Reptile & Amphibian Forums

ok my renter just moved out of my basement so i have a room dimensions 14x40 concrete floors (if i lift up carpet) I want to set up a breeding project on a large scale i was thinking veiled chameleons. currently i have 14 ball pythons (various morphs) i really like ball pythons but their not visually exciting. I am very handy and can build almost anything. i can supply water to the area if needed. Just looking for ideas on what project to shoot for. Not interested in large snakes. I also want to make cleanup as easy as possible any ideas appreciated. Thanks in advance, Chris

I guess my first question would be "why?". There are lots of veileds available these days (from terrible to good quality) and you may not see much return on all your work. Caring for eggs is pretty simple, but caring for gravid females and hatchlings is complex to do well and a totally different operation from boids. There are other cham species that could use a dedicated breeding project so the trade impacts wild populations less and less over time (jacksons, dilepis, senegalensis, gracefuls, rudis, carpets, fischeri). I think this is one of hobbyists' biggest responsibilities...establish sustainable captive populations to fill the pet market. I'm not sure a basement lends itself to chams. You will need a lot of artificial lighting and may need a ventilation system to provide temp and humidity cycles too. IMHO, I'd look around on commercial herp sites that sell chams (wc, cbb etc) and see what species are being marketed and what the demand seems to be. If a species seems to be advertised "cheap" very often or part of a "package deal" chances are they are not in demand (poor things) or the market is saturated. There are imports being marketed that probably would benefit from a breeder's dedication. Pick a species that you like personally and work to figure out its needs. I would also contact breeders or cham collectors to see what species they would be interested in seeing cbb. Some good contacts would be on adcham.com.

the reason i thought of veilds is their quick to sexual maturity and the relativly large clutch sizes. also on the classifide section was this post
Wanted VEILED CHAMELEONS
We Are A Lg Dealer Ready To Buy Veiled Chameleons, Minimum Size Of 3 ½” Total Length nose to tip of tail.
We Pay $16-$20ea and Require A Minimum 30 Per Shipment.
Maximum We Can Buy Per Order Is 200.
Will Pay The Express/UPS Charges. We mail check with-in 5 days after we receive the order or sooner if you require it.
If You Have Any Now Or In The Future Please Give Me A Call Or E-Mail.
Thanks
Ty
California Zoological Supply
upon contact they will only buy cb so i believe the demand is their what are your thoughts.

Well, actually, veileds shouldn't be bred much sooner than other species. Just because they are capable of breeding at 4-6 months doesn't mean they should. The females suffer a lot, lose clutches, and live much shorter lives if they start laying before they are a year old. They haven't really matured and their babies won't be as vigorous either. Babies should not be sold until they are at least 3 months old IMO, so as a responsible producer you bear the cost of feeding tiny hatchlings to give them a good start. It's really hard to predict what the public will continue to want. I don't know if I would base the investment on one company ad. (remember, you are asking a hobby forum about all this, so you are hearing my ethical opinions) Most pet owners are simply not prepared for a cham pet and most will die miserable deaths. Producing and selling them on a large scale might contribute to this as they become more "disposable". I'd hate to see veileds become the next iguana. Buying the cham is the least expensive part of the package. The pet owner will shell out a lot more for caging, lighting, feeders, etc, so when the costs add up, the cham gets short changed. I'd start looking at pet adoption sites and shelter sites, newspaper classifieds. If any chams show up needing new homes veileds will be the ones. Actually, designing, building and marketing decent screen cages is a good option too. A popular thread on various cham forums is where to find good cages in a variety of sizes. Almost all commercial caging is simply too small. These are just my opinions after working a bit in the herp business (retail) and rescuing chams.

i was comparing their quick breeding abality to other reptiles like ball pythons 3 yrs for a female. what in your opinion would be a good canidate for this project. I don't think they'll end up like iguanas because of their small size.