Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hello everyone,

Just wondering if anyone has noticed an individual monitor's unique response to the captive environment to be something that has passed on to their offspring?

For example, some monitors of the same species are insane-crap-whip-bite fellas and some become quite docile in captivity. Given this temperament continuum (beyond environmental controls) it would seem possible to genetically funnel like traits into a long term bloodline resulting in a shift in that continuum to one side or the other.

Just curious...

Thank you,

Tom

First off, it would take many generations and keeping whole clutches to do so. The problem here is, how many keepers have produced generations????? For any reason, muchless for attitude.

Secondly, attitude is both inherent and learned. Very simply put, you and pea off a monitor and it will go ballistic on you. The learning part is, they remember who pea them off. I have seen this with many species. An example is George, hes my oldest lacie male. Hes a bit of a lover, then comes food. Or food then love. He could give a crap about other monitors. But if one bugs him enough, he will go balistic on them, with serious intent. But only after enough proding. A lot of proding.

This goes for people. Most monitors are very tolerant, but most people keep bugging and poking and picking and do not leave them alone, then the monitors goes nuts on them. You cannot blame the monitor. It has to go nuts, it has no other option. Its that or internalize stress and die.

Also, keepers would rather breed for goofy color morphs and zig zags and all such things.

Besides, monitors are in most cases(99%) very very nice and friendly curious animals. Its the people who mistreat them, then blame the monitor. Sorry for the editorial, hahahahahahahaha

Anyway, in most cases bad attitudes(like mine) are learned and not genetic. Cheers

"Anyway, in most cases bad attitudes(like mine) are learned and not genetic."

LOLOL, Frank sometimes your funny as hell .

I agree though. They only get ornery when pushed to far, and some have shorter fuses than others, I'm sure. Or probably if WC also. Those get mistreated from the start and surely don't forget. So there's fear and mistrust there from the begining.

Quig
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Don't interupt me when I'm talkin' to myself

but sadly, most keepers are far to serious and come here with a chip on their shoulder/s. Particularly those prejudiced against me. I always include very funny things, but again sadly, those sail right by those folks.

I truly understand that people often look to be offended or look to be entertained, look to fight or look to judged, so I normally offer something for all. Really, thats what I do with monitors too. I give them what they want. I am here for them. hahahahahahahahahahahaha. You do need humor as very few actually look to learn.

For instance, during the days of Jobi and warring, we often included humor, satire, really good information and more humor. Jobi was genius and it was great fun. But again and again sadly, others did not understand what was humor, or what was information or what was real. You must understand, reality is a very funny thing. The reality is, you and your monitor. thats it. After that, reality is vague. Jobi and I often included a different set of reality or realities. Such things are momentary reality or false reality. Or even avoided reality as all costs.

It was funny that people often picked false reality over reality. Funny in a twisted sort of way, but funny none the less. You see, there is lots of types of humor too. Cheers

well said, thank you.

I do know of a red-tail boa bloodline that consistently produces not only extremely beautiful offspring with some unique markings but they are all very very docile snakes (more than most red-tails). In fact it is just about a selling point for them (he came from so and so...) with respect to their lineage.

Actually in aviculture it is becoming increasingly more common to consider it bad form to breed birds with poor captive behavioral attributes (plucker, cage terrirorial, etc). The problem is many with those exact attributes become breeders because of these behaviors haha (well it sure wont make a good pet...get a mate and put em in an aviary...). As you put so well with monitors, most bird behavioral issues (prob more so) are directly related to how they have been treated in the past (or environmental factors) so the genetic link is perhaps weak at this time. It would be nice if in the future the morphs sought after would be cbb for temperament rather than color and therefore eliminating the demand for wc or fh.

Thank you for the information.

Tom

Tom the problems are many fold, first monitors are not birds. That is, they have a completely different history. Birds of many kinds have been bred in captivity for 100's of years. I use to work with this old and I mean old Irish fella, he bred finches and such for 75 years. Now the history of monitors is slim at best.

I have produced more generations then anyone I know of and I am a beginer. My 16 years of breeding monitors, vs. the old Irish fellas 75.

of instance varanid breeding started in Europe before here. But they have little room and small spaces. So they prided themselves of keeping one pair for long periods. I on the hand, had lots of space and produced generation after generation. To do so, means keeping offspring. To keep offspring means space.

About boas, hmmmmmmmmm I bred them when I was 21. I am 59 how. again they have a long history of captive management.

The reality of varanids is, SPACE. A pair of monitors takes many times the resourses of a pair of boas. A pair of ackies (small monitors)requires a larger space then most people keep a pair of adult boas in. Now consider larger monitors. A pair would take the space of a colony of boas.

So to find suitable captive qualities in varanids takes numbers. Those numbers are not there at this time. And will not be there as there is no way to support keeping and breeding large numbers. There will be no support as long as cheap $5.00 monitors are imported in mass numbers. Cheers

That's very interesting.What is your overall opinion of black throats?I've read alot of negative things but,still I see pics of them being handled.Thanks!, Jeff