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The problem with herp books. (turtles)

sheshanaga Nov 26, 2006 12:24 PM

Hello all,

Im response to a posting a few lines down, I too am new to herping and have run into the same frustration in searching for literature.

Earlier this year I got into corn snakes, and bought every book that was available and some that weren't (via ebay). My conclusion then was that, judging by these books, there is little or no conclusive, proven data on these herps.

In my opinion all the corn snakes books are useless pablum, designed to sell quickly in a pet shop along with the impulse buy of the exotic pet itself. Is it no wonder that so many newbies quickly become disinterested in the hobby when all they get is this "keep your pet happy" crap?

With the exception of Kathy Love's new edition and the newly released "Corn Snakes In Captivity" by Soderberg I have yet to find a definitive text on corn snakes. Even so, neither of these books are complete, and in my opinion they only serve to compliment each other, but are by no means "stand alone" authorities on the subject. For example, neither book diagrams the anatomy of a snake, and neither talk in depth about animal classification. This is the meat and bones of the hobby, after you learn how to "keep your pet happy".

Here comes the obligatory turtle content:

I recently built my first outdoor turtle enclosure (a genuine Spucklerboxx). I anticipate adopting a small bale of box turtles this spring, after they begin comeing out of hibernation (and after I get a chance to study up on how to "keep my pets happy".

That being the case, I bagan the process all over again. I bought up every turtle book available, only to find the same situation: conflicting opinion, no anatomy, and no classification specifics. (note: these are only a FEW of the problems encountered with the available books. I mention this to sidetrack any predicted flame emails saying "who cares?" or "page 18 of the "Idiots Guide", etc...suffice to say, the available popular books are hogcrap)

My question is this: Why are there no GOOD books in the hobby? Why is everything so incomplete? I don't buy the excuse of "we're not all that popular". If you want an example of unpopular, lets take a look at another of my hobbies: trumpet playing. I literally have a 3'-6" stack of books and manuals dedicated solely to the techniques of trumpet playing. These are not music books, mind you, but simply texbooks written on how to manipulate and developement muscles in your lips and face no bigger than your fingertip! I bring this up only as a comparison of popular hobbies. How many trumpet players do you know? None? Well then, why are there SO MANY books on the subject? Now, how many herpers do you know? Well then, why are there so many crappy books on the market?

My point is this (I realize that I went the long way around the barn to get to this but here it is) Someone needs to write the definitive, A-Z book for individual herps. Enough with this happy horseshiat that you get a Petco (all 32 pages of it) and lets see some real texts. I know many of you are probably up to your third eye in other projects, but maybe someone out there is up to the task?

Replies (27)

kensopher Nov 26, 2006 06:49 PM

Market forces...the publishing companies don't see the need for voluminous herp reading materials. It's a shame, but true. They only publish the books that are easy to read, pretty, and will sell. Who is going to spend $50 to $200 on a book about one individual herp? You, me, maybe a few others. However, the publishing companies don't see the marketability. Good books are very expensive, and people don't really buy expensive books often anymore. Go to the Daytona show...there are some wonderful books there. Talk to the book vendors about what they're selling and how many. People want to buy the skinny, cheap books. There are some excellent German texts that have been translated, but at $100 we don't buy them.

I feel your frustration. Keep looking, there are some excellent books out there. They're just expensive.

EMWhite Nov 26, 2006 09:10 PM

I'm no expert on boxies, but I've found the internet, and conversations with more experienced keepers to be far more enlightening than most books,. I have also yet find a book worth buying at any chain store, let alone Petco which is, in my opinion not the greatest of the worst. If you want accurate, difinitive info, forums are the way to go. (Along with good old conversations with other keepers.) Hopefully these tips with be able to satisfy your needs a little more than books. (Believe me, I've been where you are now.) Good luck.

Evan

sheshanaga Nov 26, 2006 10:37 PM

Thats exactly my point! Even with cornsnakes, most of the real info comes from the forums. (Unfortunately, you can't take a forum with you to the bathroom, if you know what I mean. That's where I get most of my reading done!)

