Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hey everyone. I am thinking about purchasing a pair of pastels. I have not seen any in person though and was wondering if i could get some opinions on what is everyones favorite line of pastel? I noticed in some pics the graziani looks to have more blushing than other lines is this true or does it depend on the indevidual snake?

I've seen good and bad examples of each line. Pick a pastel that you like.
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Thanks,
Amy
www.myboids.4t.com
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2.17 Normal ball pythons
1.0 Pastel ball pythons
1.0 Plains Garter
0.1 Normal Kenyan Sand Boa
2.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa
1.0 Mid-Baja Rosy Boa
0.1 Leucistic Texas Rat
1.2 Dumeril's Boa
My list is too long, so I'll stop here!

Thay are all the same. Just buy one that you like.
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John Vandegrift

You think All pastels are the same?????? I think not!

Yes, they may all be compatable, meaning breeding different lines together will produce supers if crossed, but they are far from being all the same as far as looks and color.

I know first hand from seeing all the lines of pastels in Don Kaye's collection. He has Blondes,Lemons,Graziani,Bell,and regular Nerd line pastels and if you were to put one of the adult breeders from each line side by side, you would CLEARLY see that not ALL pastels are the same!

If you are looking for color then the blondes and the lemons are it. They have a brighter yellow color that actually stay's better than other lines, into adulthood. Graziani's line usually has some nicer blushing, but other lines can have it too.

If you plan on breeding pastels into other morphs someday then the line of pastel you choose becomes very important. For instance, I have seen adult bumblebees that look just like a spider because the line of pastel that was used really browned out as it grew. On the otherhand I have seen adult bumblebees that were produced from a lemon pastel that were still bright yellow as adults.

Me personally, I would rather spend more money on a morph that is going to stay nicer looking AND produce better looking offspring than having spent good money on a morph that is only going to produce average or below average offspring and become a lousy example of that morph as an adult.

The choice is yours; do your homework, but hopefully you'll see that Quality is key!

If they were not all the same they would not be compatible. They are all carrying the same gene. New WC pastels come in every season. The only reason more "lines" have not been named is that people stopped naming them. Why are pastels any different than Albinos, Cinnys, YB's? New WC morphs come in all the time yet you don't hear 50 different lines for everything. Another thing is by now every "line" is so outcrossed with normals and other morphs the original pastel that it came from means almost nothing. Every animal is different. There will be nice animals from every line just like there will be ugly animals from every line. Now I do think the originators of the various lines have selectivly bred to produce the traits they like but that has nothing to do with the pastel gene itself. There is no reason to worry about which line you buy from. Just find an animal that has been selectivly bred to carry the traits you look for in a pastel and buy it.
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John Vandegrift

Obviously you missed the point.

Its not even worth the time. I realize now why some of the Big Boys don't post here anymore.

Opinions are like bellybuttons, Everybody's got one!

"Obviously you missed the point.

Its not even worth the time. I realize now why some of the Big Boys don't post here anymore.

Opinions are like bellybuttons, Everybody's got one!"

Then what is your point??? It is the same gene for every line of pastel that makes the snake a pastel. What is so hard for you to understand??? Of course every snake looks different. For every great looking pastel from any of your precious "lines" I could show you one that looks like crap. The normal female used to produce the pastel is just as important as the pastel.Do you not agree with my original statement that there are nice pastels from every line? So what is the best line of pastels in your opinion??? When did I tell the person to not buy a quality pastel? I said to buy the nicest one you could find and not worry about the line. You did not answer any of my questions on my previous post so I am sure you won't on this one either but it's up to you. I am interesed in hearing you answers my questions since you seem to think you know so much about the subject, but I am sure you won't bother and just respond with more "it's not worth the time" and "opinions are like belly buttons" stuff. You are right though "opinions are like belly buttom everyone has one" yours just happens to be wrong.
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John Vandegrift

Lol the Pastel wars.... Ok so lemons and graziani are the good lines as far as quality into adulthood goes? I know i am going to pick out the best looking ones i can find. I did learn somethings from both post though. And dont fight everyone does have an opinion and its there right to express it. No more drama folks. If i get two insanely colored pastels will there be a better chance that the supers will be insane or is it all random?

I am well aware that all the pastels are the same gene, what I'm saying is that from my experience (me and my partner's collection which has many different lines of pastels) our collection has produced well over a hundred pastels and the blondes and lemons consistently produce better looking pastels, even to your average "non-fancy" normal Females.

Just out of curiosity, how many different pastels are you working with and how many pastels have you produced that make you so compelled to state that my opinion is wrong?

Yes, I will agree that all lines do vary, you can get nice looking offspring from a ugly looking pastel and you can get some average looking pastels from a blonde.... (AS BABIES). But show me what that ugly pastel's nicest offspring looks like as an adult, and then show me that low grade blonde offspring as an adult and I would be willing to bet that the blonde will make a much brighter adult. SO my point is "Selective Breeding"!

I am also aware of newly imported pastels with no line name given to them. We actually have a few of those too. I was only giving the names of lines because of my experience with them and that's what the person was inquiring about in the first place. And for someone who doesn’t know about those "precious lines" as you stated, I was trying to help them out by giving them my first hand experience, not start another pastel war.

Just remember, forums were created to exchange information to better educate each other as a community.

Just pick one you like, I have several lines and a good looking pastel is a good looking pastel!
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Greg Power
B.O.A. Inc
boainc@gmail.com

Here is my opinion on Pastels. Buy a high quality male, or Pastel cross male. Spend a little extra to get a 9 or 10 male, on a 1-10 scale. With the Ball market the way it is, I think the emphasis has swung from producing (overproducing) a large amount of offspring to producing a high quality offspring. Go to a show if you can, or just call Kevin, Dan, Ralph, etc., and ask for a pick of the litter male Pastel, or a holdback male. You will probably not get one for $200, but you might get a looker for $400 or $500. Also, when you get your normal females, buy "oddball" females, high yellow, high orange, reduced Pattern, etc., females that might make even nicer Pastel offspring. As far as female Pastels, look for high quality, but if you can get a group of females that are 7 or 8's for a good price, my thought is you cannot have too many Pastel females, and all of them do not have to be 10's. Look into a male Pastel YB if you can swing it. Mine looks pretty good, and will produce both morphs, which is a nice bonus.

Dave