Reptile & Amphibian Forums

My adult female Dum has always had a problem with losing head scales in particular. Should I be worried and is there anything I can do to stop her losing her scales? There is a white patch on the side of her head now next to her eye where a scale has fallen off. It doesn't happen with any of my other Dums.

All three of mine have had some scale loss on their heads. With mine it is 100% due to rubbing (usually in an attempt to escape their cages)! All of mine though have since healed, and it is difficult to tell there was an injury. Just wait for a couple of sheds. I own many other species of snakes, and have never seen this before personally, however several dumeril owners have complained of this, so I wonder if it is common with the species!
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Thanks,
Amy
www.myboids.4t.com
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2.17 Normal ball pythons
1.0 Pastel ball pythons
0.0.1 Sinaloan Milk Snake
0.0.1 Plains Garter
0.1 Normal Kenyan Sand Boa
2.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa
1.0 Mid-Baja Rosy Boa
0.1 Leucistic Texas Rat
1.2 Dumeril's Boa
My list is too long, so I'll stop here!

Here is a picture of one of my female dums after a shed (a month after the injury). My other female looks even better, as she has shed quite a few times since her injury.

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Thanks,
Amy
www.myboids.4t.com
----
2.17 Normal ball pythons
1.0 Pastel ball pythons
0.0.1 Sinaloan Milk Snake
0.0.1 Plains Garter
0.1 Normal Kenyan Sand Boa
2.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa
1.0 Mid-Baja Rosy Boa
0.1 Leucistic Texas Rat
1.2 Dumeril's Boa
My list is too long, so I'll stop here!

I have had this happen to my female ball python. She rubbed a few scales off her nose while trying to escape. My carpet python did the same and his scale got infected and he had to go to the vet. My vet told me that if they are able to reach the screen top well enough torub it with enough force to take off scales, they needed a bigger cage. I got bigger homes for them and they have not lost any more scales. I haven't had that issue with my dumerils though.

While my male bci did have a patch of scales missing from the bridge of his nose due to screen rubbing my dum has never had this happen...yet. As far as avoiding this in the future can you determine why the rubbing is happening in the first place? Are there multiple hides (cool side and warm side) so the snake feels secure? Any other snakes in the same tank that it's trying to get away from? Hungry and searching for food? These are the types of questions that came to mind. Sit back and evaluate the enclosure and the reason why the rubbing is occuring in the first place so you can try and stop it. I hope this helps.
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Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

I think mine are rather neurotic. They realized that they could escape through the sliding door, and now that it is locked, they still attempt to escape because they were able to before. As far as temps, hide spots, size of enclosure, even humidity...all is up to par! The only time there is another snake in the enclosure is when they are copulating!

As I mentioned before...I have talked to a few other people with this same problem. Two of them are also breeders who have had a lot of success with their dums. I don't know if it is a husbandry issue, as much as a psychological issue
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Thanks,
Amy
www.myboids.4t.com
----
2.17 Normal ball pythons
1.0 Pastel ball pythons
0.0.1 Sinaloan Milk Snake
0.0.1 Plains Garter
0.1 Normal Kenyan Sand Boa
2.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa
1.0 Mid-Baja Rosy Boa
0.1 Leucistic Texas Rat
1.2 Dumeril's Boa
My list is too long, so I'll stop here!

Oh jeez...I just admitted that my snakes have psychological issues! Should I bring in the pet psychic! I could here my male now...."I want out so bad...I have to see if those cockatiels taste like chicken"....
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Thanks,
Amy
www.myboids.4t.com
----
2.17 Normal ball pythons
1.0 Pastel ball pythons
0.0.1 Sinaloan Milk Snake
0.0.1 Plains Garter
0.1 Normal Kenyan Sand Boa
2.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa
1.0 Mid-Baja Rosy Boa
0.1 Leucistic Texas Rat
1.2 Dumeril's Boa
My list is too long, so I'll stop here!

LOL the pet psychic! There's a lot of "mysterious" things in this world I'm happy to "indulge in", ghosts, loch ness monster, bigfoot, even The Price is Right but I could never sit through one of her shows. Is she still on Animal Planet? No offense to anyone who enjoyed her show this is merely my opinion
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Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

Yeah, it seems to me retics are especially bad at rubbing their noses raw trying to escape or just being neurotic but whenever I see one it makes me cringe Based on your posts it's clear you've really got things covered in the husbandry/care end. My reply was really for the original poster to double check things on their end. But I don't doubt there could be pychological factors at play too
BTW, I really liked the enclosures you have for your dums. Are they custom made? I'm building a 4x2 enclosure for mine and would love to get some details on yours.
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Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

You are completely right, when an animal begins to act odd the first place to start is with husbandry! I agree that the initial poster should definetly analyze his enclosure for reasons for the snakes scale loss.