It just sems to me that there would be a more organized, better thought out set of books than what I've been able to find commercially. (And I've tried)

tspuckler Nov 27, 2006 08:49 AM

I mentioned two books worth reading in my post below.

Here's some food for thought:

Are there more people who've played trumpet than have kept box turtles?

Do you need training to play trumpet?

Do you need training to successfully keep a box turtle?

Do books on dogs, cats and aquarium fish cover anatomy and classification?

Are publishers in the business of making money (therefore churning out many "incomplete" books, rather than one "master" volume)?

Would a person spending $50 for a turtle also be willing to spend $50 on a book for it?

If so, would they be willing to read a big book?

I ain't saying that there shouldn't be a "Big Book 'O Box Turtles" (or corn snakes). It would be nice, but it's unlikely to happen.

I've been to about a trillion (slight exaggeration) reptile shows and the sad truth is today's "new hobbyists" do not want to be troubled by reading big books. They seem to want as little information as possible. Most don't know or care that bearded
dragons come from Australia. Very few have plans in mind as to what they're going to do to accommodate the hatchling semi-aquatic turtle they just bought, once it reaches adulthood. The fact is that most new keepers are getting reptiles as a novelty item.

Novelties have a way of passing, and thus the loss of interest has little to do with the incompleteness of reading material.

Like every other business, books are all about supply and demand. In America there is a very short supply of serious-minded herp keepers. What percentage of reptile and amphibian keepers do you think have books on the animals they own?

I agree with the other posts in response to yours. I'd also like to say that much of my knowledge has come from talking with "herp people" - whether it be at shows, in the field, in herp societies or on the internet(s).

I attended a Northern Ohio Association of Herpetologists meeting some time ago. The speaker's topic was on breeding boas and pythons. After outlining his methods, he said "This is how I do it, but it may not be the best method." I, like the rest of the crowd, was somewhat shocked. The man was a world famous breeder. He went on to say "The best method is the one that works for you."

Although there are many people who'd like a "cook book" on keeping reptiles, with step-by-step guidelines, it's not necessarily realistic. There are individuals who have kept their animals in identical conditions - some had success, some didn't. There are folks who can't keep animals alive who use the same methods as the most successful breeders.

The fact is that there's a lot that we don't know about reptiles in the wild as well as in captivity. This is further complicated by "truths" established by one group or individuals doing a study whose conclusions conflict with others who have the same qualifications.

Ever hear of chronosynclastic infundibulum? Hint: Think Kurt Vonnegut.

Tim

Third Eye
Third Eye

kensopher Nov 27, 2006 09:29 AM

"I attended a Northern Ohio Association of Herpetologists meeting some time ago. The speaker's topic was on breeding boas and pythons. After outlining his methods, he said "This is how I do it, but it may not be the best method." I, like the rest of the crowd, was somewhat shocked. The man was a world famous breeder. He went on to say "The best method is the one that works for you." "

Here, here! All of the REALLY experienced keepers, researchers, Veterinarians, etc. will admit that they don't know it all. They are constantly confronted by the fluidity with which you have to deal with herps. Obviously, there are some hard facts to deal with. There are some basics that people need to know, but beyond that it's not always black and white.

This advice was given to me by a very experienced Bog turtle researcher. He knows Bog turtles better than Bog turtles know Bog turtles. This guy can find Bog turtles in his sleep. He can walk up to a site and know precisely where the turtles will be located based on temperature, season, price of tea in China, whatever! I'm paraphrasing..."The only thing you need to know about Bog turtles is that we know very little about them. They can turn up anywhere, at anytime, and we're constantly suprised by them." His team started finding Bog turtles in clear mountain streams simply due to one fact...they just started looking where nobody else had. The "experts" at the Bog turtle symposium were shocked.

PHRatz Nov 27, 2006 11:25 AM

Oh my gosh I sat here & composed a huge response to this topic but it came off so angry that I deleted it.

