Reptile & Amphibian Forums

hey everyone
im new here
my name is kirk and im looking into getting a v.salvadorii in around 5-6 or so months once i move into my apartment. He will be getting a 12X8X8 foot(LxWxH).
i just have a few questions

What should i feed him and how much and how often?

if i build him a hide in the top part of the cage would it be ok for me to mesh off about 4 inches and put in a repti heat chord.to bring the hides temps up during the night or would he just cut threw it with his claws?
also if i do decide to get a pair when is breeding season?

thanks
kirk

there is no breeding season for monitors. as an experienced keeper, i would expect for you to know that. if you are not an experienced keeper, please think LONG and HARD about getting the most dangerous lizard you can buy, and a giant one at that.

check out our Croc Monitor FAQ before taking the tendon snipping plunge...
Pro Exotics FAQ- Croc Monitors

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robyn@proexotics.com

Pro Exotics Reptiles

Although any monitor can be dangerous, as Frank mentioned, the Croc monitor poses, in my opinion, more cause for concern (when compared to other easily obtained monitors) due to their behavior. We experienced this first hand at my facility. Two years ago, one of my animal keepers was giving our croc monitor (a YOUNG male at only 7') it's daily warm shower. He took his eyes off the lizard for a split moment and the croc must have seen some fingers moving around on the spray nozzle. He came over and just nipped and let go in a millisecond. I heard a blood curly scream and ran over only to see blood splattered on the glass, the floor, everywhere. This little nip just about severed off one of the fingers of my staff. He went through 4 hours of intensive surgery and has a very nice scar to this day and has never regained fully feeling and mobility in that finger. Just something to think about before making a mistake. I also agree with Frank's comments about keeping a croc in a small cage in an apartment....there are many other ultra cool monitor species that will do perfectly fine in that cage. Maybe a black roughneck monitor?....to me, they are just one of the neatest looking monitors on the planet.

Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center

>>there is no breeding season for monitors. as an experienced keeper, i would expect for you to know that. if you are not an experienced keeper, please think LONG and HARD about getting the most dangerous lizard you can buy, and a giant one at that.
>>
>>check out our Croc Monitor FAQ before taking the tendon snipping plunge...
>>Pro Exotics FAQ- Croc Monitors
>>
>>-----
>>robyn@proexotics.com
>>
>>Pro Exotics Reptiles
>>
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Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
Lake Forest, IL

While I do not think Crocs are more dangerous then other mid to large monitors. They without question are not a beginers or intermediate keepers best or even a good choice. They are for advanced with lots of resources. Resources are money and space, to support such an animal.

They are demanding in care, as well as safty. They are also demanding in cage size. Your cage is basically a holding cage. Not for something that can commonly get 7 to 8 feet to live in.

Just think about that, a monitor that cannot even leave its own tracks. Its like putting an ackie (18inches) in a two foot long cage. Every one would yell at you for doing that. Well, the truth is, they should yell at you for what your intending to do.

Lastly, keeping a croc monitor in an apartment is, plain and simple insane. There is nothing good that could happen and lots and lots of bad that will occur. What will most likely happen will be cause for more laws against anyone keeping those wonderful monitors. I hate laws that tell me what to do. So instead of laws telling you, use your brain and show those lawmakers wrong. We don't need no stinking laws.

Keep something smaller and less problematic. Keep something that gets four feet max, in that same cage. Think about this, the larger the cage you keep monitors in, the more they DO, the more they do, the more fun it is to keep them. Keeping a monitor in a tiny box is no fun, there is nothing to learn, and torture for the animal. So why do it?????

For kind and humanitarian reasons, do the needful and oblidge, get something smaller and have fun. hahahahahahahahahahahaha, Cheers

I second what Frank and Robyn have said. Most keepers are just not cut out to take on a croc monitor. The same goes for waters, niles, and blackthroats (however, blackthroats are a better choice than the previous two).

Like Frank said, get something that will actually do something in that cage, and that you will enjoy. I think that you would thoroughly enjoy keeping one or two argus in a cage that size. There are several others that would also do well in a cage that size (including a colony of dwarf monitors), but argus and argus crosses are probably going to be the most fun.

