Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I saw something about that on another post. I've noticed over time that some people here have mentioned that sometimes the boxies come out in winter when the weather warms up.
Last week we had temps in the 70s, in fact my sulcata laid some eggs again when it was nice & warm out. oy.. neat thing is I got that on video hee hee.
Anyway it was so nice & warm I wondered if Hobo our male box would come out, I've checked several times... his area is undisturbed so he must know that just because it's warm for a couple of days that doesn't mean it's ok to come up.
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PHRatz

I'll reply here, but this is for Lilypad's post also.

I kept a colony of box turtles in NJ for over a decade. I could have set my calender on it...April 14th. It was amazing, I'd see little heads poking out of the leaves/pine needles almost exactly on that date. In the actual pine barrens proper, the box turtles would wake up a few weeks earlier. The wind is blocked, but the sun shines brightly on the ground. This makes the barrens heat up more quickly. The difference isn't huge, though. Draconcjo, I thought you'd like that info.

Now I live in the Southeast, and the fact that I keep moving my turtles to different pens makes pinning down a date difficult, but it's generally in late February. When my Camellia blooms die, and the Rhododendron buds begin to open I know that I should keep my eyes on the pens.

The Easterns rarely wake up during winter, and if they do I know to watch out for illness the following spring/summer. Off hand, I can't think of any instances when a box turtle of mine has awoken during winter without ending up with some ailment during spring...usually an ear abscess, which is common in both wild and captive box turtles down here. I'm convinced that my Ornates and Deserts don't really ever enter a full-blown hibernation/brumation. They'll peer out and even walk around during any winter rain. So far, I've seen them every month of the winter at least once. I know from examining the "burrows" in the spring that the Ornates and Deserts don't dig nearly as deep as the Easterns. I assume that this is why they're more affected by air temperature changes, because they're not even dug into the soil.

Try to think of the ground as more of a body of water. We all know that it takes sunlight, not really air temperatures, to warm large bodies of water. Air temperatures can play a role, but it is really both the distance the sun happens to be from the land and the length of day that affects most ground temperature. Of course, the way in which we now construct our yards tweaks this natural process which is why moving my pens to the other side of the yard has made the turtles emerge several weeks earlier. Basically, though, if you're keeping a box turtle in its natural habitat, a few abnormally warm days usually won't be enough to raise the temperature of the earth significantly. In some areas, warmer spring rains can also play a role in raising soil temperature.

Ready for this? Climatologists please correct me if I'm wrong. In the larger picture, it isn't air temperatures that affect ground temperatures. In fact, it's the other way around. Pressure systems and the Gulf Stream play only a minor role.

Ken, thanks for that info I'm always striving to understand the behaviors of box turtles(and spotted and wood turtles) more and more. Thats interesting yours always woke up at the same time. I notice this with boxies and other reptiles and amphibians. In the spot I do most of my boxie observation it seems all the females lay eggs around the same week each year. This year I noticed the most activity on May 26th. I found the most raided nests around this time, and the most females walking around restlessly to nest during this week. Also the one female I have lays eggs on June 15th almost every year and another clutch on july 15th. My bullfrog in my pond has emerged from hibernation on the same week for the last three years. As for ground temps that is another interesting thing. Obviously many times ground temps are different then air temps. Many times it feels cold to us because of wind and other factors but on the ground it may be a different temp, especially if it has the sun beating on it. I mentioned before I saw a boxie up when temps were in the low 50's. But on the ground it felt warmer from the bright sun that was hitting the leaves. I am learning though that box turtles do not come out of hibernation for random warm days like painted and spotted turtles do. It seems boxies don't come up until they know it is def spring, and I'm guessing their trigger for this has to do more with hours of daylight then temperature. I know this coming spring I'm going to head out to the woods on May 26th to see if I can find a bunch of boxies laying eggs in a spot where last spring I saw at least 12 raided nest in a 20*20 spot. This year I'm going to build cages overtop the nests to foil any raccoons or coyotes eating oppurtunity.

>> It seems boxies don't come up until they know it is def spring, and I'm guessing their trigger for this has to do more with hours of daylight then temperature.

That's what I was thinking because in late Oct. when Hobo went under we still had plenty of nice warm days.. there were several when I was able to take the females out to the pen for a few hours of sunning but he would not come back up.
I think the shorter days- less sunlight had a lot more to do with it than temp.
Now that I have the pen the plan for 2007 is to get the females outside in spring, leave them out 24/7 for the entire season & hopefully they will do a natural hibernation on their own like Hobo does.

Thanks Ken for that info.. it was an interesting read
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PHRatz

Thanks Ratz, I know that it was terribly long.

Not only will your females likely thrive, but after a few years they may start giving you babies!

What is a sulcata? Sorry, you may have told us long ago.... But I know that no North American box turtles have "sulcata" as part of their names.

I can answer my own question now - all it took was a web search.

It's an African spurred tortoise (Geochelone sulcata).

Unless there are other turtle/tortoises with the word "sulcata" in its name

>>I can answer my own question now - all it took was a web search.
>>
>>It's an African spurred tortoise (Geochelone sulcata).
>>
>>Unless there are other turtle/tortoises with the word "sulcata" in its name

Nope no other turtles with that name. You got it -Geochelone sulcata is my rescued giant.
She still isn't as pretty as she could be but she was found horribly pyramided, dumped out in the country, & shot with a gun.
We got her in July 2002 & she's grown from 9lbs to 65 as of Aug. 2006.
Here's a photo of her backside with Chip the male box turtle.. you can see how different they are:

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PHRatz