I for years have thrown fits over the misinformation that I've found in pet store books, I get so frustrated over this...
I do have a few books that are really good & full of valuable info but the problem is if you are new to keeping (whatever species) and you have not taken some sort of animal science classes in college, and you aren't or don't personally know professionals in some sort of animal field, and you don't have 10,20,30,40 or more years of experience, then how are you going to know which book is accurate is which is not?

Thank God for Internet forums and accurate often updated websites.. before the Internet existed maaan it was bad out here!

Ok I'm saving my major rant for myself.. you guys don't want to be exposed to this kind of language anyway.
LOL
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PHRatz

sheshanaga Nov 27, 2006 12:47 PM

I hears what you're saying, especially when it comes to the financial end of the publishing. However, you mentioned seeing a talk by a famous herper who said, "this is how I do it, but there may be better ways" This is EXACTLY what I'm talking about!

To further the analogy of the situation in the trumpet world, in music, there are 50 different ways to play an instrument "the correct way" and there are warring camps that defend each position. The difference is that each has published (more likely self-published) manuals on what it is that they do and leave it up to the player to decide what is right and what is wrong. They then pimp their new book on a homemade website and word gets out. I have not found this to be the case in herping.

As an uninformed newbie, all I am led to believe is what I can find in these little how-to books or care sheets. Also, we are not all members of the “Church of God the Utterly Indifferent” Some of us are looking for answers. Fortunately, I have a friend who is a real expert and answers about 100 different questions for me every week. If it wasn't for him, my corn snake would be already dead, despite my best intentions. How many newbies are that lucky?

My point is that maybe some of these grizzled old veterans should help to better the hobby by writing down what it is that they have learned, (fact, opinion or otherwise) so that the next generation (however small) will be able to mine their hard work and experience and take things to the next level.

A lot of people don’t have frequent access to the internets. (especially retirees looking to get into a new hobby in their spare time) Also, many people live in areas where herp groups are few and far between. Even if there are local groups, the meetings may be difficult to attend due to work schedules, family commitments, etc. It is because of this that a manual of any type can become invaluable.

Another perk for "vanity press" releases is that they are free from any corporate influence. If a herper wrote their own book, they would be under zero pressure from the big manufacturers to pimp their products. THIS is when you have true freedom and real, quality information. (and lets not forget the bathroom factor: that’s where I get most of my reading done!)

tspuckler Nov 27, 2006 02:08 PM

Historically, herpers don't share information. There is a long history of this. If you were in the hobby 20 years ago, you'd be well aware that it was nearly impossible to get a snake breeder on the phone. There are a number of reasons for this. "Back in the day" business was good. There was no need to advertise or give away "secrets" to keeping and breeding.

There has also been an ongoing "war" between zoological institutions and hobbyists (zoos not wanting the private sector to keep herps). Nowadays you have a "war" with animal control groups (the Humane Socity of the United States wants to ban the keeping of ALL herps) as well as increasing state and local legislation, which keep upping the restrictions on keeping herps. If you write a book on the "controversial" topic of keeping reptiles, you could become a target and have people coming and looking for you.

As far as turtles, some of the biggest breeders have had their facilities raided and animals stolen because they work with valuable reptiles. This has happened with snake breeders as well. Sometimes it's best to keep your successes quiet.

Because of these things, you can't really compare keeping reptiles to music.

There is also very little money (although a lot of time) involved in publishing a book. I think most keepers would rather just spend that time with their animals. Most people are unwilling to go learn the "ins and outs" of self-publishing, come up with financing and arrange the distribution of their book.

As I mentioned, there are some good books out there. One positive aspect of this forum is that someone can ask "Know any good books on ...?" and get decent advice, rather than believe anything they read.

I don't think you can really compare keeping corn snakes to box turtles. Corn snakes are one of the easiest reptiles to care for - box turtles can be on the opposite end of the spectrum for a variety of reasons (e.g. they come from different habitats, they eat a variety of different foods, many are wild caught and are stressed/harboring parasites, they need much larger caging, we don't fully understand their nutritional requirements, etc.). Because of the complexity of factors involved in keeping box turtles, you're unlikely to get the "Ultimate Book" on them.