Ryan

hey every one and thanks you for the links
i understand the dangers of this lizard and am well aware of what i will eventually be getting into.
i also have a question about protection against crocs/other speices of monitors
and i was just wondering if to protect your hands and fore arms if u had ever used welding gloves or butchers gloves to stop the bite from penetrating my freind had a few small burms and a few vipers(cant remember what kind they where)but he wore both to make sure he could hold the snakes with out getting bit and or invenimated( i think thats how u spell it
also i dont understand why u are saying tha my cage is to small all the caresheets i have read have said they keep there 1.2 v salvadorii in a 14 long 8 wide and 4 foot high cage. mine is the same size if u take away the feet on the end and adding it to the hight.
now i know u all think im irresposible but i am also thinking of ways to make his or her cage so that i dont have to go inside to clean it feed him or give him water(since he will have a large water pool) there will be very little handling

thanks
kirk

A croc monitor is not one of those. Those are toys, hahahahahaha Even a small croc monitor goes thru welding gloves like butter. It appears you have no idea what your getting into, by your comments. If you have to ask about gloves, you are not ready. Those shark gloves would work.

Just the fact you failed to talk about cage size means your not ready.

I really could careless if a monitor cripples you, it ain't my problem. As long as you keep it to yourself and not make headlines. Then cause laws to be created to protect ignorant folks from hurting themselves.

I hope your not one of those folks, as I am sure your smarter then that. Cheers

hi FR
i was only asking about gloves in genral and cage size i am building him or her a 12 foot long by 8 foot wide by 8 foot tall cage if this is not small enough then i will go a bit larger
also the gloves are just a precaution i will nto be handling him or her like i do any other animals i own
if u could help me out that would be great since i would lvoe to get this varnid and will do everything i can to get him and make me safe
thanks
kirk

gloves don't really help in that type of situation. think about it, in a cage that size, you can't use a hemostat to reach in and pull food, you can't keep an adult in a rubbermaid while you clean...

you have to walk in the cage, on a regular basis. your hot a$$ head, arms, neck (all radiating heat that turns the monitors on) will be a much tastier looking target than your leathery gloved hands.

walking in the cage of the Croc "Tree" Monitor, and having a completely "friendly" animal drop out of the air looking to perch on your head and shoulders while "tamely" looking for food can cause amazing damage.

really, look into another species, there are quite a few choices, none with such amazing potential.

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robyn@proexotics.com

Pro Exotics Reptiles

You'll do anything to get one of these monitors, how about getting a house in the country where its not around other people and can have room. An apartment is not for these animals, Period.

How about asking the apartment manager if its ok to keep an 8 foot reptile with razor teeth and yes it bites, in your apartment. I can imagine what the answer will be.

I kept and bred croc monitors, but stopped for this very reason. Good luck

hey Kirk you just got some great advice from two of the most experienced varanid keepers / breeders in the US. Their advice is you should get a more manageable goanna.

You obviously have limited knowledge of monitors, which is ok (me too)...but when that is the case it is wise to listen to those that have experience. Ask yourself, if these two guys, who do this for a LIVING...don't mess with croc monitors for all the reasons they gave, should I?

You want a huge truly awesome looking lizard? Get a blackthroat. Trust me they give you all the OH MY GOD factor you could ever want (especially after they take a dump). My buddy has a 6' female that has me in awe everytime I see her. She is beautiful, her colors are amazing. She even decides to let us interact with her most of the time. Plus if it is danger you want, dont worry a large blackthroat can still crush your fingers or with a small twitch of a tail give you a welt 2" wide across your face hahahha. They just decide not to more than most.

Anyway good luck with your salvadorii. You are goanna need it (haha).

Tom

Jody is this your hand?

Man it’s a love bite compared to both my croc bites, the one on my palm required 2 surgery.

You know I love these monitors, probably more then most keepers will ever do!

I have sold 7 pairs thru the years, from those 5 different keepers got bitten, 2 of them seriously. I am never going to fault the monitors for human error or stupidity, but I feel the need to discourage peoples from keeping them.

Other then what already been said about them, I feel the most dangerous aspect about them, is that they don’t advertise, most monitors will hiss or tail lash if disturbed, at least they will signal via body language, but crocs have this ability to remain motionless and strike lightning fast when you least expect, they also turn at anything that touches them while sleeping with open mouth, they actually strike open mouth before they open eyes.

I got many close calls with this specie, some terrifying.
Peoples should treat them like zoo animals and have separate holding pen for feeding and maintenance, its always the very tame crocs that tags you (sooner or later)

ps. How’s your nice baby nil?

