Reptile & Amphibian Forums

a Black Pond turtle (S. crassi) tank? I want to add a little as a precaution to ward off any fungal infection that this species is prone to. I keep the water warm (85 F), but these turts are rather sensitive. Thanks in advance.

Jay

PS-I house her in a 60 gallon aquarium.

Jay,
Rather than add salt to the tank why not try this...add some sphagnum moss to the filter medium to lower the PH. This will naturally acidify the water. You can also just float some sphagnum into the water directly.
I had a terrible time with fungus this summer with hatchling muds till I did this. Now the fungus is gone as it can't live in acidic water.

Thanks Mayday, I hadn't considered that. I just bought a bale of sphagnum moss for my philodrndrons. I'll give it a try and see how that goes. So far my crassi is doing great, albeit, the most shy turtle I've owned. Fascinating species for sure. Thanks again.

Jay

If you want to "lower" the pH, an even better way (and a less messy way than the moss) is just put some driftwood in the tank. It will give you that acidity you're looking for, and add a natural element for your turtles to explore and bask on.

Hey Curtis,

You said it, moss is messy! I had a bunch so I went ahead and took Mayday up on his suggestion. I wasn't aware of the fact that driftwood contributed to the ph quality of water. Again, this is all being done as a precaution due to Black Pond turtles propensity for coming down w/ funagal infections. She is a LTC specimen which helps, I just didn't want to take any chances. Now I have salt, moss, and driftwood at my disposal. Thanks guys for the replies, I really appreciate it.

Jay

These are great suggestions all around.

Just keep in mind that, like any other method, the leaching of tannic acid from driftwood will decrease over time. Freshly cut timber releases dangerous levels in a closed system while well-aged driftwood releases very small amounts. You may need to buy a piece of driftwood every 6 months or a year. Driftwood specifically sold for aquaria are supposed to have already leached their tannic acid. However, most still will.

Another method is to use "blackwater extract". It comes in both a liquid drop form and packets that are placed in the filter. It's clean and controllable. You can get almost the exact pH you desire by adding more or less drops.

Good luck with your turtle.

That is the best idea. Blackwater extract is the simplist and most reliable way of acidifying your water.
My problem is that NONE of our many local aquarium stores ever carry it.

Thanks Mayday.

Yeah, it can be hard to find. It's considered a "specialty" item. People who keep Discus and Angelfish often find that this stuff really helps with all of their assorted ick.

Luckily, I've always been able to find it at Petsmart. Here's some on an internet order site. At least the picture may help it stand out in the store.

http://www.strictlypetsupplies.com/productshow.php?searchword=black+extract&OVRAW=blackwater%20extract&OVKEY=blackwater%20extract&OVMTC=standard

A knowledgeable guy who used to post on this site would recommend using Pimafix and Melafix at half strength to help prevent fungal and bacterial infections. I've used these items to treat infections, but not prophylactically. However, I trust the person who gave this info. as he's dealt with the rigors of headstarting hundreds of Diamondback terrapins which are prone to these infections. These products are available just about everywhere.

Yep, I was aware of discus and other Amazonian fish that love acidic water and that is how I learned of the blackwater treatments.
I have never really had any fungal problems until last year. Then, for some reason all of the hatchling mud turtles, Pelusios and even Reeve's turtles that I got were plagued with fungus no matter what I did or how clean their water was. I am no newbie either, I have been keeping mud and musk turtles (plus many other species) since the 60s and I NEVER, EVER had fungal problems before. I am not sure if the problem is with our local water supply (heavily treated) or with the breeder the turtles came from.
Another thought I have is that maybe the situation has come about because I now have to use chlorine and chloramine remover each time I clean the turtle's quarters. Could that stuff be contributing to the outbreaks?

"Another thought I have is that maybe the situation has come about because I now have to use chlorine and chloramine remover each time I clean the turtle's quarters."

Why have you needed to start using these products? Did you switch from well to municipal water? If you did, this could most certainly be your problem. Depending on where you live geographically, most well water is naturally more acidic than city water. There are other things about municipal water, but I won't get into that here. Let's just say...better use a Brita.

As far as the water conditioning products...that's very interesting. Some are labeled as containing "electrolytes". They don't specify. If one of those includes dextrose, glucose, or some other sugar...that could be a problem right there. Huh, I'm going to have to keep my ears open for that one. This might be a good post topic..."Have keepers noticed more fungal infections with the use of water conditioners".

Good conversation, Mayday. Thanks.

I live in Lake Worth, Florida and have for most of my life. When I was a kid I had many aquariums with tropical fish. I never had to condition water for my fish and could use it right out of the tap. This water was from the municipal source.
Then, about the 1980s the City of Lake Worth started adding more chemicals to the mix and I gave up on keeping fish. The water was so heavily chlorinated that it became impractical to maintain a number of aquariums. Even turtles would show stress by closing and rubbing their eyes in this swimming pool water.
Now, with the various water conditioners it is easier and my adult turtles are fine and have been for years. But for the past couple of years I have had the fungal problems with hatchlings and haven't been able to figure out why.
Adding the sphagnum moss has really helped as it has natural antibacterial properties--that is why it is so good for incubating snake eggs--and it keeps the PH low. But the blackwater extract would be much easier.
Your comments about the additives to the water conditioners certainly makes sense though. It would seem that some of these ingredients would promote bacterial growth.
Incidentally, acidic water is a must for matamata turtles.

I took your advise Mayday, and put some sphagnum moss in the tank. Again, this was done as a precautionary measure. I have seen no fungus on my Black Pond turtle. Now when I had my fungal outbreak w/ my White Cheek mud turtles, I began cleaning them a lot more often, added some aquarium salt, and upgraded my filters. It all seemed to work. One thing I can't seem to do successfully, is to feed the turtles in a separate container. I tried but they just sat there and never touched the food. Any tricks on getting these little monsters to feed in something other than their normal enclosure. Surely this is the best method of controlling waste.

Jay

Oh yes, I know this problem well. I have some adult redcheeks that I have raised from hatchlings and who will otherwise take your finger off, but that will also refuse to feed outside of 'their' tank. One or two will eat in the sink, but the others will only swim (or scuffle) around and ignore the food.
The minute they are back in their aquariums they are frantically paddling up to you for food! Go figure. I have no solution for this.

Thanks for the info Ken. Mayday had suggested to me the Blackwater product. I think I can get it at pet shops here in town. So far so good w/ my Black Pond turtle. I have seen her eat several times, and she is beginning to get used to me moving around near the tank.

Jay

That's great, Jay! It sounds like you're being a very proactive owner. I hope things continue to go well for you.

N/M.