Tim

sheshanaga Nov 27, 2006 03:01 PM

"Corn snakes are one of the easiest reptiles to care for - box turtles can be on the opposite end of the spectrum for a variety of reasons"...but...the book that I got at Petsmart said that box turtles are great pets??? (kidding)

Ah well, your last argument explains a lot. Got bless the Feds and their never-ending battle to protect us from ourselves. Heaven-forbid any new information be brought to light by some semi-pro breeding herps in his basement.

Are the restrictions so tight in other parts of the world?

phwyvern Nov 27, 2006 03:16 PM

>>
>>Are the restrictions so tight in other parts of the world?

You could live in Australia where getting caught with keeping something as harmless as a corn snake will get you $5,000-10,000 in fines and possible jail time.
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PHWyvern

steffke Nov 27, 2006 03:58 PM

Home of the Free, the Brave, the Rebellious. Your local DNR or Department of Fish and Game/Wildlife should have the information.

tspuckler Nov 27, 2006 04:39 PM

I'm pretty sure the Australian "no animals allowed out and no animals allowed in" the country stemmed from the introduction of the Cane Toad, which is native to South America. The toad was supposed to eradicate (sugar) cane beetles, but ended up eating just about everything else. It also is poisonous, so most animals won't mess with it. Fish that eat cane toad tadpoles will die.

The cane toads (introduced in 1935) have proven one of Australia's worst ecological disasters. Seventy years later the govenment is STILL trying to get rid of these amphibians. There have been specials on National Geographic and there's plenty of information on the internet on this topic as well as a film "Cane Toads: An Unnatural History."

In the meantime, some types of "hot" Australian herps (blackhead pythons, bearded dragons, blue-tongue skinks) have made it out (illegally) of that country and are now commonly captive-bred for the U.S. pet trade.

Keeping and breeding reptiles has a long, rich history of being a renegade enterprise that you're not likely to read about in any books.

Tim

sheshanaga Nov 27, 2006 05:25 PM

Yes, yes, to be sure I understand the importance of this sort or regulation, and mayhap I was too glib and/or unclear about what I was referring to as sillyness.

I guess my point was really: where can I find out about what I can keep locally? I understand that you old timers have a battle on your (our) hands with PETA and other such groups who are demanding idiotic regulations and rules. For instance, I believe that you cannot keep cornsnakes in Georgia? Also, isn't there a law in some parts of the country about keeping herps that are obviously not WC? I'm not sure aboot the details on any of this, hence my original question: where are the rules written down?

golfdiva Nov 27, 2006 05:51 PM

Go you your state's department of natural resources. I emailed them and they were very quick to answer. That's where I got my info on how to apply for a permit to keep my EBT and found out if I could import an EBT from another state (I can!)
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0.1.0 ornate box turtle
1.0.0 eastern box turtle
1.0.0 Yellow belly slider
0.1.0 Red belly cooter
0.1.0 Australian shepard
1.12.0 chickens
3.2.0 children (do I still count the married ones?)
1.0.0 husband

biowarble Nov 28, 2006 09:41 AM

"Go you your state's department of natural resources. I emailed them and they were very quick to answer. That's where I got my info on how to apply for a permit to keep my EBT and found out if I could import an EBT from another state (I can!)"

And you live in the same state I do. I never checked; three-toed boxes aren't native. But I don't have any plans to keep him/her out of doors. I live in a mobile home park, and have a very small yard - and I doubt they would allow the construction of a pen.

The one thing I know about Michigan regulations is that it is illegal to sell any turtles caught in Michigan.

People were talking in another thread about introduced species like some kind of toad in Australia... red-eared sliders are not native to Michigan, but on a DNR website I found they are in certain areas, including Muskegon, because of pet trade.

tspuckler Nov 28, 2006 10:19 AM

Each state DNR declares what is "native" in their respective state. Here in Ohio, Italian Wall Lizards are listed as "native" and are therefore regulated under ODNR restictions.

