Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have babies on various sites, but never adults

Here are a bunch of pics for you! These are all different albino whitesideds. Hope you got DSL or CABLE LOL!!!!

Are there bulls that are both albino and axanthic? If so, what are they called? True snows?

Jake

Snow was incorrectly used to call albino whitesideds long ago. Unfortunatly it is stuck, and seems too late to change now. The problem is that whitesided bullsnakes are not anery or axanthic.

Here is what MOST people incorrectly use . . .

snow=albino whitesided
ghost=hypo whitesided

TRUE Snow=Albino Axanthic ***WHICH HAS NOT BEEN PRODUCED YET!***
TRUE Ghost=Hypo Axanthic ***WHICH HAS NOT BEEN PRODUCED YET***

Hope this helps. . . If you need to understand it better give KJ a call and he will wip you into shape heheheheh

Hey "Red"

If white sided are not anerythristic why is there no red in snows (white sidedxamel)including all the great pics you posted? If there is any red in white sided bulls then it should show up clearly when the black is removed. I have never seen red in a white sided although I have had a respected pit man tell me that he has one that does. I agree they are not axanthic because they all show some level of yellow, albeit subdued (hypoxanthic).

Gary

Gary,

Here is an albino white-sided bullsnake with what I consider red in it. What is your thoughts on this? People have crossed white-sided bulls and the Kingsville PHASE red bulls in hopes of getting a redder than normal white-sided bullsnake. I guess, in 2-3 years or so, that'll help answer some of these questions.

In my opinion, it is possible that axanthic and anerythristic means the same thing biochemically in bullsnakes. So, hypoxanthic and hypoerythristic would mean the same thing. Soooooo, since they white-sideds do reduce the amount of yellow (hyoxanthic as you called them), that would mean the amount of "red" would be reduced, too. Just a theory that can be proved wrong at any time.

You can see 2 more images of that snake in my photoalbum at http://gallery.pethobbyist.com/index.pl?thumb=1&stype=2&si=kjun&perpage=12&sort=1&cat=500&user=3965

Sorry they aren't very artistic...lol. Quick snaps with the camera for this thread and nothing else.
KJ

If you click on the link is a pretty red colored bull that is John Cherry's. I think they do have REDUCED red, but it is not gone. That is just my opinion though.

And Gary . . . This is Kemper, I got the pair of bulls from you a little while back. Did you get my email? I want some more, so shoot me an availability list!

Thanks!
Albino Whitesided (Mr.Cherry's)

KJ

Thanks for the pic. That is the first "snow" which I have seen showing any red. Interesting point about the red and yellow being tied together genetically. They very possibly are as all the animals which I would call anerythristic, and there are a lot of examples including the original response to this post, also have reduced yellow. However, the axanthics have distinct red in the blotches with a complete lack of yellow in between. The first amelanistic/axanthic, which I think will appear similar to the pink phase of the southern pine amel., may shed some light on this. My personal opinion is that there are 2 distinct biochemical pathways for yellow and red in bulls controlled by different genetic material which may at times interact.

Gary

Gary