the doctor said. It happened while I was sleeping (likely was laying on it since there were multiple bites), and it didn't really hurt until that day (12 hours later). After about a week, it was pretty ugly, itched and hurt, but by then I was taking medications for it.
-----
Tyler Stewart
Las Vegas NV
www.BLUEBEASTREPTILE.com

[q]Most people bitten by a black widow never even knew they were bitten.[/q]

Wow, I never knew that! I was bitten years ago when I lived in Tucson. I stepped on it in an outdoor shed & immediately felt hot, burning pain in my foot. Because of my sensitivity to insect venom, I did put the dead spider in a jar and within hours was in the hospital. It was excrutiating...the muscle spasms and cramping all over my body, the nausea, severe headache, shortness of breath, the swelling & intense burning pain in my foot and ankle,uncontrolable body shakes. I never felt anything like that that affected my whole body. It took weeks to feel decent again.
If one little spider could do that to me, I would hate to think what one could do to a cham!

Not all spiders are created equal. The Black Widow spiders carry a neurotoxin which can cause complete paralysis. The paralysis can lead to respiratory failure and then in turn, ultimately to death. But the strength of the meurotoxin seems to vary from local to local, and the bite of a female spider is worse than a male. I've heard that warmer climates tend to have spiders with greater poison.

The Black Widow spiders that live on the island I live on are confirmed to be non-deadly to healthy adults. Unless the person bit was very weak to start with (a small sick child, sevefrely immuno-compromised adults), the risk of death is extremely remote. Whereas, it is quite possible for a single bite from Black Widow spiders from various other locals to kill a healthy person if left untreated (though it's still very rare).

Certainly the bite of any black widow spider causes severe pain that lasts for days.

I recommend trying to keep these spiders out of you home and the homes of your chameleons.
-----
SandraChameleon@gmail.com
BC Canada