Red-ear sliders have established themselves worldwide (mostly due to abandoned pets) and can be found in many areas (and countries) where they do not originate from.

Tim

StephF Nov 27, 2006 06:30 PM

As Golfdiva said, you would really need to contact your state's DNR or other appropriate agency and find out from them.
State laws and regulations are constantly changing, so it would be difficult to maintain a single up-to-date source of information for every locality in the country.
There is also a forum here on KS for Herp Law: you may want to check out what they have to say.

steffke Nov 27, 2006 06:40 PM

Also check with your city or town. Your state may allow you to keep something, but your city may not. This seems to be more of a problem with large reptiles, but some cities include almost all reptiles.

phwyvern Nov 27, 2006 09:21 PM

a sampling of some news articles....

Illegal reptile finds concern WA Govt
Monday, November 6, 2006. 7:03pm (AEDT)

The Western Australian Government is warning people about keeping illegally imported animals after the discovery of two banned reptiles.

In the past two weeks, a red-eared slider turtle has been located in suburban Perth and a corn snake has been found in a vehicle crossing the border from South Australia.

Both animals are native to America.

Environment Minister Mark McGowan says both reptiles are invasive outside their natural habitats.

"They can take away natural habitat from native animals, they can kill native animals and they can cause devastation," he said.

"In Brisbane at the moment, immense amounts of money are being spent trying to eradicate the red-eared slider turtle and we don't want them to establish in any large numbers here in Western Australia."

People can be jailed for up to five years for illegally importing exotic animals.

Article link: http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200611/s1782420.htm

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Illegal trade takes reptiles a long way from home
By Angela O'Connor
August 26, 2005

NATIVE to the South of the US, red-eared slider turtles have been found in Melbourne — which would be just a curiosity but for the risk of them becoming established in our waterways.

Already established in Queensland, the slider turtles, which grow about 30 centimetres and have dangerous claws, prey on native species and can spread diseases.

The turtles were just one of many exotic creatures rounded up this week by the Department of Sustainability and Environment after a year-long investigation headed by Keith Larner.

The department found the creatures during searches of houses and shops in Melbourne and Gippsland.

There was a boa constrictor in a plastic rubbish bin, turtles in polystyrene boxes, a tangle of corn snakes in a pillowcase and some less friendly banded Californian kingsnakes.

One of the least loved creatures, the common snapping turtle, has been found for the first time in Australia, where it has no predators.

Also native to North America like the red-eared slider turtle, grizzly bears, coyotes and alligators keep it under control. The powerful creature with its sharp, horny beak can grow nearly 50 centimetres long and weigh up to 38 kilograms.
AdvertisementAdvertisement

"Establishment of the species here would be bad news for Australian wildlife," Mr Larner said. It eats plants, fish, frogs, insects, snakes, ducks and small mammals and has been known to attack people.

Reptiles are smuggled into Australia or posted in parcels. Many more are now detected because of tougher screening of mail since September 11.

An albino corn snake sells for $300-$400 to someone who wants something different. A boa constrictor will fetch $600-$700. The trade can be profitable but the illegal importers face fines up to $110,000 and five years' jail.

Article Link: http://www.theage.com.au/news/national/illegal-trade-takes-reptiles-a-long-way-from-home/2005/08/25/1124562981871.html

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Vic man convicted for keeping pythons

November 20, 2006 - 10:19PM
AdvertisementAdvertisement

A man has been convicted and fined $1,500 for illegally keeping two exotic pythons at a property at Colac, near Geelong.

The two Burmese pythons, each more than three metres long, were the largest snakes seized in Victoria in recent years, wildlife authorities said.

Department of Sustainability and Environment (DSE) wildlife officers seized the exotic reptiles from a property at Colac on June 9.

Adam Zachary Milne, 30, faced Geelong Magistrates Court and pleaded guilty to charges of illegally keeping a scheduled pest animal.

