Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi, I'm a newbie here. I kept a lot of reptiles when I was younger but haven't had any in several years. I have very little experience with tortoises however, and that is what I want to start with asIa get my feet wet in the reptile world again. I've searched and searched online looking at the different species that are available and I can't come up with a definite decision on which I should buy. I want something that it outgoing, and not TOO prone to sickness. Of course, I'd like a tortoise that is attractive ( I like the higher "domed" shapes, personally). It needs to be an indoor manageable size because it will have to spend winters indoors. And I'd really prefer something that doesn't hibernate naturally, although that seems to be difficult to find while still matching the other characteristics. Putting all this together, the best match I (the newbie) can find is the Hermann's (although I believe in the wild most of them do hibernate). Which variety of the hermann's do you guys prefer? Or is there another species that might be better or as good? I do like the stars, but they seem a little more frail, shy, difficult to find, and expensive. So what do you experts suggest? I want to make a good decision since he'll probably be with me until I die.

Thanks,
scott

Scott,
Star tortoises are not reccomended for the beginner since they have specific requirements and can become sick rather quickly. I suggest staying away from them until you are a bit more experienced.

Hermanns Tortoises are a great choice. They are beautiful animals, are very personable, are as hardy as they come and are readily available as captive bred hatchlings and juveniles.
In nature yes Hermanns tortoises DO hibernate but this is not something to worry about unless you plan on breeding the animal when it matures (and even so, many turtles/tortoises still breed without hibernation).
Hermanns tortoises make wonderful pets and live long lives. There are quite a few reputable breeders out there that can offer you stunning specimens at affordable prices.
Hermanns tortoises come in 2 recognized subspecies. The common Eastern Hermanns Tortoise (Testudo hermanni boettgeri) and the rare Western Hermanns Tortoise (Testudo hermanni hermanni).

Eastern hermanns are readily available on the internet and are easy to come by. Females may grow to 8" and in rare cases larger, while males typically only reach 6".

Western hermanns tortoises are close to never available. There are only a few select people in the country offering real Westerns for sale, others either sell Easterns as westerns by mistake (or to get more $$ for them) or they sell hybrids (a cross between the two subspecies). It's a very common mistake and a good rule of thumb to go by is this : If the tortoise is going for only $100 to $150 it is NOT a real Western.
Western females barely exceed 5.5" and males barely exceed 4". Keep in mind there are exceptions for every rule.

If you would like more detailed information on how to differentiate the 2 subspecies please visit my extensive online photo gallery full of great photos of my animals as well as thorough DIAGRAMS which aid in telling them apart.

http://community.webshots.com/user/loon1103

For more information on Hermanns tortoises or any other Mediterranean tortoise please visit this site:

www.shelledwarriors.co.uk
There is agreat forum section there that I am very active on as well as other knowledgable tortoise keepers/breeders.

-Hope this helps
-Chris

The photo below is of 2 young female Western Hermanns of mine, just to give you an idea of what they look like:

SORRY!

That last pic is of a young male Western hermanns, here is the pic of the 2 juvenile females:

Hi, thanks for the response. Your photos and info are very helpful. I'm not sure which of the two subspecies of hermann's I'll go with but the side by side comparisons are certainly a help. I do like the rounder shape of the western but I don't know if there's really enough of a difference to matter. I will probably just go with the best tortoise that I can find when the buying time comes (my b'day is dec 5 so not too long now). Thanks again and I'll definitely visit the forum you suggested.

Oh, and you have a great-looking bunch of torts.

--scott

Thanks for the kind words, and happy early birthday.

There is actually quite a BIG difference in the two subspecies but you have to know Hermann's tortoises very well to know what I mean. Chnaces are you will not find any true westerns so your best bet would be to find a repuatble breeder and go with an eastern.

I can point you in the direction of some good breeders if you like.

Yes, please do. I'd like to buy from someone who isn't just out to make a buck. I'm trying to talk the wifey into letting me get it early. I'm gonna go ahead and start making a home for him and buying the necessary lights, etc. Then I'm gonna start begging. Thanks again!

I originally considered Russians and Hermanns based on people's advice in this forum for a new tortoise owner. The deciding factor in my choice was the carapace design of a Hermanns vs a Russian. This is a picture of my 15 month old Eastern Hermanns I got from LLLReptile in California - had it over-nighted to Florida. The second pic is one when she was younger showing off her computer skills. I didn't have too much preference for an Eastern vs. Western and honestly the owners at the store couldn't say for sure which ones they had, I later verified it was an Eastern.

With only my limited knowledge of this species, I consider a Hermanns a great choice. Just feed it properly, keep it nice and warm during the day, get as much real sun as possible, add some calcium, and enjoy the little critter. As a captive bred, mine is very friendly and personable. The little dude gets to roam around each day and it gets a lot of hands-on attention, petting her head, crawling on me, etc...

Good luck with whatever you choose.

Fred