Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Just got a nice new scale for x-mas, so I decided to see how all of the tortoises are doing. I'll go from smallest to largest... these are all russian torts:

-My little hatchling (just about a month old) is 20 grams and growing quickly.

-My yearling CB male is 239 grams, and also growing very quickly.

-The rescued tort that came to me in may as a small, light female has put on over an inch in shell length since then and is currently at 865 grams.

-The big female, mother to the hatchling has maintained the same weight and size since I got her in july. She is currently 1,155 grams.

Today is measuring day, so I'll have some new shell measurements in about an hour!

Here's the measurements I've been collecting since july when I first started measuring my russian torts. The measurements are done with a tape measure, and I only did increments of 1/8" (no 1/16" or odd increments). Usually I've noted an increase of about 1/4" per month for my growing torts. The only tort I have that isn't growing is an older female that is already quite large. I just recently got my scale, so today's measurements are the only ones with weight data.

July 29th:

-young male: 3 7/8"
-small female: 5 3/4"
-large female: 8 1/4"

August 31st:

-young male: 4"
-small female: 6"
-large female: 8 1/4"

September 29th (9 days after the large female laid two eggs...male mate unknown. Surface temperature of nesting site= approximately 160f. Nest was about 9" deep in topsoil):

-young male: 4" (attributed to switching enclosures)
-small female: 6 1/4"
-large female: 8 1/4"

October 29th:

-young male: 4 1/4" (grew again after moving back into old enclosure)
-small female: 6 1/4"
-large female: 8 1/4"

November 29th (12 days after fertile egg hatched):

-hatchling: 1" (approximately the size of a quarter)
-young male: 4 1/2"
-small female: 6 1/2"
-large female: 8 1/2"

December 29th (today):

-hatchling: 1 3/4" (most growth noted from thus far from any of my tortoises...lots of nice new shell growth). 21g/.75oz today.
-young male: 4 3/4" - 256g/9.05oz
-small female: 6 3/4" - 849g/1lb, 14oz
-large female: 8 1/4" - 1,083g/2lb, 6.2oz

It's interesting to see how their weights changed even between monday and today, but that's attributed mostly to food consumption, bowel movements, etc.

According to most data I've looked at, my month or so old hatchling is a runt (I find claims that they are typically around 1.5" at birth, while he was only about 1". He came from one of the largest russian torts I've ever personally seen... so I find it funny that he would be so small. He seems to be making up for it since he's hatched by growing and eating like crazy though.

Then again, the fact that only one egg out of the two was fertile tells me that either she or the male she was with are not very reproductive. Hopefully it was the male I am trying to track down the male she was bred with so I can get measurements on him. From what I do know about him (I saw him once briefly) he is very small...mature, but still only about 4" shell length!

morphometrics to your husbandry?
Simply put, it's a formula using a tortoises scl and weight to figure its ideal weight. I have an article that I could scan for you. I also have a excel sheet with the formula already inserted.

>>morphometrics to your husbandry?
>>Simply put, it's a formula using a tortoises scl and weight to figure its ideal weight. I have an article that I could scan for you. I also have a excel sheet with the formula already inserted.

Sorry to butt in here, but are you talking about the Jackson ratio?

According to the Tortoise Trust, the Jackson ratio is only applicable to the Greek and Hermann's tortoises. For other species it will over or under estimate weight. I think they state it will tend to make Russians look overweight even when they are underweight.

www.tortoisetrust.org/articles/jackson.html

If you aren't talking about the Jackson ratio, then never mind :->

I'm open to any theories that might be applicable, but yeah, different species have different ideal weight. A big example would be the fact that a leopard tortoise of the same shell length of my large russian would probably weight closer to 9 pounds, but that's pretty obvious just by looking at the animals (shell of a leopard is obviously much taller/larger).

I wonder how difficult it would be to make a similar graph for certain species like russians.

The calculation that the people on the russiantortoise yahoo forum use is (in centimeters):

(height x length x width) x .57 = weight in grams

There is also a graph called the McIntyre Ratio on the tortoisefriends yahoo forum that was put together using statistics from members own Russians. It's at
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/Tortoisefriends/files/

Not sure if the link will work, as you might have to join the forum and then go to the Files section (and it's about two-thirds of the way down the page).

Nina

states that the formula can be applied to all torts, except pancakes. I am looking for the article. I took it to my vet for him to make a copy, but I didn't put it back in its file. Once I come across it I'll send it along.
I'll need your email.

>>states that the formula can be applied to all torts, except pancakes. I am looking for the article. I took it to my vet for him to make a copy, but I didn't put it back in its file. Once I come across it I'll send it along.
>>I'll need your email.

Thanks for the offer, but I'm not worried about the formula for my own needs. I just keep an eye on my torts and if they are eating, healthy and not obese or lumpy, then I figure they are OK. I was just concerned that someone might mis-apply the formula to their own torts.

All I do is present the torts with opportunities (to eat, bask, etc.), and if they use them, they do. I do offer food everyday, and lots of it, but let's be honest, they don't eat when they don't need it. That's one thing I've noticed about keeping torts indoors.

I've also noticed that even without putting them through any sort of hibernation, they have slowed down a bit this winter (eating less and basking less), and this is without a change in temperature, lighting, moisture, etc.

I think it will be interesting to apply the russian tort formula to my group though to see how they compare.