While the DSE issues wildlife licences in Victoria for the keeping of native snakes, exotic snakes are banned in Australia under state and federal laws.

Wildlife authorities said the larger snake weighed about 45 kilograms and was capable of swallowing an adult human, while the smaller one weighed 20 kilograms and could swallow a small child.

Prosecutor Geoff Morsby said Burmese pythons posed a serious disease risk to native python populations, who had no resistance to a fatal virus they commonly carried.

Milne had no prior convictions and the pythons were euthanased for public safety.

Article Link: http://www.smh.com.au/news/NATIONAL/Vic-man-convicted-for-keeping-pythons/2006/11/20/1163871340714.html

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PHWyvern

kensopher Nov 28, 2006 05:51 AM

I know that this is off of the main point of this post, but it's always so interesting to read articles like this...you can learn a lot. For instance, Red-Eared sliders have dangerous claws, Grizzly Bear eat Snapping turtles, and Snapping turtles ATTACK humans! Where do they get their info.??

StephF Nov 28, 2006 07:56 AM

Um, about snapping turtles...
Many years ago, my husband used to get up very early in the morning to go fly fishing on various farm ponds that dotted the area where we used to live.
He had had his eye on one particular pond for some time, and so early one Saturday rode over there, parked his car well off the road, and walked down to the waters edge. There he put on his chest-waders and proceeded to advance into the water: after casting unsuccessfully for a good while, he decided to move along the pond's edge in search of a better spot, when something clamped down on his foot very forcefully, and started to pull him into deeper water. It was a snapping turtle! He struggled for what probably seemed like an eternity, and was finally able to pull himself out of the water, turtle in tow, and free himself. He said it was an ENORMOUS turtle that was able to fit much of his foot into its mouth.
I thought he was exaggerating and embellishing until I saw the damage to the boot of his wading gear. Oh, and my husband is 6'4" and weighs about 200lbs. He doesn't go fishing in isolated places without first telling someone where he's going.

phwyvern Nov 28, 2006 08:48 AM

>> when something clamped down on his foot very forcefully, and started to pull him into deeper water. It was a snapping turtle! He struggled for what probably seemed like an eternity, and was finally able to pull himself out of the water, turtle in tow, and free himself. He said it was an ENORMOUS turtle that was able to fit much of his foot into its mouth.
>>I thought he was exaggerating and embellishing until I saw the damage to the boot of his wading gear. Oh, and my husband is 6'4" and weighs about 200lbs. He doesn't go fishing in isolated places without first telling someone where he's going.

Snapping turtles can do a lot of damage. That turtle must have been pretty hungry to think the boot was a fish or frog and bite down. The turtles tend to have a decent sense of smell to know what is or isn't food. Also, a snapper in the water is far less dangerous than one out of the water. They don't like being out of their element and when out of water get extremely defensive. I've accidently stepped on snappers buried in the mud before without a problem (thinking it was a rock) while playing in swamps and creeks.. turtle just gets up and moves off. We had an alligator snapping turtle at work in a very large indoor below ground pond. He was only a small one (22 inches shell / 35-40 lbs)... He was strong enough he could push 50-100 lb rocks around without trouble. I would be cleaning the pond and he seemed to enjoy deliberately getting under foot trying to trip me up or trying to cajole a good shell scrub with the brush. Filling the pond back up was fun too.. he'd walk in front of the faucet and angle his shell just right to cause the high water pressure to boucnce off his shell and angle up so that it sprayed half the room. While that turtle was in his 'territory' he was a docile thing. Take him OUT of that pond and he turned into a prehistoric dinosaur up on tip-toes stomping around snapping at anything that got close to him. When out of the water, kids would enjoy watching him snap really thick carrots into thirds (& while in the pond he could smash floating apples into pancakes). He wasn't really big enough to have developed the jaw strength to snap a wooden broom handle in half, but he was able to put a good size dent into the metal plate of a steel-toed construction boot... being able to do that meant he could easily take a few fingers off your hand if he wanted to.
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PHWyvern

StephF Nov 28, 2006 10:18 AM

Yeah, my husband took alot of ribbing from his friends about that 'killer turtle' adventure....he may have unintentionally nudged it in the face with his foot or something to cause it to react in that way: who knows.