Yes the cages are custom made. My boyfriend made the cages, so I don't know all of the details. We used 1/4 inch plywood for the "box" and plexiglass with plastic tracking to make sliding doors. I didn't seal it, but used plastic cabinet liners to line the bottom to make it easy to clean. I would recommend sealing it, but we built the cage first, and couldn't use chemicals in the reptile room, so were stuck! I would put in some sort of latch to keep the doors from being pushed open by larger snakes...as that was a big problem for me. I'm sure you've seen this picture already if you have been flipping through the old posts, but here it is again:

We have holes drilled for the cords to the heat pads, but heat tape would work well also. We drilled two holes in the mortar tub (hidebox). One holds the water dish, and one is for entrance/exit. FYI the tall multi colored rack is an old rat rack!
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Thanks,
Amy
www.myboids.4t.com
----
2.17 Normal ball pythons
1.0 Pastel ball pythons
0.0.1 Sinaloan Milk Snake
0.0.1 Plains Garter
0.1 Normal Kenyan Sand Boa
2.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa
1.0 Mid-Baja Rosy Boa
0.1 Leucistic Texas Rat
1.2 Dumeril's Boa
My list is too long, so I'll stop here!

Here are a couple of pics, so you can see how we locked the two by fours to create support, and attached the plywood to the frame.

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Thanks,
Amy
www.myboids.4t.com
----
2.17 Normal ball pythons
1.0 Pastel ball pythons
0.0.1 Sinaloan Milk Snake
0.0.1 Plains Garter
0.1 Normal Kenyan Sand Boa
2.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa
1.0 Mid-Baja Rosy Boa
0.1 Leucistic Texas Rat
1.2 Dumeril's Boa
My list is too long, so I'll stop here!

Nice job on the enclosures! I wondered about the strength of using 1/4" ply but I see from your other post you did a nice job using 2x4s for a reinforced frame. Makes sense. I'm using 3/4" ply but boy is it heavy!!!!! What size are they? lxdxh?

Yeah I've heard others use contact paper and such for "water proofing" the wood surface with good results. I'm testing a floor paint that is water based, low odor and able to handle traffic. We'll see how that works. It was pretty expensive but recommended by some guys on the cage forum.

How do you work the heat pads? Do you attach them under the wood floor? Between the floor and the plastic liners? I'm thinking about radiant heat panels for heat in my wood enclosures.

My dum uses a x-large cat pan with a large "mouse hole" cut in the side. Often, he sticks his head out of the hole and as it rests on the bedding he looks like a puppy dog peering out of his dog house. I think I have a pic of him doing this. I'll have to dig it up. It's too cute.

Yeah I noticed the rodent rack right away. I have 35 snakes so began breeding rats to cut down on my feeder costs a couple of years ago Plus I get the piece of mind my rodents are fed quality food and kept in clean tubs. Nothing but the best for my snakes
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Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

I bred large amounts of rats for many years until recently I cut back. We moved to a new place, and the rat smell begin to take over! I was cleaning cages every day, and still couldn't keep a fresh smell(even when I moved the rats to the heated garage)!

I'll have to ask about the cage specifics, as the most I did was pay for the pieces at the home depot!
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Thanks,
Amy
www.myboids.4t.com
----
1.14 Normal ball pythons
1.0 Pastel ball pythons
0.0.1 Sinaloan Milk Snake
0.0.1 Plains Garter
0.1 Normal Kenyan Sand Boa
2.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa
1.0 Mid-Baja Rosy Boa
0.1 Leucistic Texas Rat
1.2 Dumeril's Boa
My list is too long, so I'll stop here!

LOL...yeah I'm pretty neurotic about the smell too and it's a tough job keeping up, nearly impossible! That's the biggest drawback of raising your own food.
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Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

Just to chime in,

I won't re-write the book or anything, but at the beginning of February, there was a thread where I described a lot of different things about building & designing your own cages, & what materials I have used with success. Granted, the thread this was in was generated around a lot of husbandry concerns, but I went into a lot of detail about cage building, so look at the multiple entries I made, and see what you think. Copy and paste the following URL to get to the thread:

http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1245324,1245453

Good luck!

~Rebecca
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0.1 Dumeril's Boa '04 (Courtney)
1.2 Ball Pythons
[1.0 '05 Orange Hypo (Specter)]
[0.1 '05 Het Orange Hypo (Sylvia)]
[0.1 '03 Normal (Sue)]
0.2 American Pit Bull Terriers (40lb darling lap dogs:Brandy&Mara)

Thanks a lot Rebecca, I'll check it out later tonight!
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Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net