Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have been working with Bullsnakes for over 12 years but yesterday, a customer asked me a question I could not answer. Does any one have a definitive answer as to whether the Stillwater line of hypomelanism is compatible with the generic line of hypomelanism? Obviously, the only way to prove it would be to breed the two lines together. If hypos are produced in the first generation, the answer is yes. If not, they are two seperate genetic traits.

Has anyone performed such a breeding? If so, what were the results.

Thanks

John Schmitt

Suncoast Herpetological

John,
I did this breeding in (2001) and produced 8 normals as suspected.The generic line and the stillwater line is non campatible.

Shannon

Thanks Shannon
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Thanks

John Schmitt

Suncoast Herpetological

are all available hypos, except stillwater hypos, compatible?
rick

yes,
there is only one generic line and then the stillwaters.

Now,there is about three or four lines of albinos and atleast one isn't compatible.Two years ago a friend of mine bred a albino male to one of my snow females and produced a huge clutch of normals. So the snow had a different strain of amel in her?

Shannon

OK- Here's what I'm sure to some of you on here will be a stupid question, but I'm just now trying to learn the ins, and outs of genetics, and I'm confused as hell. I understand that certain strains of albinos aren't compatable with certain other strains of albinos even within a certain species. Kinda like in Col. boas Sharp strain, and Kahl strain albinos aren't compatable. What I don't understand is why. It would seem like as long as it is within the species they would be ok together. Excuse my ignorance, and inexperience, but can anyone explain this to me? Thanks for your replies.
Ken

Ok, I am not a geneticist but her goes.... Why would the breeding of two snakes within the same species or subspecies, each dislpaying a trait such as albinism or hypo-melanism be "incompatable" which is to say that they produce wildtype offspring. The answer lies in the cause of the trait. A total lack of pigmnet, albinism, or a lack of or reduction in black pigment, hypo-melanism can be caused by a variety of conditions....the lack of ability to produce a particular protien or amino acid, the blocking of a particular pathway...etc. In the case of both the hypo-melanistic trait noted in the "Stillwaters" and the generic line we have a trait dictating a simple recesive condition but the reduction of pigment is caused by two diffent disruptions in the normal pigment condition. So a breeding produces animals that are heterozygous for both conditions and niether condition is displayed. (Paul H. jump in here any time).

I guess the question I have is what do the homozygous generic hypo/"stillwater" animals look like, and could you isolate the causes of the two hypo-melanistic condition based on that appearence? For example which condition is closest to the root of melanin formation...etc?

Look at these stillwater OK hypo/kingsville Tx red offspring.

Great post John!
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Genesis 1:1

Exactly! Great post. Thank you very much for the information.
Ken

I found these same results with breeding albino annectens. I bred a Brian Barczyk male to a Mark Bell female and ended up with a clutch of normals.

Bro, that snake is amazing!!!
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Genesis 1:1

Thank you. That is the male that I bred with an albino female and produced all normal babies. I just aquired another adult female that is believed to be of the same strain of albino as the male. I'll try for albino's again this year. I did hold back one of the regular babies from last year and man it is turning out to be a really nice looking animal as well. I hope to breed it back to dad in a couple years.

Andy

n/p