PHRatz Nov 28, 2006 10:21 AM

>>Yeah, my husband took alot of ribbing from his friends about that 'killer turtle' adventure....he may have unintentionally nudged it in the face with his foot or something to cause it to react in that way: who knows.

Poor husband.
I can just imagine the remarks though.
LOL
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PHRatz

PHRatz Nov 28, 2006 10:24 AM

Speaking of news articles.. I've seen an awful lot of them that came out of Florida. They're having a major problem these days with dumped pets. Nile monitors, basilisk, iguanas, caimans, Burmese pythons etc. etc. all over the place.
I know a girl who moved there a few years back, she said they were very restrictive about what pets the family could bring in & what pets they couldn't.

I read on a sulcata group a year or so ago, someone had just gotten a hatchling with egg sac still in place because her husband had found it on a road in FL.
Lots of havoc from people dumping their pets...
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PHRatz

steffke Nov 29, 2006 03:09 PM

Here's another article:

AP: Feds Collect Giant Rats in Florida
Nov 29 2:51 PM US/Eastern
By MARGARET EBRAHIM

As the rising sun danced across Florida's coastal waters, government workers in shorts and T-shirts knelt in a grassy island field and plucked wriggling rats from traps laid the night before. These weren't just any rats. They were 3-pound, 35-inch-long African behemoths. They squirmed as the workers, wearing protective gloves, removed green radio collars that had been tracking the rodents' movements.
All 18 of the animals were carted away for research.

Darin Carroll kept a watchful eye on that dawn mission at Florida's Grassy Key Island. Carroll is no ordinary G-man. He's a disease hunter determined to stop the next outbreak.

Carroll works for the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, and for three years he has painstakingly tracked the journey of Gambian rats from their African homeland, through the exotic pet trade, and to U.S. homes.

His quest is to prove what many scientists suspect: that African rodents imported as pets caused a monkeypox outbreak in the Midwest in 2003 that sickened dozens of adults and children with a virus related to smallpox. Scientists suspect Gambian rats may play a role.

Similar outbreaks have occurred in Africa.

While no one died from the U.S. outbreak, it sent warning alarms about the potential dangers of importing exotic pets captured in the wild.

Florida and U.S. officials are trying to raise enough money to kill off the Gambian rats that have proliferated on Grassy Key Island, just a few miles from the coast of one of the country's most populous states. The rats were imported to the island a few years ago.

"We tested about 10 to 20 rats a year ago," Carroll explained. "They were never exposed to monkeypox, but we don't know about the others out there."

Carroll's effort underscores one of the realities of animal-borne diseases that jump to humans. Scientists know little about many of the threats, and getting answers usually takes years.

The first time Carroll, 34, came face-to-face with a live Gambian rat was in 2003 when the CDC dispatched him to suburban Chicago during the monkeypox outbreak.

He and a colleague, Mary Reynolds, a CDC epidemiologist, went to the home of an animal dealer who sold pet prairie dogs to some of the people who became ill.

Carroll had been in disease hot zones before. He had searched the dense jungle of eastern Gabon for the animal host of Ebola, a bleeding disease that kills half the people it infects. And he traveled to a rural village near the Ganges river in Bangladesh during an outbreak of Nipah virus to test bats hanging from fruit trees near where children fell ill and died.

Often, Carroll had worn a head-to-toe protective suit when he entered a hot zone. But the animal dealer's home, with its white picket fence and manicured lawn, was unlike any hot zone he had experienced. So he left his "spacesuit" in the car trunk.

He didn't expect to see rodents in the house, nor did he want to alarm the neighbors.

As Carroll walked to the front door, the CDC called: Preliminary lab tests indicated they were dealing with monkeypox.