That hand belongs to one of my friends who learned the hard way why I say to give them respect. I have worked with Zoo animals so I know all to well about giving respect when it is needed. I haven't taken a serious bite from them yet myself (knock on wood). That bite was from a very small young male croc not even 4 foot. It was a glancing bite and still left a nasty reminder and a nice scar too.

This picture and many people have left me to seperate my crocs. I managed to find the right homes for two of them but the other two will probly never be allowed together, if they do the eggs will be tossed out. There are not enough of the right homes for these guys to be readily available. Also to many imports being sold as tame. It is sad to think considering how much I enjoy and like mine. But I like them enough to protect myself and others. The last thing we need is another reason to make a silly law.

My niles are all doing good. I still have that big blue one you liked too. I have been wondering what the offspring would look like between it and one of my yellows.

If its convenient could you post a pic of your blue nile? Never seen on.
thanks
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2.3 Bearded Dragons
1.0 Pastel Ball Pythons (NERD Line)
0.0.1 Water Monitors
1.1 Pastel Red Tailed boa Het. for Albino
1.1 Yellow Ackie Monitors
And Counting...

You should look into a medium sized Monitor species or perhaps an Argentine B/W Tegu.

OK FR and Robyn, this is the first time in recorded history that I will ever agree with you on anything, you can tell alot about a person by the way they speak, and from listening to this persons post there a few things I picked out. Listen bud, you are young, very young, I can see that, and you obviously havent kept many monitors if any, especially not large ones, and since you said you were getting him in a few months you havent even purchased anything yet, save urself some money buy a smaller monitor cage and a smaller monitor, learn, then get a larger one. I made the mistake of getting a nile monitor my first time out, and let me tell you it has been a very bumpy road, including thousands of dollars and countless hours spent researching, reading, cleaning, and this was all in the first few weeks, I can tell you my wife was not pleased in any way during those first few weeks, all over a lizard. So good luck buddy, in a few months well see a post from you with the headline "sick monitor please help" or "escaped monitor, what to do", Im not saying you are a bad person in anyway, and I can see that your intentions are good but please understand at this forum there are over a 100 years expierence in varanid care you should see this site as the holy grail for info and as much as I hate to admit it FR and Robyn are one of the most useful resources you could ever engage, I would include myself but often I could care less about peoiple problems and more about my never ending breeding colonies and cage after cage that sit in my den. Good luck, and to Robyn and FR, you win this battle....

Is that you should definitly not get a croc monitor. I don't know whether you've owned other monitors or not, but if you haven't a croc is the worst possible start you can get. It doesn't matter how many snakes, lizards, trutles or even alligators you've owned. If you haven't owned something along the lines of a blackthroat or a water for at least 3-5 years then your not ready for a croc.

I wouldn't say its because your in danger of getting injured(bitten,scratched... and you definitly are). The bigger problem is that you are in danger of not providing this monitor with what it needs. See the majority of us reptile enthusiasts have that trait of being "impulse buyers" I don't care who you are if your into reptiles you have probly had an impulse buy or two at one point in your life.
I've done this alot in my life. Getting boas that get up to 10 feet long when i was too young, bearded dragons, iguanas, pythons, turtles ect. Now when i was young i would set my mind on these animals and get them no matter what. But i never had trouble with any of these guys. Each of these animals were taking care of properly, none died, all healthy. And not one of them ever stressed me out or put me in a situation where i was asking myself "what am i doing wrong? What am i doing wrong?" (Which i asked myself many times with my water monitor.)

Then one day i realized "hey.... now that i'm 18 i think i want to get a water monitor" Having studied this species since a child i was truly fascinated with them and picked one up at a local reptile show. MY god i had no idea what i was getting into.

I never had an animal that could be stressed so easily. Never had an animal that would turn down food just to avoid me and would rather let itself die. Never knew the true meaning of cleaning a gigantic water bowl filled with fecies every single day. Had to leave a day light on all night long just so she could come out and comfortably bask while i was asleep. Monitors are trouble, and the croc monitor the king daddy of them all will be no better.

I don't know the exact size these guys can reach but i believe its up to 10 feet? I have had my water monitor for about a year now. Shes kept in a 7 foot long cage with two big water dishes, deep substrate, a wood top to keep heat/humidity in, 4 lights across the top one that is day glow by the basking spot. Shes only about a year old and im working on her 12'x 12'x 6' high wooden cage because the 7 foot tank isnt big enough. And my water monitor is a smaller monitor then a croc.