Monkeypox was first described in 1958 in Denmark when several monkey imports developed lesions. The disease emerged in the Congo in 1970 with sporadic outbreaks over the years, primarily in Central and West Africa. Ten percent of those infected can die, and there is evidence of person-to-person transmission.

Carroll hung up the phone a bit surprised, and walked into the dealer's home.

Prairie dogs skittered in cages on the living room floor. And Gambian rats squatted in cages on the kitchen counter.

"I couldn't believe it," Carroll recalled. "Mary and I looked at the rats, then at each other. We thought we had found the problem. Of course we didn't realize at the time just how much bigger the problem was."

Carroll wondered if he should have worn the spacesuit, but remembered he recently had a shot for smallpox that probably would give some protection.

What Carroll and Reynolds saw was the making of a perfect viral storm: There were different animals under stress in close quarters, creating the opportunity for viruses to jump.

The animals were quarantined. Later, Carroll and another CDC colleague headed to Texas to check on a wholesale exotic pet importer who had brought in about 800 African rodents. Some carried monkeypox.

The importer, Jeffrey Doth, would barely speak at first.

Doth had been busted in 1995 for smuggling five green tree pythons into the country by wrapping them around his waist under a large T- shirt. He was convicted in 2001, ordered to pay a $5,000 fine and sentenced to house arrest for several months.

At the time Doth imported the African rodents, his dealer's license was revoked, Doth told The Associated Press recently in his first interview about the rodents.

Instead, he used the name of a customer's company, he said.

Eventually, Doth warmed to Carroll and let him look at his records.

Doth explained that on April 9, 2003, a large shipment of African rodents _ including Gambian rats, dormice and sun squirrels _ arrived in Dallas aboard a commercial flight from Ghana. He told Carroll he noticed an "unusually large number of sick and dead animals." Some of the larger animals had consumed the smaller ones.

Carroll said he was surprised to learn that no one ever checked the rodents for disease once they entered the country.

Fish and Wildlife Service inspectors did check the paperwork and look over the cargo. They are not required and not trained to check for disease.

During the monkeypox outbreak, the government banned African rodent imports. But rodents from other parts of the world are still allowed to enter _ without any disease screening.

In the end, there were dozens of reported cases of monkeypox infection during the U.S. outbreak. At its worst, the disease caused fever, difficulty breathing, painful lesions and, in some, encephalitis.

No one died, but a 10-year-old suffered more than 100 lesions and spent days in a hospital isolation ward. Another person lost part of an eye from a lesion.

Though the outbreak was over, Carroll and others traveled to Ghana a year later to visit the exporter.

They had a long list of wild animal suspects that might be carriers of monkeypox _ with Gambian rats near the top. But they needed proof.

Carroll trapped rodents in the same places where they had been captured and exported a year earlier, just before the outbreak.

He sent them back to his lab in Atlanta. A few tested positive for antibodies indicating that at some time in their lives they were exposed to monkeypox or its close relatives.

Before the CDC team left Ghana, the exporter told Carroll that Europe uses strict quarantines to catch diseased wildlife imports, making it expensive for both the exporter and importer.

"That's why he loved to send animals to the United States, because he said there are no rules," Carroll said.

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/11/29/D8LMU9R80.html

PHRatz Dec 01, 2006 11:43 AM

wow I need to print that one out & use it in class too.
I had no idea someone had set African rats loose. I've never had the desire to keep one because before the monkey pox thing happened I'd read about a disease they tend to carry that kills them but as far as I know doesn't infect humans. Still knowing that in the pet trade they weren't doing well, I didn't want one.
I have the Rattus norvegicus species that's been domesticated for over 100 years, they're little, cute, affectionate, tame, intelligent little fuzzballs.. that's why I like them.
I don't want a big ole giant rat!

On the one hand I don't want anyone to stop me from keeping exotic pets but on the other hand with some species, I see the point for why various agencies want exotic pet keeping limited.
When it comes to irresponsible importers/breeders doing a poor job, I get so frustrated! They're mucking it up for everyone.
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PHRatz

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