These guys eat ALOT! They crap ALOT! They require ALOT! And they'll end up costing you A WHOLE HELL OF ALOT! I have learned to maintain the husbandry of my water just perfectly in her current tank and have learned how to behaive around her in order to keep her feeling secure. (again monitors are stressed very easily).

But very soon she'll be bigger, her claws will be bigger, her teeth will be bigger and she'll proboly hate me just as much as she does now. Her cage will also be bigger which will make the husbandry maintence twice as hard. These guys aren't lizards there monitors, which are completely different then any other reptile i've worked with. And if you really want one then regardless of how many times people tell you not to get one youll get one anyway. But about a year to two from now you'll remeber everyone in this forum telling you "no" and you'll whish you listened. Take this from me who had the same experience with the people in this forum just a year ago... and i'll admit now that i should have listened.
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2.3 Bearded Dragons
1.0 Pastel Ball Pythons (NERD Line)
0.0.1 Water Monitors
1.1 Pastel Red Tailed boa Het. for Albino
1.1 Yellow Ackie Monitors
And Counting...

Hey Kirk,
I too was once like you, being interested in the Croc monitor. I started doing the research, and talked with a person selling some. What finally turned me off of them was seeing the scars from one bite. Thinking "wow that suck's!". The dealer then told me that the bite from one of these monitors requires going to the hospital and having all the bacteria washed out of the gaping wound. He said, all in all, it was one of the most painful experiences of his life!
These Croc monitors were small at the time, only about 2 feet!
I remember Vision having adults in their warehouse. When I walked past the giant cage. These lizards wanted a piece of me. This son of a B, jumped on a branch, with his claws on the mesh front, and started rocking back and forth. To this day, I dont understand how they could have cleaned those cages without having a life threatening experiance.
I agree with all these posts. You are asking for alot of trouble keeping such an animal. You have to remember! When this monster gets out (like most reptiles eventially do, usually to some type of keeper error), whos it gonna seriously hurt!
If you live in an urban area. People are going to know you keep this guy, and when someones child gets attacked. You can garantee a lawsuit or an insane parent looking to kill it's keeper!
What it costs to buy a Croc monitor. You can get some amazing other monitors, and not jepordize anyones elses safety! Not to be rude, but your safety being the last to worry about!
Good luck, and be safe!
I hope you make the right decision!
JasonMc

Not to be a dick but do you realize this species holds the record for the longest lizard/monitor in the world at 16 feet.. I had my pair set-up on the side of my house.. The enclosre totaled 24'L X 8'W X 12H. not only do you not have a big enough enclosure but, your in an apartment. You cant exactly comfortably fit your size enclosure into an APT. If anything, get a baby (almost impossible now a days) and raise it, not only so you have time to move into a bigger place, but so you may also tame it down. I got tagged by an 8 ft male on my calf and shin. Luckly it was just a nip. but that nip sliced open my calf pretty bad, and actually CUT into my shin bone. Not only is this monitor the longest but in my opinion the most intelligent. I have noticed that my female would pick up on my cleaning routine, and would strike out at random everytime I changed water. If you get these monitors I highly suggest you dont setup a set routine for cleaning/feeding. be carefull, and realize what you are getting is a endangered,amazing, highly dangerous animal..

Strike out at random every time you changed the water? I'm pretty un-knowledgeable about monitors but would imagine many know the difference between cleaning and feeding. And if a monitor was offended by one of your actions wouldn't it give some kind of signal of hissing/puffing/ or even tail whipping to get you away. Or are these guys just as sinister as everyone makes them out to be?

Actually planning attacks on humans? Wow... i think i want one... maybe in a few decades when i have the resources.
lol
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2.3 Bearded Dragons
1.0 Pastel Ball Pythons (NERD Line)
0.0.1 Water Monitors
1.1 Pastel Red Tailed boa Het. for Albino
1.1 Yellow Ackie Monitors
And Counting...

Hey here is the first thing. If you are living in an apartment and aren't looking torwards buying or even renting a house, large monitors shouldn't be in your mind. I am not one to tell others what to do but throw out some thoughts and hope you make a good decision. I keep croc monitors and they are very intelligent and top predatory lizards. Once you have spent time next to them and raised them you gain a new appreciation for them. They are a beautiful and awesome animal. They should be kept by experienced monitor keepers that have dealt with such creatures. Large monitors like crocs need a large cage and cleaning a croc cage is something unlike most monitor enclosures. Safety is huge in this process. I don't know where you plan to get this monitor but if it is Wild Caught and half way large you are asking for something you might not be ready for. Changing thier water can even become a task. These lizards have sharp teeth and large claws. A bite from one of these lizards will cost you some serious money. Not to mention the way things are going we don't need heat from the law makers trying to justify banning these large reptiles. I am honestly worried about the lizard and people making bad decisions and causing me and others to loose the animals we enjoy. Many states are jumping on the band wagon and banning pythons, large monitors, etc. I would just hold off if I were you until you have a better situation to care for this awesome monitor. They grow fast and are not your typical pet that you put in your lap and scratch behind the ears. Respect MUST be given to them and an understanding of where they are from and thier nature. I am trying to word this in a way not to down grade or scare people. I think they can use these comments to use against them. I don't want to loose anymore rights than we have already lost in this country. To sum up my ramblings... WAIT, time and experience will do nothing but help you out. Don't be in a hurry to get the most advanced monitor we can keep because they are cool! if you have any questions write me and I will try to help you with your decisions if I can.

Why are you getting this monitor when you for 1. Dont have a place yet
2. Dont know what to feed it 3.Dont know how to keep it ?

Sounds like your just doing it for "show" not a very good reason .. you will regret it once the novelty wears off and the responsibility sets in

Trust me

Tom
www.safaritom.com
Link

Hello to everyone
I am not getting this monitor for a good while; probably coming on a year now to make sure I have the room and know how to care for them. I actually just went to a local monitor enthusiast’s who keeps them he is a good friend of my dads, and he let me hold his female he has had her since she was 45 inches. She is still nippy and I got a bit of a nip but, I was wearing his gloves and they protected most of my hand, what I did feel was kind of like taking a steak knife and pushing it across my skin, some bleeding but I was ok.
Which is wear I would like to say that as dumb as this sounds the people at the local zoo here where a protective suit kind of like chain mail to protect them selves from there animals. Therefore, I am thinking before I even buy the monitor I am going to get butchers gloves and chain mail to keep him from ripping me apart.

In addition, I would actually like to know some info about these animals since my thread was about care could you tell me about the care.
Thanks you for all your inputs
Kirk

That is good to hear you are going to put it off. These monitors are awesome but you need time and experience with other monitors to learn the needs of them and thier personalities (the nature of the beast). Once you have had some other monitors, found a house, and studied up a little more, then think about it. Croc monitors I would never consider a true pet, ever. These lizards are straight out an experienced keepers animal. As far as getting chain mail and gloves I don't think they are all that good of an idea. You need to NOT get yourself in situations that you will come in contact like that. If you are that scared of them treat them as if they were a venomous reptile. Make a cage where you can do a shift change while you clean and water them. I just plain remove my Crocs and place them else where while I clean the cages. If you have one that is totally out of control a small stick will help guide them where you need them. These lizards are actually very smart. If you let them out they will come out to check things out and return to thier cage with no problems. I let mine out, clean the cage, and they return to it on thier own. These lizards are way beyond what you think of as a lizard being smart. Don't underestimate them! If you held one and payed any attention to its actions you could see it's eyes and notice it is constintly annalyzing everything around it. You can just tell it is always thinking. Well, that is enough for now. You made a good decision and don't ever act like they are a bad lizard. They are just different than what most people are used to. I love them and don't want them getting a bad wrap because people push the boundries with them and it ends up with them making the Croc monitor look bad because they were stupid or not paying attention. Look at snake bites (venomous). People always try to push the boundries like they are some kind of snake charmer. Play with fire, get burnt. Just use common sense and your experience to understand the animal and it's nature. This is why experience is the key factor to keeping certain reptiles, that and common sense! Well, best of luck and have fun!

Kirk,
Dont get discouraged,they will most likly always be availible ,whenever you are ready.

Gigantor
im not getting discouraged at all i know they will be around thats why im laying back for a little while ounce i move out into my own place and feel at home i will start saving up and i will deffinetly be buying a pair to start a small captive bred salvadorii project, if any one lives in canada and would like to know how much i will charge roughly 500-600 canadain with proof, wich up is here is very cheap.
to every one can we get back on the care track and can u send me so good care sheets and if you own them could u post pics please it would mean alot ( of the crocs and the cages)
thanks
kirk